Originally posted by NemeBro
My answer: if Whis is immune to time stop, it isn't due to speed. There is an argument that Whis operates outside the realm of time because he has some measure of control over it, but there's no objective evidence he would be immune.
If someone is FTL, time stop wouldn't be an issue...at all, and Whis is MUCH FTL.
You would need to be moving at FTL in order to be invincible to time related issues. If you are not moving at speeds FTL, you will be subject to the laws regarding time and space, even if your are capable of bypassing them.
If a time stop were to occur, you would need to be already beyond time to avoid it. The funny thing is, if you moved away from your opponent at vastly FTL speeds, and returned to them, 10 or so minutes later, they may would have already died of old age by the time you returned.
It should be noted that when moving at FTL, time is not slowed down, time simply is not happening, for you anyway. e.
Originally posted by carver9
Not my theory bro. Time is nothing to someone that moves at those levels. FTL speeds isn't something that needs to be activated. It is always there.
1. If it is not just your theory, show me the definitive scientific proof.
2. I never said anything about "activating". An object is either moving at FTL speed when time is stopped, or it isn't.
If it isn't, it needs to accelerate to FTL speed in order to be unaffected by the timestop (according to this theory). But of course if time is stopped and it is not already at FTL speed, then it cannot accelerate to FTL speed. This is not hard to understand.
People use physics and other fields of mathematics to gauge and calculate feats, you can't turn off the tools you use to make imaginary fights and its consequences to suit an imaginary outcome you favor. Not unless there is a universal agreement on when everyone should stop using the truth.
Honestly, what is the point of bringing up FTL if it just means very fast and not actually faster than light? Moving outside of time is its main feature.
Using "FTL" as a means to quantify the speed at which they are moving is one thing. Arguing that the Theory of Relativity applies to said characters is another animal entirely. This is fiction.
Heck, the fact that characters/objects with mass can reach, and even exceed c, already shatters RW physics as we know it... So stop acting like they are still bound by these parameters. 🙂
The thing is though, the Theory of Relativity isn't a separate thing. It is an an inextricable part of that thing.
And stop what? I am not arguing that physics should always apply, I'm not sure where you got that from. Since Whis is a fictional character, I am certain lesser physics breaking repercussions might not apply to him, but at the same time, Whis is also a God-like being.
Your suspense of all meaningful logic in all cases is ridiculous and plagues these corners of the internet. If Whis were fighting a peer of his caliber, I could understand the lapse in logic, but here, he's fighting Guldo. Both characters can ignore the same repercussions for the same powers based on what? Why is Guldo able to trap an FTL object in a time stop? Why? If you're going to simply pretend truth and logic aren't a thing, at least do so in the bounds of reason. This is not reasonable, it's Guldo VS Whis.
Originally posted by U need LeonardThis is fiction, so no, it doesn't have to be this way.
The thing is though, the Theory of Relativity isn't a separate thing. It is an an inextricable part of that thing.
You're having a hard time grasping this concept, it seems.
Originally posted by U need LeonardRW physics clearly do not apply to these characters--this is evident by the simple fact that Whis(and Beerus) can move at speeds well above c under their own power. Whis can also rewind time(which RW physics certainly do not account for), etc. etc. etc.
Your suspense of all meaningful logic in all cases is ridiculous and plagues these corners of the internet. If Whis were fighting a peer of his caliber, I could understand the lapse in logic, but here, he's fighting Guldo. Both characters can ignore the same repercussions for the same powers based on what? Why is Guldo able to trap an FTL object in a time stop? Why?
The burden of proof falls entirely on you to prove why relativity/physics do apply to these fictional beings. 🙂
Originally posted by carver9
Remember when Spectrum walked through time stop because it didn't affect her due to being a light speed character?
No
Originally posted by carver9
Whis is MUCH faster than light.
I was going to say something like this but Placidity already did such a fine job:
Originally posted by Placidity
An object is either moving at FTL speed when time is stopped, or it isn't.If it isn't, it needs to accelerate to FTL speed in order to be unaffected by the timestop (according to this theory). But of course if time is stopped and it is not already at FTL speed, then it cannot accelerate to FTL speed. This is not hard to understand.
Originally posted by Galan007
This is fiction, so no, it doesn't have to be this way.
Based on what? That seems like a thing that's better left to the OP, not you.
Originally posted by Galan007
RW physics clearly do not apply to these characters--this is evident by the simple fact that Whis(and Beerus) can move at speeds well above c under their own power. Whis can also rewind time(which RW physics certainly do not account for), etc. etc. etc.
Whis and Beerus are Gods and God-like in their own universe, the omission of all logic is reasonable.
Originally posted by Galan007
The burden of proof falls entirely on you to prove why relativity/physics do apply to these fictional beings. 🙂
Guldo stood on a rock and it broke from his weight, some degree of our universal laws applies to Guldo. There is no 'Reason' in Guldo's time stop being powerful enough to impede a God-like being while moving at FTL speeds. I'm not saying that RL should always be applied to fictional fights, I'm just saying to suspend logic with some degree rationale. To break physics in the way you described requires some showing of tremendous power, even within DB.
Originally posted by U need LeonardThis is not relativity, lol.
Guldo stood on a rock and it broke from his weight, some degree of our universal laws applies to Guldo.
The concept that time would not apply to Whis while he is traveling FTL is dependent on relativity being applicable to him... Which is silly when we consider that he already shatters relativity. ie. Whis has mass. Einstein's theory forbids an object with mass from reaching/exceeding c. Despite this, Whis(and Beerus) can still travel FTL. Where is this relativity that people are clinging to? Or are you only selecting certain parts of the theory that fit best with your arguments?
I guess my point is that trying to confine fictional characters to a Theory they clearly supersede is... Silly, to say the least.
Originally posted by U need LeonardI never said physics does not occur in fiction. I am simply commenting on the physics being used in this particular thread as a means of limiting Guldo's ability. It's nonsense, really.
You are thinking of physics as some separate thing that never occurs in fiction, You are wrong, it occurs all the time...it's how stuff happens.
It cannot be proven one way or the other, yet you are acting like it is incontrovertible fact "cuz real world says so." Again, it's just silly. IMO.
Originally posted by Galan007You do understand that all laws coincide, with relativity right? You can't have one without the other. If you are abiding by the laws of gravity and motion, you are also doing the same for relativity.
This is not relativity, lol.
Again, it's not a separate thing. You have to understand this.
Originally posted by Galan007
The concept that time would not apply to Whis while he is traveling FTL is dependent on relativity being applicable to him... Which is silly when we consider that relativity already does not apply to him. ie. Whis has mass. Einstein's theory forbids an object with mass from reaching/exceeding c. Despite this, Whis(and Beerus) can still travel FTL. Where is this relativity that people are clinging to? Or are you only selecting certain parts of the theory that fit best with your arguments?I guess my point is that trying to confine fictional characters to a Theory they clearly supersede is... Silly, to say the least.
Whis is a very powerful God-like entity with God-like powers. Guldo is not. Use 'some' reason
Originally posted by Galan007
I never said physics does not occur in fiction. I am simply commenting on the physics being used in this particular thread as a means of limiting Guldo. It's nonsense, really.
It is a 'Fact' that moving at FTL speeds, which Whis can do, would side step anything dealing in time. I'm not limiting Guldo, I'm simply stating Whis is far more powerful than anything Guldo can do.
Originally posted by Galan007
It cannot be proven one way or the other, yet you are acting like it is incontrovertible fact... "Cuz real world says so." Again, it's just silly.
It's not "silly" to say that moving at FTL speeds puts the person at a place beyond time's reach, because it's true. And Whis can do it because he is very powerful. It's not silly, it's actually very cool. Time tricks would not work on a Whis in motion.
Originally posted by U need LeonardSwitching the goalposts, eh? Nice.
You do understand that all laws coincide, with relativity right? You can't have one without the other. If you are abiding by the laws of gravity and motion, you are also doing the same for relativity.
Anyway, a rock breaking because Guldo was standing on it =/= the theory of relativity as described in this thread, lol. 🙂
Originally posted by U need LeonardI don't think you actually understand what is being argued here. That's likely why you keep throwing around logical fallacies.
Again, it's not a separate thing. You have to understand this.
Originally posted by U need Leonard😂 You completely dodged this portion of my post... Which was probably a good idea, because it entirely defeated your line of reasoning.
Whis is a very powerful God-like entity with God-like powers. Guldo is not. Use 'some' reason
Anywho, you don't think Guldo's ability to stop time is a 'God-like power'..? Hmm, interesting. 🙂
Originally posted by U need LeonardBased on what in-universe evidence?
Time tricks would not work on a Whis in motion.