Could a force user become as powerful as the celestials or the Ones?

My shirts ripped, but most of it is intact.

Sidious tore the fabric of reality too. He wasn't a billion times everyone else.

Well I’ve never said that. I’ve said they are universal beings and they are. They literally preside over the balance of the universe.

The Force existed before them and continued to exist after them as well. Don't see how the entire aura of the alignments flow through them.

I think it’s clear that these characters aren’t meant to physically exist and that it’s meant to be basically a dream sequence but FotJ really ****ed that up.

Luke surmises that the Force, or at least reality, remains intact largely because of the Jedi and the Sith taking the place of the Ones, so that really doesn't help your point, Sinious.

Originally posted by Sinious
The Force existed before them and continued to exist after them as well. Don't see how the entire aura of the alignments flow through them.

Well they don't exist in the temporal plane so time is sorta irrelevant. With that said, Qui-Gon straight up says the Force of the universe flows through Mortis. And they preside and rule Mortis... Hence my statement.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Luke surmises that the Force, or at least reality, remains intact largely because of the Jedi and the Sith taking the place of the Ones, so that really doesn't help your point, Sinious.

Originally posted by ares834
Well they don't exist in the temporal plane so time is sorta irrelevant. With that said, Qui-Gon straight up says the Force of the universe flows through Mortis. And they preside and rule Mortis... Hence my statement.

Originally posted by Sinious
What? Weren't they born like a million years before PT? I'm sure the Force is older than they are.

Okay? What does this have to do with what I said?

My earlier point was that force existed before them.

Get back to my first point though, which is they're not millions of times more powerful than Abeloth and Abeloth who again isn't THAT much above Luke. And again, their showings suggest that they're very much comparable to Jedi/Sith even though they are superior in most things.

Which is irrelevant to anything I've said...

And I was refuting your bogus claim that they aren’t universal. I also don’t know about the math, but they are significantly more powerful than any Jedi or Sith bar Mortiskin.

Originally posted by ares834
He pretty much does. He says "that they could tear the very fabric of our universe."

👆

Refuting it how? Abeloth by itself is enough proof. The original argument was that if any force user could pull off Vitiate's failed ritual, they would become an entity that has consumed the energy of the entire galaxy. In fact, in protag's vision, Vitiate even consumes the stars.

Since he is a Luke/Sidious tier force user at his point, imagine how much more powerful he would become by consuming the galaxy? Even just %20 of his current power relies on Natemha, this would still mean that he would become millions of times more powerful. Are you saying that, Sidious/Luke/Yoda/Ahsoka/Bandon/whoever x millions is still inferior to beings(The Ones) who are comparable to a being(Abeloth) who is a couple times more powerful than Luke? 😬

Oh, so this was all about you wanking Vitiate once more.

LOL good job accusing instead of coming up with an actual argument. 👆

This seems to be the case in almost every thread on KMC.

Why would I refute your argument when it's a giant ass strawman? I've already stated I'm not arguing against the notion that they aren't millions of times more powerful than any other force user. What I am arguing against is your notion that they are't considered universal. They are.

That these beings are maintaining the balance of the force is pretty much what the entire trilogy of episodes is about....

I also like how we know exactly how powerful Vitiate would become with a ritual he hypothetically would have performed.

@ Ares

So you're arguing something completely irrelevant to the thread. I never claimed that they're not maintaining the balance in this sense. This thread is about whether someone can surpass them in power or not and since Neph gave the ritual as an example which should logically make any character thousands of times more powerful than they were before, they would be able to surpass them.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
I also like how we know exactly how powerful Vitiate would become with a ritual he hypothetically would have performed.

Logically speaking something has to be possible for it to be relevant to this thread. And you just said you didn't think it was possible. I think you see where I'm going with this.

Pretty sure sources stated that it would have succeeded and if it had he would have been the strongest force user in history.

Pretty sure sources also already claim he is.

Doubt it. Vitiate would have likely been the closest if his Galaxy spanning ritual succeeded.