TCW Darth Maul/ROTS Kenoi vs. ROTS Grievous/Quinlan Vos

Originally posted by |King Joker|
I don't really see how that implies Dooku underestimated him. I mean, before they were just talking about how much stronger Vos has gotten:

"Dooku chuckled, looking the other man up and down appraisingly. "You seem...unburdened. I sense a greater strength in you."
"I agree," Vos said. "I am calmer. More focused. Stronger than before." In the blink of an eye, he seized and activated his lightsaber. Its green glow bathed his face as he smiled. "Strong enough to kill you."

Dooku himself sensed how strong Vos had become, and was quite intent on killing him. Doesn't make sense in that context why he would be underestimating Vos.

Dooku stomped Vos like 3 times, and remarks that he will again. If that's not underestimating then Idk what is.
There's also the fact that mid duel Vos disarmed Dooku, yet he didn't give a ****. If Dooku thinks Vos is a legit threat and gets disarmed he certainly would show some reaction.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Point me where every Soresu user is so fast that Dooku doesn't even dare to strike them.

Either Kenobi was a better duelist or he was faster than Dooku. Take your pick.

So much wrong with this statement.

Firstly is there even a description of Dooku fighting another Soresu user?

Second did I say EVERY Soresu user has a faster defense than Dooku would dare to strike against?

Kenobi had a faster Saber Defense than Dooku. That's it. Doesn't mean he generally moves, leaps, dodges, punches or kicks as fast as Dooku, which he clearly doesn't as shown by visual evidence (Dooku attacking before Kenobi can react) and as confirmed in the Rise and Fall of Darth Vader.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan Your ridiculous remarks are noted, now try to actually explain your way out of the text explicitly saying Kenobi was so fast that he seemed to vanish to Dooku.[B]

Hyperbole.

Which is really the only logical explanation for why (Invisible Kenobi) didn't stomp Dooku there and then.

You completely miss the point of that statement, which wasn't to say that Kenobi is faster than Dooku LMAO, but simply to say Dooku underestimated Kenobi.

End of.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
[B]Yeah because you have to be mandatorily faster to fight to opponents and other advantages don't mean shit. Like better precog, better movement, more skilled etc. 🙄

Well you certainly can't be Slower than your opponents to fight off against 2 of them simultaneously, armed with the same weapon.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
[B]We are in the EU forum though, if you don't want to discuss EU novels you can go to the movie forums...

EU expands on the movies. If you want to ignore the movies there's no point in discussing SW tbh.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
[B]And he is faster and stronger than Kenobi, not to mention that's Kenobi's style, not Dooku's. Your point?

Oh wait, so now Anakin's faster than Kenobi whose faster than Dooku? LMAO

It's a wonder Dooku lasted 5 seconds against 2 opponents both faster than him.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
[B]And the only way to outfight someone is being faster 🙄

No but when you continually hit your opponent without them seeing it coming, and when you're the one outnumbered, then yeah you're faster.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
[B]>Uses Pre-prime Kenobi
>Ignores novel

👆

Proof Kenobi only reached his prime when ROTS begins?

I've already explained the intent of the novel which you seemed to have completely missed.

And if anyone's brushing aside sources it's you. So far you're ignoring TCW and the Rise and Fall of Darth Vader.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
[B]

I take it that means you have no proof whatsoever that TCW S5/S6 Kenobi hadn't already reached his peak, so you thought best thing is to post a stupid face.

Got it 👆

You have some serious misconceptions about speed.

And you have seriously misinterpreted the ROTS Novel version of events.

Stomped? Three times? They only fought once prior to their final duel, and it wasn't really a stomp.

"Enraged, Vos charged Dooku from behind. The Sith Lord whirled, catching Vos's strike with his own weapon and twisting his wrist to parry. Vos countered with a feint that caused Dooku's chest to be unguarded, and dived for the kill. Dooku twisted out of the lightsaber's path, but for the first time since the fight began, Ventress saw awkwardness.
"You fight well for a Jedi, Vos," Dooku said.

Admittedly, most of the fight after Dooku Force-throws Quinlan is Dooku trolling, until Quinlan "reached for the final layer of darkness that had slumbered inside him". After that, though, Quinlan disarms him. Also, Dooku saying "this time I shall make certain to swat this pesky fly!” means that he is going to make sure Vos dies once and for all. Not that he is going to stomp him.

Your hatred has made you strong, Joker. Kill him. Kill him now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkIJsnLBA4c

I'm not evil like you, Freshest.

You won't be the first I've twisted and bent to my will. I will see you break.

I'm incorruptible.

When Ahsoka lies crushed and dead on the floor, I will make gifs of every second. She will suffer, and I will make you suffer. As none have suffered before you.

We both know Ahsoka is going to cut his arms off and escape, Freshest. Deal with it. excellent

Vader doesn't need arms to turn Ahsoka into paste. uhuh

Originally posted by Syndicate
Maul or Kenobi can take on Grievous and stalemate/beat him.

Unfortunately DD Vos should be fast enough to beat both of them given that he oupaced Dooku.

If it's Kenobi vs Grievous and Maul vs DD Vos then that's Team 1's best bet.

Maul's own speed feats might allow him to keep up with Vos long enough for Kenobi to defeat Grievous but it would be a near thing.

I'd favor team 2 for a majority.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Nah Dooku's faster than Kenobi.

It was Vos's very nature was unpredictable, not his Saber form. There's a difference.

So it's not like anyone who uses Juyo is going to beat Dooku because of it's "unpredictability".

what is vos saber form in the new canon? still ataru or vaapad?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
^ None of that makes Kenobi faster than Dooku. It just shows he has a faster defense, which is the whole point of Soresu.

Also him jumping over Dooku doesn't mean much when it was still Dooku who was fast enough to fight off both Kenobi and Skywalker at once and still catch them both off guard.

In fact the Rise and Fall of Darth Vader confirms Dooku beat Kenobi in ROTS because he moved faster than him.

Their last fight in TCW also portrays Dooku as clearly faster and more skilled.

Obi-Wan understood immediately, even before he noted Anakin’s blue blade coming up and over the other way-the green blade would push the Count’s lightsaber out of the way, clearing the path for the victorious strike!

But Dooku retracted impossibly fast, and Anakin’s down-cutting green blade hit nothing but air.

Source: Attack of the Clones

Kenobi reached the top of the stairs and a single slash of his lightsaber dismantled both droids. Before their pieces could even hit the floor Dooku was in motion, landing a spinning side-stamp that folded Skywalker in half; he used his last burst of dark power to continue his spin into a blindingly fast wheel-kick that brought his heel against the point of Kenobi's chin with a crack like the report of a huge-bore slugthrower, knocking the Jedi Master back down the stairs. Sounded like he'd broken his neck. Wouldn't that be lovely?

Source: Revenge of the Sith

The two droids fired at Obi-Wan, but he batted their fired energy bolts back at them and cut them down as he moved fast for Dooku. Unfortunately, Dooku moved faster, extending his left hand toward Obi-Wan as he used the Force to lift the Jedi off his feet while at the same time constricting his throat.

Source: The Rise and Fall of Darth Vader

As Obi-Wan gave ground, Dooku quickened the pace. His every move was economical and elegant; his lightsaber seemed to be everywhere. Obi-Wan remembered Jocasta Nu telling him, With a lightsaber, in the old style of fencing, he had no match. Now he could see what she meant. Unfortunately.

Source: Attack of the Clones Junior Novelization

The Count smiled slightly - Obi-Wan was not sure at whom - and his blade flicked out almost too fast to see. Anakin screamed as his right arm dropped to the floor, cut off at the elbow.

Source: Attack of the Clones Junior Novelization

I believe this is what you were talking about DP.

Apologies if I've been misinformed but I was told that Vos had outpaced Dooku rather then simply being unpredictable and Dooku underestimating him.

Originally posted by |King Joker|
I don't really see how that implies Dooku underestimated him. I mean, before they were just talking about how much stronger Vos has gotten:

"Dooku chuckled, looking the other man up and down appraisingly. "You seem...unburdened. I sense a greater strength in you."
"I agree," Vos said. "I am calmer. More focused. Stronger than before." In the blink of an eye, he seized and activated his lightsaber. Its green glow bathed his face as he smiled. "Strong enough to kill you."

Dooku himself sensed how strong Vos had become, and was quite intent on killing him. Doesn't make sense in that context why he would be underestimating Vos.

hard to imagine surfer dude from hunt for ziro saying this 😂 😆 😂 😆

Originally posted by Syndicate
Apologies if I've been misinformed but I was told that Vos had outpaced Dooku rather then simply being unpredictable and Dooku underestimating him.

nah he outpaced dooku