Vandal Savage vs Ozymandias

Originally posted by FrothByte
This is what I've been trying to say all along. Ozy being able to outmaneuver Manhattan was due to a lot of special circumstances that are not applicable in this match.

For one, Manhattan didn't even know someone was out to get him, let alone that that someone was Ozy. Savage specifically knows he's going against Ozy.

Let me put it to you this way, and maybe you'll get what I'm saying. If you have them switch places and see if Vandal could do what OZY did... I would say absolutely not. That's the difference here imo.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Let me put it to you this way, and maybe you'll get what I'm saying. If you have them switch places and see if Vandal could do what OZY did... I would say absolutely not. That's the difference here imo.

I would say he absolutely could. As long as he has the same amount of prep that VS did, as long as VS had known Manhattan and rest of the team for as long as Ozy did, as long as VS has the exact same relationship with the rest of the team as Ozy did, and as long as he had the same resources as Ozy did.

Now let me ask you, if Ozy swapped places with VS, could you see Ozy defeating Arrow, Flash, team Arrow, Hawkgirl and Hawkman all at the same time?

That's the thing though.. part of what makes Ozy's prep for good is that he DOES have access to all that money. So why would VS have access to the same money? Same thing when they fight here... VS doesn't get access to his money and resources, he can only use his own. So I say again, VS would NOT be able to replicate what OZY did. What's more, I still don't think he could regardless

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That's the thing though.. part of what makes Ozy's prep for good is that he DOES have access to all that money. So why would VS have access to the same money? Same thing when they fight here... VS doesn't get access to his money and resources, he can only use his own. So I say again, VS would NOT be able to replicate what OZY did. What's more, I still don't think he could regardless

Meh doesn't matter. Vandal Savage has quite a bit of resources himself (or at least comicbook version does anyway). So like I said, as long as he gets the same amount of prep for Manhattan and as long as he gets the same type of relationship with the Watchmen team I don't see why he couldn't do the same.

Now to my question. Do you think Ozy could have replicated what VS did on Flash/Arrow crossover? Do you think he could have taken an arrow to the chest and just plucked it out like it was nothing?

Ummm tough to say... If Ozy can catch a bullet with his teeth... I would worry about any Arrow hitting him. Let alone killing him. I think he'd take an arrow just fine. My bigger concern would be going h2h with some of the people Vandal did, especially in a group setting. That I'm not sure he could replicate. The arrow though, I'm not concerned about.

He didn't catch a bullet with his teeth. He caught a bullet from a gun that had been aimed at him for about 10-15 seconds and he had plenty of time to guess where it'd go. And Vandal is actually faster than Ozy on feats considering he had no problem fighting Flash, plus he blocked those arrows easy and only got hit to prove a point.

Ozy wouldn't be able to block arrows, bullets, and everything else coming from that massive team fighting him. Savage did though.

Originally posted by KingD19
He didn't catch a bullet with his teeth. He caught a bullet from a gun that had been aimed at him for about 10-15 seconds and he had plenty of time to guess where it'd go. And Vandal is actually faster than Ozy on feats considering he had no problem fighting Flash, plus he blocked those arrows easy and only got hit to prove a point.

Ozy wouldn't be able to block arrows, bullets, and everything else coming from that massive team fighting him. Savage did though.

And using that Flash logic, literally anyone who has ever punched the Flash should be faster than Ozy, and that includes Arrow, Trickster, and every other random thug to get a hit (there's been many). Doesn't that sound a bit off to you? One second the new thug of the week can beat the shit of of him. The next, he's taking out the entire League of Assassins singlehandedly. Flash constantly jobs. That doesn't mean his villains all have super speed. PIS and CIS off, VS and all those other Rogues shouldn't last 10 seconds against Barry.

And Ozy being able to replicate what VS did is a moot point (though I think he would, if not for Flash; unless Flash wants to job to him to anyway). People are arguing their prep feats. Him beating the heroes is a cool physical feat, but not much in the way of prep (its also insane BS, like Deathstroke beating the Justice League; if anything, it's a low showing for the heroes).

I'm one of the main people who complains about Flash getting tagged by everyone, as it shouldn't happen, but it does. But Vandal fought off that entire room without barely getting touched. Apparently they've made this version a lot more uber than the comic. And he's one of the few after his showings I can see actually being fast enough to tag Barry. Maybe the Hawk's energy boosts him beyond normal as well as making him immortal.

Now the Bullet feat from OZY was a timed dodged thing.... JESUS... The lowballing begins.

It needs to be said Vandal from the show isn't just an immortal. He grows more powerful each time he kills Hawkman and his wife, which he has done over 200 times. Which is why he is able to fight off the heroes in the way he did.

Originally posted by Surtur
It needs to be said Vandal from the show isn't just an immortal. He grows more powerful each time he kills Hawkman and his wife, which he has done over 200 times. Which is why he is able to fight off the heroes in the way he did.

That's what it was. Couldn't remember the exact reason he was so baws.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Now the Bullet feat from OZY was a timed dodged thing.... JESUS... The lowballing begins.

👆

Originally posted by Arachnid1
And using that Flash logic, literally anyone who has ever punched the Flash should be faster than Ozy, and that includes Arrow, Trickster, and every other random thug to get a hit (there's been many). Doesn't that sound a bit off to you? One second the new thug of the week can beat the shit of of him. The next, he's taking out the entire League of Assassins singlehandedly. Flash constantly jobs. That doesn't mean his villains all have super speed. PIS and CIS off, VS and all those other Rogues shouldn't last 10 seconds against Barry.

Would just like to point out that Barry doesn't job anywhere nearly as often in season 2, at least not so far. The times he doesn't simply blitz people on the spot and end everything right there are usually plot related. The latest episode of The Flash is a perfect example.

So is this Vandal Savage vs Ozymandias or Vandal Savage vs Dr.Manhattan?

Manhattan

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
So is this Vandal Savage vs Ozymandias or Vandal Savage vs Dr.Manhattan?

Yeah, why are people including Manhattan here like he was a player?

So what is the overall thought on this? Ozy or Vandal wins?

No Manhatten is not a fighter but Ozy can use his tech.

If you're asking if Ozy has Manhattan assisting him with tech then he can probably win that scenario. But then what is more a win for Ozy and Doc, not just Ozy.

Yeah. Why not let Ozy have access to STAR Labs tech or Barry so he can just run back in time and let him try over?

So Ozy has access to outside tech and Vandal has access to... what?