Valkorion vs. 10 POD Trainee Banes

Originally posted by Sinious
The fact that Freshest still has to explain this is indeed annoying. I still want to see some showings from Bane.

Draw whatever conclusions you will from there, but 10 POD Bane's clearly far outstrip the forces Valklander hit with that wave (which wasn't an omnidirectional attack).

If we're actually discussing Bane as of getting stomped by Sirak, then he gets stomped.

Yeah trainee Bane gets blown back and stomped, I still feel POD Banes would also get blown back however, it really doesn't take much to knock someone of their feet.

I feel like Bane's Force defenses are certainly good enough to not be blown back. No way is Valkorion powerful enough to break through the force barriers of 10 Darth Bane's at once, thats insane.

He doesn't need to break through their Force barriers to knock them off the ground, just buffet them with sufficient kinetic force.

Unless they are able to erect a counter force in time, they'd be blown back, even if they are able to emerge unscathed.

I mean let's not forget it only took a combined attack from Kanan & Ezra to knock Vader on his ass.

So a combined force attack from 10 POD Bane's can knock Valkorion on his ass by that logic? The gap between POD Bane and Valk isn't any bigger than the gap between Kanan and Ezra, and there's also 9 other POD Bane's rather than 1 Ezra.

Lel. This thread became enjoyable again.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
So a combined force attack from 10 POD Bane's can knock Valkorion on his ass by that logic? The gap between POD Bane and Valk isn't any bigger than the gap between Kanan and Ezra, and there's also 9 other POD Bane's rather than 1 Ezra.

Whether or not he'd be able to subsequently defeat them is another question, but he's not getting skewered.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
He doesn't need to break through their Force barriers to knock them off the ground, just buffet them with sufficient kinetic force.

Um, yes he does?

Like, blocking force attacks is what a barrier does?

thats why its called a barrier

:I

Not really, if you bash someone's shield with enough Force they will be staggered, despite said shield remaining in intact.

Likewise when an individual is Force pushed it doesn't mean their defenses have been shattered, just that the attack hasn't been entirely mitigated, otherwise anyone who can Force push someone should be able to ragdoll them too. But that's rarely the case.

So are you going to argue that the POD Banes can negate Valkorion's power entirely or what?

Originally posted by Beniboybling
[B]Or instead of making gross generalisations via considerably inaccurate comparisons between generating a Force wave and conjuring a frikken Force storm, or obliterating a planet, we can look at Valkorion, who at the high end is able to consume a planet in minutes.

Relative to that this isn't a "big force power" at all in comparison, and we have no basis to assume it will be slow.Yes, in the same way that it takes more time to drink juice through a straw.He didn't blow them away, he killed them. And they were spread across a wide area. Of course less exertion is required to knock some trainee Banes on their assess when Darth Malgus is blowing away four of the protagonists at once, with a push.

At the same time, we have not seen Valk do a force shockwave in the time required. It is merely speculation that he can do so fast enough, trying to guestimate how quick he could do it and still put sufficient power into the attack. It's basically a matter of faster person using a slower technique vs slower people using the fastest of techniques.

Now, I *do* think he could do a force push in that time pretty easily, since that's a faster move- but a force push is not 360, he'd only get some of them.

Regardless, Fresh is correct tbh. If you refuse Valkorion's help Lana is struck down instantly,

It's pretty fast, but it's still a mook with a big windup doing the attack remember, vs Bane only having to stab.

Bane is still faster than the attack shown.

Oh really now. When, where? I can't think of a single instance when someone has need time to conjure a barrier.

All force moves take a little time, and I never see anyone use it in response to the quickest attacks.

Originally posted by Q99
At the same time, we have not seen Valk do a force shockwave in the time required. It is merely speculation that he can do so fast enough, trying to guestimate how quick he could do it and still put sufficient power into the attack. It's basically a matter of faster person using a slower technique vs slower people using the fastest of techniques.

Now, I *do* think he could do a force push in that time pretty easily, since that's a faster move- but a force push is not 360, he'd only get some of them.

It's not as if Force shockwaves are characteristically slow for example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj07qh51zPI&t=3m26s

And Valkorion is capable of unleashing immense amounts of power in an instant:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2g7BwwggxFI&t=20m52s

It's pretty fast, but it's still a mook with a big windup doing the attack remember, vs Bane only having to stab.

Bane is still faster than the attack shown.

Regardless you are still pretending as if this is Valkorion's top speed.

All force moves take a little time, and I never see anyone use it in response to the quickest attacks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ToztqqDcaY&t=3m34s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2g7BwwggxFI&t=20m33s

Tbh.

Why do you even keep responding? This debate is going in circles.

Seems to be that way. I'll consider this his last chance to see reason. 🙂

Originally posted by Q99
You do know we saw the wave on video, yes? We don't have to guess.

Valkorion was so fast that a large number of opponents (including Force-users) were unable to react to his moves and powers.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Content developers intend to show us events and moves on-screen. They will not demonstrate realistic speed-levels of Force-users, would they?

Valkorion was so fast that a large number of opponents (including Force-users) were unable to react to his moves and powers.

Only one in that video was even in melee range, the rest didn't have a chance to do anything but die to a shockwave. It's a very different situation from this one.

And other people *have* been able to react and fight with him, if at a disadvantage.

Beniboybling
Yeah it's called making logical inferences, kinda necessary when debating a speculative confrontation. Regardless, there is no reason to believe it will be slow, you are the one making baseless assumptions.

I'm not saying it's slow in any absolute sense, just slow-er to something that can be done very fast- and force powers are normally shown to be slower, and this force power in specific involved arm gestures and a visible collecting of power. That's not baseless, that's working off what we're given.

Face it- assuming it's faster than that is, itself, an assumption.

At best, we're in a situation where there's not really hard proof either way.

I provided plenty of hard proof in the above post my friend, you're just blatantly ignoring it now. 🙂

Now?

Once again, he can protect himself with a Force barrier and simply expand it and release a shockwave to initiate a proper attack. We've seen him protect himself by throwing up a protective Force shield instantaneously; which is all he needs to do here.