Valkorion vs Sovereign

Asking how Vitiate wins isn't a silly question, lmfao. Calling it silly is pretty much an admission that you've got nothing left. It's over, Legend. Just answer the question, or give up.

I one-shotted his argument and made him backtrack on page one, so he lost long before that.

LeGenDary logic: Palming lightsabers = tanking the epicenter of a 450 KT TNT blast.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
The Sanctuary of Nightmares appears to be some kind of constructed space that could well feature an artifice allowing the Dread Masters to teleport there,

Originally posted by Beniboybling
the circumstances of Revan's feat are unknown and Jadus did not teleport across such a distance we are discussing. So not really.

Dread Masters, Darth Jadus and Revan reveal that Teleportation is possible in corporeal form and it can be done quickly.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
I don't. Was Talzin able to buy herself time to teleport away from Sidious? No. And in the situation as far as power is concerned, Valkorion is far more outmatched.

However, there is an additional possibility: should Valkorion decide that the best course of action is to get inside the Sovereign instead of engaging it out in the open from the get-go, he should be able to pull if off before he is subjected to firepower.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
You haven't proven that, your just assuming it, and the fact that the story is still in progression only proves you do not have all the answers.

Don't you think he could kill Arcann during the moment of Arcann's vulnerability (i.e. lying unconscious on the ground)? Yes, he could.

But let us look at this matter from another angle: If you refuse to bend the knee (as the Outlander), Valkorion instructs Arcann to kill the Outlander. Now, does this imply that Valkorion could not kill the Outlander himself? He certainly could.

However, BioWare have a story to tell. And your stance is utterly flawed.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Fact is the last time Valkorion was destroyed he fell into a slumber, only achieving those feats on Ziost you refer to after recovering from his strength. And I have yet to see any proof that suggests this period of recuperation is no longer required.

However, loss of a Voice (alone) doesn't affects Valkorion to a significant extent. This is apparent from the fact that a Voice was downed on planet Voss and this loss had no detrimental effect on the well-being of Valkorion.

Ziost related developments are covered here: http://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/s_w_legend/blog/cataclysm-of-planet-ziost/105050/

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Assuming for a moment that that didn't happen inside his head, the Outlander is nowhere near as powerful as Sovereign. 😬

Originally posted by Beniboybling
You have comprehension issues?

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Selenial's summed this up rather aptly, evidently this is distinct from the illusions he projected before, as Valkorion and the Outlander are very much real, but the fact remains this is all happening inside the Outlander's head. Self evident from the fact that whenever Valkorion appears, including in this instance, the image becomes blurred and vision-like to signify its distinction from physical reality.

"I cannot stay to protect you any longer. There are matters to which I must attend... but I will leave you with a final token of my favor." (Valkorion)

Valkorion noticed that the Outlander was growing complacent with passage of time and needed a wake-up call because Valkorion won't babysit him for long.

The blurry effect is just game mechanics.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
So unless Valkorion can get inside Sovereign's head (he can't) I don't see him affecting him with his powers.

Of-course, Sovereign would attempt to combat Valkorion within but a vessel is most vulnerable from the inside. Its external defenses (no matter how good) are largely irrelevant in this scenario.

Originally posted by AncientPower
I one-shotted his argument and made him backtrack on page one, so he lost long before that.

LeGenDary logic: Palming lightsabers = tanking the epicenter of a 450 KT TNT blast.

Valkorion cannot hurt the Reapers because of their genetics.... 🙄

Sovereign would indoctrinate Valkorion because he indoctrinated some politicians. 🙄

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
There is an additional example to consider: Dread Masters Tyrans made extensive use of Teleportation during his confrontation with the Strike Team.

What kind of circumstances? Revan decided to Teleport himself to safety from the Foundry and I have provided visual confirmation of this action-sequence.

Dread Masters, Darth Jadus and Revan reveal that Teleportation is possible in corporeal form and it can be done quickly.

You are assuming a scenario in which Valkorion is actually caught in the blast. Assuming that Valkorion conjures a [B]Protection Bubble to shield himself from the firepower of Sovereign, it may buy him sufficient time to Teleport to safety before it is compromised.[/b]

And I doubt any defense he could erect would last long or at all against Sovereign.

However, there is an additional possibility: should Valkorion decide that the best course of action is to get inside the Sovereign instead of engaging it out in the open from the get-go, he should be able to pull if off before he is subjected to firepower.

Valkorion could one-shot Arcann: https://i.imgur.com/M5qzcrn.webm

Don't you think he could kill Arcann during the moment of Arcann's vulnerability (i.e. lying unconscious on the ground)? Yes, he could.

But let us look at this matter from another angle: If you refuse to bend the knee (as the Outlander), Valkorion instructs Arcann to kill the Outlander. Now, does this imply that Valkorion could not kill the Outlander himself? He certainly could.

However, BioWare have a story to tell. And your stance is utterly flawed.

And notice how I'm ignoring your "but PIS" arguments, because its an arbitrary cop-out.

Valkorion fell into slumber because disruption of his (ultimate) ritual backfired on him and his Voice was struck down on top of it. These setbacks, collectively, took a huge toll on him.

However, loss of a Voice (alone) doesn't affects Valkorion to a significant extent. This is apparent from the fact that a Voice was downed on planet Voss and this loss had no detrimental effect on the well-being of Valkorion.

Ziost related developments are covered here: http://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/s_w_legend/blog/cataclysm-of-planet-ziost/105050/

Nor does this answer the question of why it took 5 years for Valkorion to return.

My intention is not to compare the Outlander with Sovereign. Your argument was that Valkorion was restricted in the use of the Force during disembodied form and I provided evidence to the contrary.

If that was all in the Outlander's head, then how come he emerged stronger and more capable Force-user from the ordeal?

"I cannot stay to protect you any longer. There are matters to which I must attend... but I will leave you with a final token of my favor." (Valkorion)

Valkorion noticed that the Outlander was growing complacent with passage of time and needed a wake-up call because Valkorion won't babysit him for long.

The blurry effect is just game mechanics.

Valkorion would be capable of affecting machinery (e.g. he prevented a communication device from working in Chapter 12). However, my position is that Valkorion can Teleport himself into Sovereign and sabotage it from within.

Of-course, Sovereign would attempt to combat Valkorion within but a vessel is most vulnerable from the inside. Its external defenses (no matter how good) are largely irrelevant in this scenario.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You one-shotted jack here. You are coming up with more ridiculous assumptions by the hour.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Valk's defenses were potent enough to tank Lightsaber blows at point blank range. Want to argue potency of a Lightsaber now?

450 tons of TNT is going to do jack shit to a Force-user as powerful as Valkorion. The likes of Darth Vader, Darth Malgus, Arcann and Cade Skywalker have tanked extremely potent explosions.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Did you seriously just suggest Valkorion is surviving the equivalent of a nuclear explosion 50 times more powerful than the bomb that destroyed Hiroshima, hitting him at a fraction of the speed of light?

Your bias knows no bounds.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Did you just assume that Valkorion is a physical being? Your stupidity knows no bounds.

To refresh your memory: http://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/s_w_legend/blog/cheating-corporeal-death-and-abilities-outside-a-c/126610/

You made a ridiculous assertion that Valk can survive a blast from a Reaper Capital Ship's main cannon, when I exposed how stupid that claim was you backtracked.

Sovereign was powerful enough to annihilate the citadel fleet and would have likely stomped the shit out of the whole human fleet had Shepard not killed Saren. Sovereign wins hands down

Tbf the Citadel fleet isn't much by Star Wars standards. Every ship the citadel races ever built would collectively lose to a single star destroyer.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Tbf the Citadel fleet isn't much by Star Wars standards. Every ship the citadel races ever built would collectively lose to a single star destroyer.

👆

Aside from the Reapers and possibly the Collectors, Mass Effect military technology is vastly inferior to star wars tech.

It's legit retarded to think a star destroyer can solo ME.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Valkorion's ability to cheat death is all that matters in the end.

No matter how much fans fellate Sovereign, it cannot stop Valkorion.

On the other hand, Valkorion will eventually get to Sovereign.

Actually i just remembered that was a collector base, not a reaper.

Sovereign needed to he destroyed by the combined might of the Turian, Asari, Salarian and human forces to be completely destroyed

And it's suggested this was mostly due to Sovereign inhabiting Saren's body.

Valkorion losing once is enough, the scenario put before us suggests he is still in his "mortal coil" so to speak. So his mortal form will die again and again.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
It's legit retarded to think a star destroyer can solo ME.

If you look at the actual technical specifications? A dreadnought's mass driver cannon is like 35 kilotons. A single medium turbolaser from an Accalamator medium troop transport is almost ten millions times more energetic. Your gut feeling aside, there's nothing in Mass Effect that could conceivably scratch a shielded and operational Acclamator, like alone an ISD. 👆

The Reapers would do a lot more than a scratch.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
If you look at the actual technical specifications? A dreadnought's mass driver cannon is like 35 kilotons. A single medium turbolaser from an Accalamator medium troop transport is almost ten millions times more energetic. Your gut feeling aside, there's nothing in Mass Effect that could conceivably scratch a shielded and operational Acclamator, like alone an ISD. 👆

Originally posted by The Ellimist
If you look at the actual technical specifications? A dreadnought's mass driver cannon is like 35 kilotons. A single medium turbolaser from an Accalamator medium troop transport is almost ten millions times more energetic. Your gut feeling aside, there's nothing in Mass Effect that could conceivably scratch a shielded and operational Acclamator, like alone an ISD. 👆

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Continuous fire from all directions totes can't effect a ship, especially if the entire galaxy did it. That's just logic of the most retar...I mean, intelligent kind.

> ignores actual numbers
> makes vague appeal to personal incredulity

10/10, you're really a Star Wars legend. 👆

Originally posted by Beniboybling
But not over the distances being discussed.

Assume that a master of this talent is on a planet; he should be able to teleport himself into any location or man-made structure he wants to on the planet.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
The unknown ones? We don't know where Revan teleported to for one, and as in a near-death state, we don't know if this feat was a one-off/oneness accomplishment.

2. Revan also demonstrated Teleportation during his battle against a large Strike Team on Yavin 4.

Therefore, your argument is moot.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Over short distances and/or with a connection to the target.

And we are not discussing scientific methods of teleportation that may require some sort of connection to the destination; we are discussing magical abilities and there is no logic in them.

In this hypothetical contest, I am assuming that Valkorion makes visual contact with the Sovereign and should be able to figure out a way to get inside by virtue of Force sense and basic understanding of design of Starships. Teleportation talent sounds like a good plan.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
That would constiute getting caught in a blast, again Mother Talzin erected a "Protection Bubble" against Sidious, that didn't give her a means to escape. It stands to reason that in such a situation Valkorion couldn't afford to divert his power and attention without dropping his barrier and being destroyed, as was the case with Talzin.

2. Revan performed Teleportation while erecting a Protection Bubble.

Darth Jadus, Dread Master Tyrans, Revan and Mother Talzin have performed Teleportation (and/or similar acts) in extremely dire situations to escape death.

Valkorion doesn't needs to erect a shield and then Teleport. He should be able to perform this act in an instant.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
And I doubt any defense he could erect would last long or at all against Sovereign.

If one of the greatest threats to the entire galaxy could be defeated so easily, somebody would have attempted this strategy in a span of centuries. Don't you think?

Originally posted by Beniboybling
How? With no knowledge that his opponent even has insides he can teleport into?

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Cool, doesn't prove he can do it in non-corporeal form. Which is the point, we've no reason to assume he'd be stronger enough immediately after losing his form.

And notice how I'm ignoring your "but PIS" arguments, because its an arbitrary cop-out.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
You're not accounting for the fact that that all Valkorion's power was not stored in that Voice, that is not the case here.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Nor does this answer the question of why it took 5 years for Valkorion to return.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
I asked you what powers Valkorion had displayed in incoporeal form that could harm Sovereign, this was your reponse. I assume your inability to answer the question is a concession he has none, rendering your point rather moot.

Tell me what options he doesn't have at his disposal.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Because Valkorion invested him with his powers? Just because its happening in his head doesn't mean Valkorion can't effect tangible results.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Which are not arbitrary, this one being intended to indicate to the player the sequence is happening in his head.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Right, and as I said there is nothing stopping Sovereign diverting power from his external defenses to his internal ones, rending him just as invulnerable on the inside. 👆

Nothing implies that Sovereign can do that.

Originally posted by AncientPower
You made a ridiculous assertion that Valk can survive a blast from a Reaper Capital Ship's main cannon, when I exposed how stupid that claim was you backtracked.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Sovereign is a sentient AI, not a god.

Nothing implies that Sovereign can do that.

Seriously, just google.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
> ignores actual numbers
> makes vague appeal to personal incredulity

10/10, you're really a Star Wars legend. 👆