Tbh I believe if someone honestly cares which universe has a higher level of technology, like it's of any importance to him, it's the highest level of brain damage possible.
I appreciate if it's just done for the sport of debating, collecting info and assessing information to prove your point, for the intellectual exercise it's as good as anything, that's what I like SW debating for too.
But if you truly care about which tech in which separate universe is more powerful, you are beyond hope.
It's not like you're proving your favourite universe is better, SW, Star Trek, whatever. Creating something immensely powerful doesn't take the smallest, the smallest level of imagination. Making shit powerful like hell on an absurd scale is the contrary of being imaginative. Even Star Wars sometimes is on the edge of being cheap with overblown stuff, bunch of ultra-super weapons and ultra-powerful armies stomping ultra-powerful armies who stomped entire systems whose armies stomped another systems.
If Star Trek legitimately has more powerful tech, it's probably as boring and cheap, as all these guys capable of soloing half the Earth who are beneath 2000 even more powerful characters in Marvel and DC.
Passionate fans are always eager to prove their preference is superior. It's all an exercise in futility but to the fans who care it isn't. Trek at least tries to make logical sense more than the more fantastical Star Wars but in the end I think most appreciate the differences. I just find comparisons of any kind of what is better or more formidable to be fascinating so despite never seeing it ever play out it'd still fun to argue.
Just for reference, if somebody should still view this and somehow believe in Quanchis wilder theories:
We get glimpses of the Endor space battle from the Death Star in which the Executor is visible in the middle from 3:16 - 4:10 . You can see that it is hit by some rather serious enemy fire, which I will explain later. Here are just the stats from that scene (instances in which Executor is visible and hits on the ships shielding):
3:16 - 3:22 = 2 hits in 6 seconds (possible a third hit)
3:49 = 1 hit in 1 second
3:57 - 3:59 = 0 hits in 2 seconds
4:05 - 4:10 = 2 possible hits in 5 seconds
So in the relative short screen time of 14 seconds, the Executor is hit by massive enemy fire for 3 to 6 times. Going with the lower estimates, we can expect a hit on the Executor by heavy weapons every 5 seconds. And before somebody even tries to suggest something else: Those are explosion of weapon-fire as exploding Star Fighters (which is all there is except for the capital ships) would have been far smaller at that distance and none of the forces involved were close to the Death Star in order to have one exploding closer to the space station, leading to some false scaling here.
Now when I say heavy weapons, just have a look at the fireball we see here:
Close Up:
Going by the size of the Executor (19 kilometers length), that fireball is roughly 1.5 to 2 kilometers in diameter. Fortunately, we have detailed data for explosions (of nuclear weapons) in space right here, saying that the detonation of the TEAK Bomb (3.8 Megatons) did genereate a fireball that reached a 3.25 mile (about 5.2 kilometers) in diameter. That would lead to an estimate of 1.1 to 1.5 megatons for the explosion we see on screen. And the Executor was taking hits like that at least every five seconds and throughout the entire space battle. In case you are like Quanchi and can't grasp math: That kind of explosion would engulf ships like the Nu-Trek Enterprise completely.
Now, even assuming that all scenes shown in the movie between the start of the space battle and the destruction of the Executor ran parallel, the fight couldn't have lasted less than ten minutes. That would mean that, given the average time/hit rating seen above, the Executor would have taken about 120 hits of that order of magnitude, adding anything that was fired at it from the starfighters.
But that is still not everything, as Admiral Ackbar orders the entire Rebel fleet to focus fire on the Executor. And even if that lasts only for five seconds, going by the scene linked above again (watch 3:16 to 3:21), there are up to 4 of those heavy explosions happening per second in the spacebattle, with the Stardestroyers ordered not to return fire on the Rebellion's capital ships. So we just see the Rebels firing. Going from there, that means that specifically in its "final" moments, the Executor was probably target to a pretty huge amount of firepower.
For comparison, we may again have a look at Star Trek:
A single hit, from the Narada's weapons (note how the second torpedo actually misses the target entirely), that does generate a tiny explosion compared to the stuff hitting the Executuor in the ROTJ space battle, does structural damage to the Enterprise and takes down the ships shields to 32 percent. And that is some of the most "futuristic" tech the entire Star Trek universe has in its hands.
It's rather easy to imagine what one of those weapons from Star Wars, that apparently deliver energy that unloads in explosions a kilometer in diameter, would do to those shields and the ship. It's also rather easy to imagine, that Star Trek weapons with that tiny effects, won't do anything to Star Wars shielding, which tanks explosions a hundred or thousand times more powerful, a hundred times over before going down.
Originally posted by NaiThe desperation is getting palpable. Is this what you're reduced to ? Where has your pride gone you German boob.
Just for reference, if somebody should still view this and somehow believe in Quanchis wilder theories:We get glimpses of the Endor space battle from the Death Star in which the Executor is visible in the middle from 3:16 - 4:10 . You can see that it is hit by some rather serious enemy fire, which I will explain later. Here are just the stats from that scene (instances in which Executor is visible and hits on the ships shielding):
3:16 - 3:22 = 2 hits in 6 seconds (possible a third hit)
3:49 = 1 hit in 1 second
3:57 - 3:59 = 0 hits in 2 seconds
4:05 - 4:10 = 2 possible hits in 5 secondsSo in the relative short screen time of 14 seconds, the Executor is hit by massive enemy fire for 3 to 6 times. Going with the lower estimates, we can expect a hit on the Executor by heavy weapons every 5 seconds. And before somebody even tries to suggest something else: Those are explosion of weapon-fire as exploding Star Fighters (which is all there is except for the capital ships) would have been far smaller at that distance and none of the forces involved were close to the Death Star in order to have one exploding closer to the space station, leading to some false scaling here.
Now when I say heavy weapons, just have a look at the fireball we see here:
[img]http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb366/NaiFohl/ROTJ1]
Close Up:
[img]http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb366/NaiFohl/ROTJ2.jp
Going by the size of the Executor (19 kilometers length), that fireball is roughly 1.5 to 2 kilometers in diameter. Fortunately, we have detailed data for explosions (of nuclear weapons) in space right here, saying that the detonation of the TEAK Bomb (3.8 Megatons) did genereate a fireball that reached a 3.25 mile (about 5.2 kilometers) in diameter. That would lead to an estimate of 1.1 to 1.5 megatons for the explosion we see on screen. And the Executor was taking hits like that at least every five seconds and throughout the entire space battle. In case you are like Quanchi and can't grasp math: That kind of explosion would engulf ships like the Nu-Trek Enterprise completely.
Now, even assuming that all scenes shown in the movie between the start of the space battle and the destruction of the Executor ran parallel, the fight couldn't have lasted less than ten minutes. That would mean that, given the average time/hit rating seen above, the Executor would have taken about 120 hits of that order of magnitude, adding anything that was fired at it from the starfighters.
But that is still not everything, as Admiral Ackbar orders the entire Rebel fleet to focus fire on the Executor. And even if that lasts only for five seconds, going by the scene linked above again (watch 3:16 to 3:21), there are up to 4 of those heavy explosions happening per second in the spacebattle, with the Stardestroyers ordered not to return fire on the Rebellion's capital ships. So we just see the Rebels firing. Going from there, that means that specifically in its "final" moments, the Executor was probably target to a pretty huge amount of firepower.
For comparison, we may again have a look at Star Trek:
A single hit, from the Narada's weapons (note how the second torpedo actually misses the target entirely), that does generate a tiny explosion compared to the stuff hitting the Executuor in the ROTJ space battle, does structural damage to the Enterprise and takes down the ships shields to 32 percent. And that is some of the most "futuristic" tech the entire Star Trek universe has in its hands.
It's rather easy to imagine what one of those weapons from Star Wars, that apparently deliver energy that unloads in explosions a kilometer in diameter, would do to those shields and the ship. It's also rather easy to imagine, that Star Trek weapons with that tiny effects, won't do anything to Star Wars shielding, which tanks explosions a hundred or thousand times more powerful, a hundred times over before going down.
Let's cover the irrelevant information and your speculators numbers. Bias makes people go to extreme levels to exaggerate their fanboyism. We don't see the definition or a clear cut picture of what those random dots actually are. They could be tie fighters or rebels ships being destroyed. What's more is none of this matters as the deflector shields are still active thus providing adequate shielding. We see the relevant shots that destroy the bridge deflector shields. We see this occur in real time and how susceptible the executor is once these shields are rendered moot like this argument. So the rest is speculating on irrelevant information since we see the power that is required to destroy the deflector shields leaving this huge target susceptible to enemy fire.
If you can't support your information with anything official it's just speculation. Debate based off facts not guesses. That isn't proven and none of this suggests it would engulf or completely destroy the Trek ships especially the more formidable ones such as the Narada or the Vengeance. Keep dreaming. The point here is attacking key critical areas such as the deflector shields is what is relevant not just pounding away at other areas of the ships protected by the shields.
Your speculation isn't debating it's just fanboyism you want to be accepted by your star wars brethren. It's what weak debaters do they guess and desperately seek approval by their peers.
We see the relevant shots so quit speculating and ignoring the evidence of what it took to destroy the deflector shields. Go by what we see and know and not what you speculate and don't know. This isn't a hard concept to grasp. We see the tie fighters shooting the entire time.
That's taking down the shields nigh instantly unlike the star destroyer which failed to do any significant damage to the much smaller, inferior ship in the MF which isn't military grade or a hundred or so years into the future. Jellyfish but it's a much smaller ship. Difference here is the Narada wrecks through the shields almost instantly whereas the star destroyer fails to do so against a much weaker ship that isn't built for combat.
It's clear by the video not much firepower is required to take down the deflector shields. Once that is accomplished even a much smaller ship crashing or shooting into key structural points in the super star destroyer can easily take it off its rails and bring it down.
Notice how he failed to address the overwhelming ships which easily number in the thousands and how easily they'd overwhelm these huge target star destroyers out of space.
Originally posted by Q99
An irony is neither are that high up in the grander scheme of things.Skylark, literally the *first* space opera, ended with the heroes throwing a galaxy at another galaxy as a weapon.
The warhammer universe would also say "Warhammer vs Trek? Warhammer vs Star Wars? How about 2v1 and I'll still casually solo both?"
Originally posted by Deronn_soloNah. Too many instances of ineptitude, failure, and flat out embarrassment.
Star Wars still stomp.
Looks at Vader resorting to seeking the aid of bounty hunters because the imperial empire was too incompetent to get the mission accomplished of locating and capturing Han Solo. What's worse we see bloody ewoks taking out At-St's with giant rocks and booby traps. That doesn't reek of some badass intergalactic armadaa it reeks of an overrated and repeatedly humiliated antagonists.