Batman vs Black Widow

Originally posted by FrothByte
But what you're doing is applying the real world definition of human capability instead of movie version. Because if we used real world definition, well then 90% of action heroes would be superhuman. From Rambo to the Bride to Mr. and Mrs. Smith to freakin Arya Stark.

John McClane's feats of durability are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay (that's still not enough a's to accurately describe it) higher than the durability of other humans who are in the same movie with him.

any other person in a 'Die Hard' movie would have died, John McClane didn't die... that makes him (to a degree) superhuman.

No, it makes him a badass.

Originally posted by marwash22
Batman's fodder were mercs who were actully trying to kill him.

Widow's fodder were thugs and security guards who waited their turn to be hurricanrana'd instead of trying to shoot that b*tch in the head. she should have died in 90% of her fight, but didn't due to shitty scripted and unrealistic combat scenarios. Widow has fought people with guns multiple times, and instead of shooting her, they, for some strange reason, decide to do h2h.

stop it.

Put Widow in the same exact building fight scene from 'Dawn of Justice' and she dies. quickly.

Batman's fodder were featless mercs. And they're not anymore impressive than the goons, security personnel and mercs that BW took out. For sure they aren't as impressive as the Chitauri and Ultronbots who BW took out.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Batman's fodder were featless mercs.

And they're not anymore impressive than the goons, security personnel and mercs that BW took out.

Originally posted by FrothByte
For sure they aren't as impressive as the Chitauri and Ultronbots who BW took out.

Neither the Chitauri or Ultron bots did anything of subtance. The Chitauri never once took a swing at her. They were dumb ass Power Ranger putties who did nothing but shoot their energy weapons. She stabbed one in the neck... that is the complete extent of her physical altercations with the chitauri. Nothing she did against them couldn't be replicated by Batman.

All she did against the ultron bots (who were glass waterguns, not even glass cannons) was shoot them with her pistols and hurricanrana one who was aimlessly flying around.

Originally posted by marwash22

Put Widow in the same exact building fight scene from 'Dawn of Justice' and she dies. quickly.

Lol. No. Give Widow her gadgets and she clears that without any injuries.

how, Sway? How?!

There are 20 men armed with machine guns in the room she has to enter. She doesn't have batman's magnetic device used to disable the guns. Even if she's gets past the gun dilemma, those same 20 men all have knives and smaller guns. She's not downing all of them before getting stabbed... Batman would have died at least 3 times if not for his armor, armor that Widow does not have.

Natasha has fought Ultron bots.

One Ultron bot would eat Bruce, Alfred and Martha alive.

Those bots were weak af. They did nothing impressive. Also, all she did was shoot them with her guns and hurricanrana'd one who was flying by.

glass cannons waterguns.

ffs man, Quicksilver, who displayed zero superhuman strength, was ripping them apart with his bare hands.

Weak, sure, but let's not pretend cannon fodder thugs aren't weak. She did fight the Chitauri, too.

IM2, two Avengers movies, two Cap movies. Batffleck on the other hand has one dream sequence in which he gets one-shotted by a parademon ( haermm ) and one fight against KGBeast's mooks.

DCEU Bats needs to sit patiently and collect feats. As of now, he simply doesn't have what it takes.

Originally posted by marwash22
I think we already covered this. The difference being, Batman's featless fodder were actually TRYING to kill him, and didn't stand around waiting for him to do pretty twirls and spin moves.

ctfu. talk about fodder.

Neither the Chitauri or Ultron bots did anything of subtance. The Chitauri never once took a swing at her. They were dumb ass Power Ranger putties who did nothing but shoot their energy weapons. She stabbed one in the neck... that is the complete extent of her physical altercations with the chitauri. Nothing she did against them couldn't be replicated by Batman.

All she did against the ultron bots (who were glass waterguns, not even glass cannons) was shoot them with her pistols and hurricanrana one who was aimlessly flying around.

I love how you accuse BW's fodder of not doing anything of substance and act as if Batman's mercs were any better. Or imply that somehow the people that BW were killing were not intent to kill her as well. Guess you also didn't notice that the mercs were only attacking 1-2 most of the time instead of completely ganging up on him. There was one time he got ganged up on amd he got hit quite a bit.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I love how you accuse BW's fodder of not doing anything of substance and act as if Batman's mercs were any better. Or imply that somehow the people that BW were killing were not intent to kill her as well. Guess you also didn't notice that the mercs were only attacking 1-2 most of the time instead of completely ganging up on him. There was one time he got ganged up on amd he got hit quite a bit.

Watch the movies again. Multiples times a bad guy has had a gun who could shoot her in the face, but they instead go h2h.

The people in that warehouse were legitimately trying to kill Batman. The one time he got ganged up on was the one time they got the chance to do so. The bad guys in Marvel movies have had the opportunity to swarm Widow, but they never did... they're always conveniently lined up in a row, ready to get hurricanrana'd.

YouTube video

look at this bullshit. People either fail to use their guns alltogether, or they pause in taking the shots at her, just long enough for her to throw something at them, or disarm them with h2h.

shitty, scripted scenarios for the purpose of not having her killed off.

^ True I'd have to rewatch stuff, but I think Batman took on more goons simultaneously than BW did.

If we're basing this on who took out more fodder, wouldn't Black Widow win by default simply by being in more movies. Though the only significant fodder of note were the Chitauri and I don't recall her taking any of those out explicitly with H2H. Also weren't the mercs ganging up on Batman when he was getting tagged?

However it occurred to me that Black Widow did get the short end of the stick in CW while the other Avengers got to flex their Superhero muscles.

Originally posted by marwash22
Superhuman = anything that exceeds human capability. I don't care if it's shitty writing or a plot device... if it happens in a movie, it counts.

John McClane from the 'die Hard' movies, is superhuman.

Kham from 'The Protector' movies, is superhuman.

Rama from 'The Raid' movies, is superhuman.

call it the "shit tier" of superhuman if you want, but they'r clearly doing things that a human shouldn't be able to do.

more skilled based on what, tho? hurricanranas? lol.

Originally posted by FrothByte
But what you're doing is applying the real world definition of human capability instead of movie version. Because if we used real world definition, well then 90% of action heroes would be superhuman. From Rambo to the Bride to Mr. and Mrs. Smith to freakin Arya Stark.

Originally posted by marwash22
YouTube video

look at this bullshit. People either fail to use their guns alltogether, or they pause in taking the shots at her, just long enough for her to throw something at them, or disarm them with h2h.

shitty, scripted scenarios for the purpose of not having her killed off.

Looks to me like she was quick enough to take them out before they could start shooting, unless of course they wanted to shoot at each other in a crossfire.. Faster and more skilled than Batman. Probably not enough though to compensate for the strength factor which is why I give Bruce a very slight majority.

Originally posted by marwash22
YouTube video

look at this bullshit. People either fail to use their guns alltogether, or they pause in taking the shots at her, just long enough for her to throw something at them, or disarm them with h2h.

shitty, scripted scenarios for the purpose of not having her killed off.

Oh please. As if the mercs that Batman took out didn't take their sweet time attacking him only in ones and twos. The one time they actually ganged up on him (I believe it was 4 to 1) he would have been a gonner if it wasn't for his suit.

Fact is, groups of fodder not ganging up on a single opponent is a common feature of action movies. BW and Batman are no exceptions.

I find the "Peak" vs "Super" human debate kind of pointless, as everyone is going to have their own personal interpretation of what should qualify as Movie "Super"/"Peak" etc. as well as just how "Super" some feat or another might be. Best to just compare the actual content/elements of the feats directly. They remain unchanged, regardless of what labels people choose to attach to them. Like whether you want to call Batman "Peak", "Super", or whatever, his strength feats > Natasha's, and that is ultimately what matters with regards to that.

Ultronbots & Chitari also >>> Black Widow in strength.

Didn't matter much

Bruce is now watching Avengers 1 and AoU religiously, prepping for the parademon invasion.