Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot👆
Alsos omething interesting is that the enchantment was only on the basis of that first small bit of blood being spilled onto it. But thanks to that stupid mage getting himself killed the Rune sucked all of the blood in his body out. So Harald and crew got even more super powered by the enchantment.
Which is why Strange outright stated that it would be suicide for him to even *try* and confront them:
Their rune magics >>>>>>> Strange's magics(and Thor's, for that matter.)
Originally posted by krisblaze
The twins with their education and preparation under Kang didnt know about the Sentry? Come on...Remender didnt write himself into a corner simply because he had the worm take out Sentry. The Sentry just wasnt that powerful. Any number of things couldve happened if Wasp didnt interfere.
What is certain, however, is that he wouldnt have killed the twins oe Thor. Eimin empowered him because she knew that he would not lr couls not kill her.
Its absurd to assume that Sentry would somehow turn around and kill the PROCOGNITIANT CHARACTER THAT EMPOWERED HIM IN THE FIRST PLACE.
The twins were fooled by Kang into believing they were rebelling against him. I don't think they realized what they were in for. Kang said as much when he spoke to Eimin. You may recall that they "rebelled" against him.
You seem to be missing the point of what I'm saying. Both occasions where Sentry was about to cause havoc he was written off in someway. And you say,
Remender didnt write himself into a corner simply because he had the worm take out Sentry
As if I'm saying "The Sentry was deep sixed by the writer because of the worm. I'm talking about the situations before both incidents. But you seem to keep putting words in my mouth.
You're saying many things but you don't actually have a basis for them. Have you got proof that Eimin knew Sentry wouldn't rebel?
I can read so it's pointless using caps. If you have read Uncanny Avengers you would know that Sentry was actively going against Uriel and Eimin from the start and he already had a plan in place. He most likely wanted Thor alive for that exact reason. Do you think Sentry would be happy when found out Uriel and Eimin were trying to genocide every single human. He was about to kill Thor until the worm appeared.
And you haven't addressed my point on that either where you said he wasn't unconscious when he was. He knew what needed to be done and sooner or later both Twins would have fallen.
My point is that the Sentry doesn't act autonomously of the writer, and the way you post really implies that he does.
Eimin has precognition and chose to empower the Sentry. You can't just claim that the Sentry would've turned around and killed her. Death Sentry is more powerful than either of the twins, though they're kind of difficult to gauge, but that doesn't necessarily mean that he could just up and kill them. Not when one of them can see the future and despite that chose to empower him.
When you complain about how "Sentry would totally have killed everyone if he wasn't cheapshot by the worm" just reflects so poorly on you. There's no reason to take this stuff for granted and you're just needlessly extrapolating on the Sentry's capabilities and feats.
Death Sentry's feats speak for themselves and don't need further embelleshing.
some interesting stuff here. maybe the molecular manip wouldn't be enough. kris said sentry wasn't indestructible, and i'm sure he wasn't, but we don't know what it would take to put him down, like i guess we don't know just how much it would take to put harald down. i guess one seems like a brick, the other has more options and not really knowing the extent of either, i'd just fall on sentry's side. i agree with galan, it likely wouldn't be in character based on appearances, but (1) deathry had few appearances, (2) bringing it up allowed for some conversation in the thread. 🙂 and iirc strange was very much afraid of sentry at one point as well, no?
re: the thread: frankly, i dunno. that exitar scene was pretty impressive though. not sure who would be stronger between these guys but i think i'd go with sentry. as for the worm--i sort of side with scot there. it was a bit....ridiculous to me. i was also under the impression sentry was capable of teleporting himself, so i never understood why he didn't just port free... 😕
not sure the thread can be resolved tbh.
Originally posted by krisblaze
You can't just claim that the Sentry would've turned around and killed her. Death Sentry is more powerful than either of the twins, though they're kind of difficult to gauge, but that doesn't necessarily mean that he could just up and kill them. Not when one of them can see the future and despite that chose to empower him.
What is this wishy-washy talk about the Sentry?
1. If the Sentry felt like killing the Apocalypse Twins he would have done so, and there is nothing they would have been able to do to stop him. He was that much more powerful than them.
Their precognition powers should have kicked in much sooner, when they picked him as one of the Horsemen of Death and ordered him to kill Thor. He went after Thor, but didn't kill him, because he needed Thor alive for his own personal agenda. That's all the proof you need, that Sentry was acting against the will of the Apocalypse Twins.
Even more proof is the preview for the old Uncanny Avengers #13 preview, where it was stated, that Sentry was going to kill an Uncanny Avengers against the will of his masters. That story got changed in the end, but it doesn't change the fact, that originally he would have done something they didn't agree with, but were helpless to stop him.
On other topics:
2. The worm actually taking out the Sentry is a prime example of PIS, which ignores all the prior showings of the character.
Sentry moves in microseconds and has used his speed to catch bullets at point range and mid flight. Even in Rick Remenders books he was able to travel across the city in a matter of seconds, and even travel hundreds of miles before Wolverine was able to say a word.
Against the worm the Sentry turned around and said "Oh", which for that character is enough time to be on the other side of the planet, if he feels like it. Especially considering that he can teleport (under stress). And one would assume that being in the stomach of a slimy worm would cause some stress.
3. Sentry struggling to get out of the worm at all is on the same level of Remender stupid as Thor getting hurt by Captain America's son.
Thor the guy, who survived the velocity of being flown through space at Spaceballs levels of speed, by the Sentry. The guy, who survived a punch, that was felt across a planet with 19 billion residents, by the Sentry... screams in pain, when Captain America's son kicks him in the head? Come on.
I love me some Remender, but every now and then he did something simply weird. And the worm instance was such an instance and shouldn't be taken seriously. Just like Thor being hurt by an enhanced human shouldn't be taken seriously.
4. Everything Sentry did was him using his molecule manipulation. That's literally the only power that character has and everything else is just the icying on the cake, which is made out of molecule manipulation.
The stuff you actually want to discuss is the question if Death Seed Sentry would have used his molecule manipulation to disperse the molecules of an opponent. And the answer to that is... Yes, he would have used that, if he had to. And here are some scans:
The way Sentry uses his offensive molecule manipulation is by hitting you with a infitendril of darkness and then dispersing your molecules. He did it to a weapon:
http://i.imgur.com/UJrneOY.jpg
And he did it to Loki:
http://i.imgur.com/ypF0lT6.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/W0pQZVg.jpg
And in Uncanny Avengers as Death Seed Sentry, he went for the kill against Thor. He was done trying to reason with him, knocked him out and then materialized the infitendrils to finish him off:
http://i.imgur.com/gjax3Aj.jpg
It's just that he got BFR'ed, before he was able to kill Thor.
And on topic: No idea. I've never read the story with that zombie viking, so I don't know how the fight would go.
A bothersome trend I'm starting to see with Sentry is that pretty much any of his less-than-peak showings seem to get swiftly hand-waved away by some. No other character is permitted the same treatment, so I'm not sure why Sentry is a special case..?
That said, I agree the worm thing is stupid. However, it still happened, and absolutely MUST be considered--especially given the few appearances this iteration of Sentry has. And based on that(along with his other showings), offensive molecule manip./atomization is just not in character for Deathtry. Even if it were, I'm still unconvinced that he could override Harald's magical enchantment/fortification--Sentry has never come across magics nearly that potent, afaik. /shrug
As for who's stronger: I'm still unsure. At first glance, I would argue that Harald brutalized Thor easier(and much moreso) than Deathtry--but it was also under the MAX imprint, so it's bound to be more gruesome/violent than we seen in mainstream books. Catch-22, I guess...
Sentry's biggest advantage -the only one I see potentially helping him here- is flight/speed... But what would happen if he tried to bumrush, and/or spam-blast Harald is anyone's guess. Seems logical that he'd experience massive backlash(akin to when Thor attacked Harald), but again, it's impossible to know for sure.
Point being: contrary to the first few posts in this thread, whoever wins certainly does not do so 'effortlessly'. That's just absurd.
Originally posted by Galan007👆 Glad Realitydurper was axed
A bothersome trend I'm starting to see with Sentry is that pretty much any of his less-than-peak showings seem to get swiftly hand-waved away by some. No other character is permitted the same treatment, so I'm not sure why Sentry is a special case..?That said, I agree the worm thing is stupid. However, it still happened, and absolutely MUST be considered--especially given the few appearances this iteration of Sentry has. And based on that(along with his other showings), offensive molecule manip./atomization is just not in character for Deathtry. Even if it were, I'm still unconvinced that he could override Harald's magical enchantment/fortification--Sentry has never come across magics nearly that potent, afaik. /shrug
As for who's stronger: I'm still unsure. I would argue that Harald brutalized Thor easier(and much moreso) than Deathtry--but it was also under the MAX imprint, so it's bound to be more gruesome/violent than we seen in mainstream books.
Sentry's biggest advantage -the only one I see potentially helping him here- is flight/speed... But what would happen if he tried to bumrush Harald is anyone's guess. Seems logical that he'd experience massive backlash(akin to when Thor attacked Harald), but again, it's impossible to know for sure.
Point being: contrary to the first few posts in this thread, whoever wins certainly does not do so 'effortlessly'. That's just absurd.
Originally posted by krisblaze
My point is that the Sentry doesn't act autonomously of the writer, and the way you post really implies that he does.Eimin has precognition and chose to empower the Sentry. You can't just claim that the Sentry would've turned around and killed her. Death Sentry is more powerful than either of the twins, though they're kind of difficult to gauge, but that doesn't necessarily mean that he could just up and kill them. Not when one of them can see the future and despite that chose to empower him.
When you complain about how "Sentry would totally have killed everyone if he wasn't cheapshot by the worm" just reflects so poorly on you. There's no reason to take this stuff for granted and you're just needlessly extrapolating on the Sentry's capabilities and feats.
Death Sentry's feats speak for themselves and don't need further embelleshing.
My phrasing probably is a bit off here. I was talking in terms of what would have happened storywise but the discussion ended up tapering into a vs thing. Though I do think if given the chance he probably would've been able to kill Thor then the twins.
One thing I have to say here is that Eimin's ability to predict the future can be twisted (though this isn't that relevant). She probably saw a future where the Sentry completely followed her orders. But here is where me and you diverge.
The part where it says "Sentry has completed his masters charge - in part". As they wanted Thor killed but he only subdued him.
Plus if you also recall this point.
"But the new voice in Robert Reynolds fractured mind urged him to keep the thunder god alive.
For while the current conflict holds the fate of his Master's goals.
It is not the ultimate goal of the Sentry"
If Eimin was so clever do you think that she would give a Death Seed - which makes them want to aid the evolution of their species (that they see as superior) to a human. Who will now try and kill the people (mutants) she wants to protect? They clearly didn't think it all through.
Originally posted by Galan007
👆Which is why Strange outright stated that it would be suicide for him to even *try* and confront them:
Their rune magics >>>>>>> Strange's magics(and Thor's, for that matter.)
Originally posted by Galan007
A bothersome trend I'm starting to see with Sentry is that pretty much any of his less-than-peak showings seem to get swiftly hand-waved away by some. No other character is permitted the same treatment, so I'm not sure why Sentry is a special case..?
He is not. And no other character is.
But at the same time, just like for every other character, low showings need to be justifiable. And if they aren't, then they most likely just happened for the sake of plot progression:
Sentry getting taken out by a sturdy worm.
Thor getting kicked aside and hurt by Captain America's son.
Silver Surfer getting knocked out by a guy with a crow bar.
Flash getting stabbed by Deathstroke.
Gas station explosions affecting high heralds.
