Mr. X vs Bane

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So X hits harder than Thing, Juggernaut, Hulk et al?

Seeing as NONE of them have been able to consistently put Wolverine down.

Yet, X can.

So you tell me how does the math add up. X hits harder than almost every brick in Marvel?

X put down Wolverine, that's what we are talking about. He dominated him and Bane is no Wolverine. You are throwing up side arguments instead of respecting the point I made based on a canonical showing. You can't chose not to accept what occurred.

So back to my counter point, Banes damage soak won't save him from X just as Wolverines far superior damage soak didn't save him from X. And other reason why Bane would survive Mr. X? Bane has no berserker rage, insanity or drunken style plot device.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
X put down Wolverine, that's what we are talking about. He dominated him and Bane is no Wolverine. You are throwing up side arguments instead of respecting the point I made based on a canonical showing. You can't chose not to accept what occurred.

I dunno Wolverine can fight like an idiot sometimes.

Aside from that one Thunderbolts issue, X has been a beast.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
I must've struck a nerve. My point stands. It's a trope. Whenever a new big villain shows up in order to establish how bad ass he is he curbs an already established villain. Take Rulk for example. For absolutely no reason at all he killed Blonsky just for writers to prove he's not to be phucked with. Same goes for Mr. X with Taskmaster, onslaught wayyy before the writers even hashed out who or what he was beat the hell out of Marko and punted him...i could go on

Its plot armor that degradea over time which is y Ross can one shot a watcher yet get choked out by Wonder Man. Damn noobs

Yeah, you wish. It doesn't matter whether it's a trope or not because it's completely irrelevant. And furthermore, Rulk actually had an uber power at his onset, high level power absorption, which you'd know if you read comics. He lost that power and he isn't as formidable. Mr. X has had no such power loss, in fact, he has worked to improve his skill to overcome some counters. Not that Bane had and counters to begin with.

Do you have an actual reason you want to present as to why Bane could even land a blow on Mr. X let alone defeat him?

Originally posted by Deadline
I dunno Wolverine can fight like an idiot sometimes.

So what are you saying, the only reason he completed dominated Wolverine is because Wolverine fought stupidly in your opinion?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
X put down Wolverine, that's what we are talking about. He dominated him and Bane is no Wolverine. You are throwing up side arguments instead of respecting the point I made based on a canonical showing. You can't chose not to accept what occurred.

So, PIS then. Thought so. Yes, we can ignore it if it is PIS. X KOing Wolverine when almost every other brick has been unable to - when Wolverine has even survived being decapitated, and flayed down to his bones etc....is PIS.

All righty, so I've been asked to show Bane's durability. At first, I thought I'd do nu52 Bane - but OP showed pre-52. OK.

WITH Venom, Bane has tanked Batman's attacks. So what? Well, Batman had Superman's powers at the time. So Batman's skills at punching + Superman's powers, failed to KO Bane:
http://imgur.com/zlJIxbM

WITHOUT, he has taken ~500 bricks being smashed into his face and body, by a superstrong villain:
http://imgur.com/5u8AN6c
http://imgur.com/aZkSJ3P
http://imgur.com/pbpchOS

WITHOUT, Nightshade was unable to put him down, even when using pressure point attacks:
http://imgur.com/gyGzoRc
http://imgur.com/Z5a7EDX

WITHOUT Venom, he was fighting Azrael, himself a superstrong, highly skilled fighter, who was AMPED on Venom...and Azrael was still losing. Note too, that punching an unamped Bane is like punching concrete:
http://imgur.com/oYsLt0c
http://imgur.com/g8nY8cD

Speaking of concrete, here he is, OFF Venom, being smashed repeatedly into concrete so hard, he's breaking it. By Grendel, a WW foe. Doesn't KO him:
http://i.imgur.com/wrZkHLL.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/qblLHPS.jpg

WITHOUT Venom, he was thrown a really far distance, and wasn't killed:
http://imgur.com/a/7Lqdg

He also routinely gets shot and stabbed, without any pause:

And breaks metal collars designed to kill him:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Gd8NBIma-zo/TDkjWc9NWaI/AAAAAAAAN2o/fTuuctvn36o/s1600/Secret+Six+23+-+bane1.jpg

He def isn't human level in his durability.

Strength wise? WITHOUT Venom, he rips a guy's arm off (whilst said guy is wearing powered armour) and beats him to death:
http://static8.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/6/67407/1679896-secretsix23012.jpg
http://static2.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/6/67407/1679892-secretsix23020.jpg

There are other feats, but this should be enough for now. He's also been so fast, he's snuck up on Batman, Tim Drake, blitzed guys before they've had a chance to shoot...

IOW, X is faster. Has the precog. Bane has been shot and stabbed, multiple times, and he just keeps coming. Here, he is shot in the shoulder, then uses the exact same arm to casually break a guy's arm, one handed.

Without Venom.:
http://static7.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/120679/2382881-4.jpg

Originally posted by Dareangel
Carver you are making a mistake and getting drugged into defending mister x as a martial artist without his main powers. the thing is both danny and luke cage had to use plot device situation in order to overcome his abilities. facts are for this fight he can use his powers without something preventing it. so IMO he will destroy in both fights. giving him swords is an overkill. he will just know exatly when bane is trying to punch and cut his arm off. bane cant win in this fight. unless bane suddenly is as fast as quicksilver...

It's a cage.

Put them in an open field, and sure, Mr. X could dodge all day. In a cage, dodging is limited to the edges of the arena.

It's how Steel Serpent beat Spider-man, by boxing him into a mesh fence. Precog or no precog, Peter simply didn't have anywhere else to go.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
X put down Wolverine, that's what we are talking about. He dominated him and Bane is no Wolverine. You are throwing up side arguments instead of respecting the point I made based on a canonical showing. You can't chose not to accept what occurred.

So back to my counter point, Banes damage soak won't save him from X just as Wolverines far superior damage soak didn't save him from X. And other reason why Bane would survive Mr. X? Bane has no berserker rage, insanity or drunken style plot device.

Logan has better damage soak due to healing factor + adamantium. He's still about as easy to stagger as any street leveler.

Using Wilson Fisk as an example again, he just stood there while Matt wore himself out beating on his head with the club, and then KO'd him. Logan won't do that.. He'll stagger, just like anyone else, and could be put down from an extended beating (Depends on the writer, of course.)

Bane's more like Fisk in damage soak.. He can just stand there and take a beating, without reacting at all, as if you're hitting a wall.

Originally posted by cdtm
Logan has better damage soak due to healing factor + adamantium. He's still about as easy to stagger as any street leveler.

Using Wilson Fisk as an example again, he just stood there while Matt wore himself out beating on his head with the club, and then KO'd him. Logan won't do that.. He'll stagger, just like anyone else, and could be put down from an extended beating (Depends on the writer, of course.)

Bane's more like Fisk in damage soak.. He can just stand there and take a beating, without reacting at all, as if you're hitting a wall.

This actually convinced me.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
So what are you saying, the only reason he completed dominated Wolverine is because Wolverine fought stupidly in your opinion?

I can't say for sure I'm saying it's possible. Wolverine has a tendency to fight like a skilled brawler then sometimes go on martial art mode.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So, PIS then. Thought so. Yes, we can ignore it if it is PIS. X KOing Wolverine when almost every other brick has been unable to - when Wolverine has even survived being decapitated, and flayed down to his bones etc....is PIS.

All righty, so I've been asked to show Bane's durability. At first, I thought I'd do nu52 Bane - but OP showed pre-52. OK.

WITH Venom, Bane has tanked Batman's attacks. So what? Well, Batman had Superman's powers at the time. So Batman's skills at punching + Superman's powers, failed to KO Bane:
http://imgur.com/zlJIxbM

WITHOUT, he has taken ~500 bricks being smashed into his face and body, by a superstrong villain:
http://imgur.com/5u8AN6c
http://imgur.com/aZkSJ3P
http://imgur.com/pbpchOS

WITHOUT, Nightshade was unable to put him down, even when using pressure point attacks:
http://imgur.com/gyGzoRc
http://imgur.com/Z5a7EDX

WITHOUT Venom, he was fighting Azrael, himself a superstrong, highly skilled fighter, who was AMPED on Venom...and Azrael was still losing. Note too, that punching an unamped Bane is like punching concrete:
http://imgur.com/oYsLt0c
http://imgur.com/g8nY8cD

Speaking of concrete, here he is, OFF Venom, being smashed repeatedly into concrete so hard, he's breaking it. By Grendel, a WW foe. Doesn't KO him:
http://i.imgur.com/wrZkHLL.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/qblLHPS.jpg

WITHOUT Venom, he was thrown a really far distance, and wasn't killed:
http://imgur.com/a/7Lqdg

He also routinely gets shot and stabbed, without any pause:

And breaks metal collars designed to kill him:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Gd8NBIma-zo/TDkjWc9NWaI/AAAAAAAAN2o/fTuuctvn36o/s1600/Secret+Six+23+-+bane1.jpg

He def isn't human level in his durability.

Strength wise? WITHOUT Venom, he rips a guy's arm off (whilst said guy is wearing powered armour) and beats him to death:
http://static8.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/6/67407/1679896-secretsix23012.jpg
http://static2.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/6/67407/1679892-secretsix23020.jpg

There are other feats, but this should be enough for now. He's also been so fast, he's snuck up on Batman, Tim Drake, blitzed guys before they've had a chance to shoot...

IOW, X is faster. Has the precog. Bane has been shot and stabbed, multiple times, and he just keeps coming. Here, he is shot in the shoulder, then uses the exact same arm to casually break a guy's arm, one handed.

Without Venom.:
http://static7.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/120679/2382881-4.jpg

He's a ringer, no different than Wilson Fisk or Crossbones. Doesn't mean Mr. X couldn't K.O. or kill him. And guess who else has ringer durability? Mr. X. There is no was on earth a human could get kicked in the sternum by Luke Cage who has at least class 50 strength and steel hard skin to the level he is flying through themail air and survive just fine. Bane has no durability edge over Mr. X based on what each has shown. And please don't tell me Bane is more durable than Nuke, Wolverine or Deadpool. Don't do that.

Bane has counter for Mr. X's pre-cog which means he's going to be taking a beating the entire time while Mr. X is fresh and even if he slips one in, Mr. X can take it.

Also in your zest to give Bane the win, you substituted a bad of cement for concrete. They aren't the same thing. Also, you said Grendel repeated broke concrete slamming him around, but the pic shows one instance only.

Yeah - it's not just his durability, but also his insane pain endurance. He isn't even phased when stabbed or shot - nothing puts him off. He's like a juggernaut in that respect.

And in a cage, with limited options for running away - he will corner him, and he will beat him.

With swords, however, he'll just stab him through the heart.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
He's a ringer, no different than Wilson Fisk or Crossbones. Doesn't mean Mr. X couldn't K.O. or kill him. And guess who else has ringer durability? Mr. X. There is no was on earth a human could get kicked in the sternum by Luke Cage who has at least class 50 strength and steel hard skin to the level he is flying through themail air and survive just fine. Bane has no durability edge over Mr. X based on what each has shown. And please don't tell me Bane is more durable than Nuke, Wolverine or Deadpool. Don't do that.

Bane has counter for Mr. X's pre-cog which means he's going to be taking a beating the entire time while Mr. X is fresh and even if he slips one in, Mr. X can take it.

We cannot ignore the showings, so use whatever terms you like, he still wasn't KOed in the showings I posted.

You act as though Luke kicks humans so hard their spines bust out. As if Luke has no practice with his powers, and does not hold back every time he fights.

Edit: I mean, X weighs what, 155lbs? How difficult would it be for Luke, with his Class 50 strength, to send him flying?

Originally posted by Deadline
I can't say for sure I'm saying it's possible. Wolverine has a tendency to fight like a skilled brawler then sometimes go on martial art mode.

I get that, but how does that change anything? Whether he brawled or used martial arts, Mr. X used his powers to defeat Logan. And Logan's skill level at his best isn't on part with Ironfisttbolts.jpg.html and Ironfist needed had to use his drunken style to counter Mr. X to tag him. The win vs. Logan is 100% legit.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I get that, but how does that change anything? Whether he brawled or used martial arts, Mr. X used his powers to defeat Logan. And Logan's skill level at his best isn't on part with Ironfisttbolts.jpg.html and Ironfist needed had to use his drunken style to counter Mr. X to tag him. The win vs. Logan is 100% legit.

Good point but guess maybe there are better examples after all both Punisher and DD have humiliated Woolverine. Ok they're low showings but not entirely unrealistic.

You never change, Phantom 😂 Seriously, after all these years...

^It's true though. Wolverine gets shot, stabbed and blown up all the time is it a surprise that sometimes he gets dominated? During EOTS DD was fighting Wolverine and hand ninjas, not sue the mind control made him much less formidable.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
We cannot ignore the showings, so use whatever terms you like, he still wasn't KOed in the showings I posted.

You act as though Luke kicks humans so hard their spines bust out. As if Luke has no practice with his powers, and does not hold back every time he fights.

He kicked him hard enough to send him flying through the air as if he was a pedestrian hit by a car, that's what the pic shows. ANY normal human would be injured.

And why did you make the comment about ignoring showings? Who's ignoring showings, that is, beside you with respect to how hard Cage kicked Mr. X? And why are YOU ignoring the fact that I said Bane (as well as Mr. X) is a ringer? You didn't have to sell me on durability showings because I never once claimed he wasn't durable. No matter what you claim, he's not more durable than several of the characters Mr. X has beaten in rather casual fashion.

Ringer strength and durability and great combat skill is what Bane has. Well so does Mr. X along with a precog/speed proven formidable to counter and often defeat true enhanced humans. Mr. X would likely beat Bane with Venom in the second scenario.

During the time Wolverine fought X, he had some of his best durability showings during that story. The guy was walking through bullets while being shot in the face and walking through flames, etc...

The writer knew full well about Wolverine durability and still allowed X to Ko him. Shitty showing is one thing but when a character have some of his best durability showings and still get curbed, that speaks volumes.

Originally posted by Deadline
^It's true though. Wolverine gets shot, stabbed and blown up all the time is it a surprise that sometimes he gets dominated? During EOTS DD was fighting Wolverine and hand ninjas, not sue the mind control made him much less formidable.

And Wolverine was fighting mindcontrol - stated on panel in the very same issue - and missing a portion of his soul! 😱

The spirits of jinzin, srank and battlehammer are within me. I could slap you back into oblivion... but I won't. I'm glad you're back with us, the kmc veterans... ah, the nostalgia.

Did you know that Raz isn't even the owner of the site anymore, apparently? haermm It's a minor miracle this place still exists.