Good fight imo.
Originally posted by AncientPower
Outlander > Vaylin, who has enough power to reduce the Sanctum and the mountain beneath it to 'ash' from orbit, yeah that's definitely reaching Plagueis tier, if not a better feat of power than anything Plagueis has without Sidious crutching.
Don't forget that Chained!Vaylin tanked a hyperdrive explosion. Thats a pretty monstrous feat.
Originally posted by darthbane77
"Valkorion's most powerful opponents" is an empty accolade when his feats are inferior to those of people like Revan, the only other person that actually fought the Emperor. And sure, he managed to push through Vaylin's Malestrom, barely; and before that, Vaylin was contending with the 'lander, Senya, and Arcann at once. That alone establishes her as superior to any of the other three.
That accolade is recent (and official) and according to it, the Outlander > Revan. It sets the precedent to rank Arcann, Thexan, Vaylin and Valkorion higher than some members here would assume and accolades of Darth Plagueis, Palpatine and Yoda do not apply to these characters because none of them is a Jedi or Sith.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
None of that makes any sense.That accolade is recent (and official) and according to it, the Outlander > Revan. It sets the precedent to rank Arcann, Thexan, Vaylin and Valkorion higher than some members here would assume and accolades of Darth Plagueis, Palpatine and Yoda do not apply to these characters because none of them is a Jedi or Sith.
Yes, the quote is recent, but it's contradicted by the Outlander's lack of feats suggesting that he's more powerful than Revan. By feats, which are superior to accolades in a ranking, Revan>the Outlander. There's also the matter that Revan never technically faced Valkorion, only Vitiate. So, depending on how one interprets the quote, it COULD be accurate, but in neither case is the Outlander actually more powerful than Revan.
I fail to see how Vaylin being able to contend with the trio as well as she did doesn't put her above every individual member of that same trio.
Originally posted by darthbane77The accolade is made at the point of Valkorion's intial death, by which point we know he is less powerful in the Force than Arcann. So evidently its not referring to Force ability exclusively, or at all.
"Valkorion's most powerful opponents" is an empty accolade when his feats are inferior to those of people like Revan, the only other person that actually fought the Emperor. And sure, he managed to push through Vaylin's Malestrom, barely; and before that, Vaylin was contending with the 'lander, Senya, and Arcann at once. That alone establishes her as superior to any of the other three.
Originally posted by darthbane77
Yes, the quote is recent, but it's contradicted by the Outlander's lack of feats suggesting that he's more powerful than Revan. By feats, which are superior to accolades in a ranking, Revan>the Outlander. There's also the matter that Revan never technically faced Valkorion, only Vitiate. So, depending on how one interprets the quote, it COULD be accurate, but in neither case is the Outlander actually more powerful than Revan.I fail to see how Vaylin being able to contend with the trio as well as she did doesn't put her above every individual member of that same trio.
Revan was implied to be no match for Vitiate even in the Shadow of Revan expansion FYI.
Vaylin has some fantastic showings and the Outlander was able to contend with her in spite of not having feats like her.
Please keep in mind that the Outlander doesn't have predefined traits so he doesn't gets much cut-scene style action sequences like other characters. However, he is immensely strong.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
I don't think that that accolade is time-specific. It seems to be a holistic reference to the Outlander. At some point, the Outlander surpassed Revan.Revan was implied to be no match for Vitiate even in the Shadow of Revan expansion FYI.
Vaylin has some fantastic showings and the Outlander was able to contend with her in spite of not having feats like her.
Please keep in mind that the Outlander doesn't have predefined traits so he doesn't gets much cut-scene style action sequences like other characters. However, he is immensely strong.
A single, vague, accolade does not overwrite the multitude of feats placing Revan above the Outlander.
Revan was implied to be no match for Vitiate by people who had never experienced Vitiate's full strength. Revan was able to contend with Vitiate in their fight, and solidly at that when all the circumstances of the fight are considered. Couple that with the quotes stating that Revan came close to killing Vitiate, and you have a case implying that Revan was more of a match for Vitiate than most would believe. Those feats stand head and shoulders above the opinions of people who have never experienced Vitiate's full potency.
He managed to contend with her with the help of Arcann and Senya. Had the 'lander been alone in that fight, you would have a case to make. As it stands, you don't.
I'm not saying the 'lander isn't incredibly powerful, I have him placed somewhat solidly over ROTJ Vader based on his feats. But he has nothing to suggest superiority to Revan.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
@[B]Ursumeles
[/B]
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Your knowledge is terrible
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
and so are your assumptions.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Better not talk about characters you know nothing about.
Anyway, any reason you chose me, except for Beni, Wollf or any other guys that said Plagueis wins easily?
Originally posted by darthbane77Fair enough. But keep in mind that Vaylin also relied on external help. And that the Outlander was ultimately unaffected by all the TK that she could bring to bear.
He managed to contend with her with the help of Arcann and Senya. Had the 'lander been alone in that fight, you would have a case to make. As it stands, you don't.I'm not saying the 'lander isn't incredibly powerful, I have him placed somewhat solidly over ROTJ Vader based on his feats. But he has nothing to suggest superiority to Revan.
Originally posted by Ursumeles
Yes?Okay?
Because I don't think that...
...Valkorion > Luke / Sidious
...Arcann > Malgus
...Valkorion is superior to the Ones?
...that Revan is Yoda-tier?
...Senya > Maul
...the Outlander splits with the most powerful Sith Lord, bar Sidious himself?
Originally posted by Ursumeles
If we should stop talk about things we know nothing about, you should stop talkimg about PT chars. And NJO. Actually, you should stop talking about Star Wars at all.
Originally posted by Ursumeles
Anyway, any reason you chose me, except for Beni, Wollf or any other guys that said Plagueis wins easily?