Originally posted by -K-M-
Hawkwman and Aquaman also had a brief fight in the new52 which was stopped by a pissed off Wonder Woman who punched hawkman to the ground and he was right back up. Hawkman was also shown taking shots from aquaman and being fineAnd beat don't forget in the new 52 when Lobo cut his arm off and he healed it completely in minutes
Hawkman took one hit from Aquaman in the New52 and was bloodied by it.. jeez talk about exaggerating.
There's a reason you and BB are struggling to actually.show comparable feats.
I also remember Hawkman struggling and losing against a Lobo/NuLobo who was one shotted by Supergirl. As well as being on the loosing end of a fight against Deathstroke. No amps..
Scaling like you guys have been doing goes in multiple direction. I brought up an instance where Aquaman resisted Polaris pull for 5 panels and you suggest it's irrelevant because on the 6th panel 2 vastly weaker characters than Aquaman joined in to help him. Whereas Hawkman holding Aquaman for one panel is valid. Because doublestandards. Faulty as hell ones at that.
Originally posted by beatboks
O_o how were BA's powers "shared" Oh your not talking about the sahred power of Isis (that wasn't BA's but an amp he had that was shared with others) are you??https://static4.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/30145/4058139-adam+v+hawk+1+.jpg
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https://static3.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/30145/4058144-adam+v+hawk+8.jpgReally looks like BA was depowered huh. HM can make a fight of it against him because of the ridiculous healing factor that Nth metal gives.
https://static3.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/30145/4709313-healing.jpg
Almost bled out from a slit throat to fine in a second or two once he had his Nth metal again
https://static3.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/30145/4223931-arm+injury+1.jpg
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https://static3.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/30145/4223935-arm+injury+3.jpgIn trinity his arm was almost completely severed by a shield striking it and was little more than a scar a few pages alter.
HM's healing factor is as far behind Logan's as Namor is behind Hulk in strength an durability (actually now that I think about it HM's HF is closer to Logan than Namor is to Hulk)
Very few would say that Hulk would stomp Wolvie. Win ABSOLUTELY, but not stomp.
HM is MUCH stronger than Logan.
Hm is faster than Logan.
HM has better sight than Logan and close to even on other senses.
HM has greater mobility due to flight than HM.The gap between Namor and HM is MUCH smaller than between Hulk and Wolverine and they have had several fights that went a while and therefore isn't a stomp.
If Hulk hit Wolverine with an all out punch. Fight over is the point I was making. Hulk holds back and I thing some of us expect that in a fight.
I looked in to Black Adam The dark Age and to my mistake I was wrong. Which I'll admit about Teth being weakened. Its what happens when you take someone's word as truth...
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/team-spider-man-vs-team-hawkman-valentines-day-cla-1766969/
Regardless the Teth/Hawkman fight didn't do much favors for Hawkman I'd akin it to Hulk vs Wolverine again for that illustration. Hawkman got one grab in all he did in the fight and then he got beat up. I guess it looks good though since his grapple caused Teth to strain and it shows he has pretty good durability which means lasting power. But Namor has more than Lasting power he's actually shown going toe to toe with powerhouses rather than being on the end that will eventually lose
Originally posted by EcstaticGrace
Hawkman took one hit from Aquaman in the New52 and was bloodied by it.. jeez talk about exaggerating.There's a reason you and BB are struggling to actually.show comparable feats.
I also remember Hawkman struggling and losing against a Lobo/NuLobo who was one shotted by Supergirl. As well as being on the loosing end of a fight against Deathstroke. No amps..
Scaling like you guys have been doing goes in multiple direction. I brought up an instance where Aquaman resisted Polaris pull for 5 panels and you suggest it's irrelevant because on the 6th panel 2 vastly weaker characters than Aquaman joined in to help him. Whereas Hawkman holding Aquaman for one panel is valid. Because doublestandards. Faulty as hell ones at that.
What fight you talking about? This? Where's the bloody mess?
Also to note he was shown in the same story to be grabbing with Wonder Woman and captain marvel Hah oooooo do you really want to go low showing game? As namor has some good ones
Again we did but you are simply choosing to ignore it and cry
Wait losing to supergirl is a low showing now? If you want to use abc logic that lobo actually beat and cut the head off of classic lobo who has gone toe to toe with superman. Funny you're trying to use low showings for everyone now. Keep low balling
And how long were those 5 panels? Seconds it was. How do I know as he was in the same mid sentence between all 5 panels. Keep exaggerating. You tried to use 3 people fighting superboy at the same time while aquaman and hawkman were one on one and we see aquaman struggling while superboy wasn't. You're being daft 😬
Originally posted by -K-M-
What fight you talking about? This? Where's the bloody mess?Also to note he was shown in the same story to be grabbing with Wonder Woman and captain marvel Hah oooooo do you really want to go low showing game? As namor has some good ones
Again we did but you are simply choosing to ignore it and cry
Wait losing to supergirl is a low showing now? If you want to use abc logic that lobo actually beat and cut the head off of classic lobo who has gone toe to toe with superman. Funny you're trying to use low showings for everyone now. Keep low balling
And how long were those 5 panels? Seconds it was. How do I know as he was in the same mid sentence between all 5 panels. Keep exaggerating. You tried to use 3 people fighting superboy at the same time while aquaman and hawkman were one on one and we see aquaman struggling while superboy wasn't. You're being daft 😬
Again back to scaling off of minimal scans.
Let's compare lifting feats? Lifting Utopia
Let's compare striking feats? Oneshotting Bill/Making Thanos bleed
Let's compare durability? Taking a beating from Thanos
If we look at those feats atleast if anyone reasonably did. We'd come to the conclusion that Hawkman is outclassed. He's not a class 100, he's never been near it in any continuity. The best he has is currently in the Nu52 where he's provided with versatility in regards to combat.
Your miniscule panel showings of Hawkman going a page or panel with a powerhouse isn't anything none of us haven't seen street level characters doing.
Once again you assume stats are everything. How do you explain Wolverine, Gyayson, Daredevil, ShangChi, Catman etc hanging with these characters. New52 Catman had a long fight with Aquaman. He's peak human.
Even Batman two shotted Solomon Grundy when just before the same Grundy was taking on Gotham and Gotham Girl and was getting the better of them
It's crazy how you dont grasp the simple concept. Aquaman is stronger. No question. Namor is stronger. No question, but Hawkman has a HISTORY of taking on and even beating people with superior stats then him due to his powers he does have, his vast experience and his weapons. You cant ignore that simply becase you don't like it. No one is saying Hawkman wins here, what is being debated (poorly by you) that it wouldnt be a stomp. Based on the various showings that have been posted this really is a no brainer.
Originally posted by -K-M-
Once again you assume stats are everything. How do you explain Wolverine, Gyayson, Daredevil, ShangChi, Catman etc hanging with these characters. New52 Catman had a long fight with Aquaman. He's peak human.Even Batman two shotted Solomon Grundy when just before the same Grundy was taking on Gotham and Gotham Girl and was getting the better of them
It's crazy how you dont grasp the simple concept. Aquaman is stronger. No question. Namor is stronger. No question, but Hawkman has a HISTORY of taking on and even beating people with superior stats then him due to his powers he does have, his vast experience and his weapons. You cant ignore that simply becase you don't like it. No one is saying Hawkman wins here, what is being debated (poorly by you) that it wouldnt be a stomp. Based on the various showings that have been posted this really is a no brainer.
Plot most of the time.. lol at the Catman mention. Aquaman has beaten stronger characters on land without amps. In the Gail Simone instance a writer who has no business writing Aquaman. Aquaman had the Poseidon Blessing and it was underwater (you know where all his sea allies are).
Given you think stuff like that's credible I could see the problem here.. you put to much emphasis on plot fights rather than what the character actually accomplished on their own merits. By the same logic Wonder Woman is as fast and strong as Superman because of fights. The battle forums wouldnt agree. But that's the type of logic your throwing around. That just because it happened in a fight in a story makes it credible to bring up.
The battleforums or most in general base a character of stats, and characterization, Plot is disregaeded.
Whose Hawkman beat without having to prep? With actual feats who is stronger than Namor?
Originally posted by EcstaticGrace
Again back to scaling off of minimal scans.Let's compare lifting feats? Lifting Utopia
Let's compare striking feats? Oneshotting Bill/Making Thanos bleed
Let's compare durability? Taking a beating from ThanosIf we look at those feats atleast if anyone reasonably did. We'd come to the conclusion that Hawkman is outclassed. He's not a class 100, he's never been near it in any continuity. The best he has is currently in the Nu52 where he's provided with versatility in regards to combat.
Your miniscule panel showings of Hawkman going a page or panel with a powerhouse isn't anything none of us haven't seen street level characters doing.
No HM isnt class 100 no ones saying he is.
He does however have striking power well above his 3 to 5 ton strength.
I can find the scans if necessary but with a standard nth metal mace he has stopped a car speeding at him (to run him down) with one mace strike and basically compressed the engine block into half a foot.
Thats with a mace laced with only 5% nth metal.
He has knocked out Desperos teeth with a mace strike (who can tank punches from heavy hitters)
The reason why he could kno k Superman flying and was stated to "strike with the force of a planet" is because it is both the largest and purest piece of Nth metal that exists in the DCU.
Wolverine couldnt strike Hulk with a blow that would do damage but HM could to Namor (obviosly Logan can cut Hulk with his admantium claws).
Yes Namor is stronger and has a straight up durability advantage by quite a bit but the fact is HM is capable of striking blows that can cause damage to him. HM has the speed and maneuverability advantage (he only has to think to move courtesy of Nth).
The fight would be lost by HM no doubt but he would make Namor work for it and can cause Namor Damage which is why its no stomp. You would notice that in the first page of the BA fight he hurt Adam with a mace strike (uhgn). Then the grapple was also with the mace and the force it adds. BA then destriys the mace and owns him for the rest of the fight with HM no longer having a means of actually doing damage.
BA and HM were team mates. BA knows HM and knows what Nth can do, how would Namor even know he has to take away a mace to reduce HM's attack potential ????
Originally posted by beatboks
No HM isnt class 100 no ones saying he is.
He does however have striking power well above his 3 to 5 ton strength.
I can find the scans if necessary but with a standard nth metal mace he has stopped a car speeding at him (to run him down) with one mace strike and basically compressed the engine block into half a foot.Thats with a mace laced with only 5% nth metal.
He has knocked out Desperos teeth with a mace strike (who can tank punches from heavy hitters)
The reason why he could kno k Superman flying and was stated to "strike with the force of a planet" is because it is both the largest and purest piece of Nth metal that exists in the DCU.Wolverine couldnt strike Hulk with a blow that would do damage but HM could to Namor (obviosly Logan can cut Hulk with his admantium claws).
Yes Namor is stronger and has a straight up durability advantage by quite a bit but the fact is HM is capable of striking blows that can cause damage to him. HM has the speed and maneuverability advantage (he only has to think to move courtesy of Nth).
The fight would be lost by HM no doubt but he would make Namor work for it and can cause Namor Damage which is why its no stomp. You would notice that in the first page of the BA fight he hurt Adam with a mace strike (uhgn). Then the grapple was also with the mace and the force it adds. BA then destriys the mace and owns him for the rest of the fight with HM no longer having a means of actually doing damage.
BA and HM were team mates. BA knows HM and knows what Nth can do, how would Namor even know he has to take away a mace to reduce HM's attack potential ????
Pretty sure the Claw of Horus was the reason he was able to do that to Superman which isn't standard gear. Wasn't Superman also being feint about it and was up through next page? Could be wrong.
I mistook your intentions. My point was that Hawkman doesn't hang with powerhouses in the regard that he can brawl it out with them for extended periods of time. I agree his damage Output with his weapons is impressive. But making someone bleed or say ow. Isn't comparable to getting draws with powerhouses like Hercules or having wins against characters like the Hulk.
I honestly feel like a forum fight with Teth vs Carter would be a stomp. Speed advantage, mainly being the reason which is ignored in a story where their meant to fight.
