Supergirl Vs General Zod

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
You just answered yourself. In contradicts everything else. And you were happy to label the Bulldozer feat "hearsay", so what evidence is there that the SHIELD instructor was lying? Nothing shown or stated on the show (I eventually got around to watching that episode).

Both feats in question contradict other consistent shown feats by the characters. The weight of the key, as well as Cap's completion of the bulldozer, rest squarely on the word of onscreen individuals, with no other evidence supporting either notion.

But anyway, just agree to the mod ruling about the usability of the feat, and we can move past this. Whether it goes in your favour or ours, at least we can move on with the discussion from there on. Because this is getting tiresome, and I am losing interest in continuing at this point.

To motivate him.
I took the scene naturally as he was lying on purpose to get him to push harder.

Whether we use the key feat or not doesn't change a person's opinion about it.
If I think SG wins for various reasons and you think Thor wins then that is our opinion.

Anyway, I hinted a billion times that we don't have to use the feat due to being an extreme outlier. I asked for agreement from multiple people (not one) so that we can all be on the same page.

With that said, imo SG by definition is suppose to have superspeed and reflexes.
Feats just determine the level of them. Some here are assuming she will fight and operate at human level speeds and reflexes. This is where I greatly disagree.

So, do you agree to get a mod ruling?

Originally posted by h1a8
To motivate him.
I took the scene naturally as he was lying on purpose to get him to push harder.

You have zero onscreen proof that he was lying. You barely seem to have any actual knowledge about the show (you openly admitted that you weren't even aware of the feat in question until it got brought up), so your personal interpretation of what SHIELD instructors would and would not do to motivate someone is irrelevant. You are now guilty of what you were accusing others of i.e. making things up.

Originally posted by h1a8

Whether we use the key feat or not doesn't change a person's opinion about it.
If I think SG wins for various reasons and you think Thor wins then that is our opinion.

Anyway, I hinted a billion times that we don't have to use the feat due to being an extreme outlier. I asked for agreement from multiple people (not one) so that we can all be on the same page.

With that said, imo SG by definition is suppose to have superspeed and reflexes.
Feats just determine the level of them. Some here are assuming she will fight and operate at human level speeds and reflexes. This is where I greatly disagree.

A. This is Versus Zod. Go argue about Thor in the other thread.

B. Then stop going on about the key already. People have made it repeatedly obvious that they don't consider the key feat as being viable representation for these threads, yet you keep bringing it up.

C. The way they portray her superspeed in combat does not align with how you are talking it up. I have already pointed out that the writers do include it in some fights, but they never portray the "opponent frozen" perspective, like they do with proper CW Speedsters. She uses it more akin to how MoS Kryptonians do, like Faora used hers.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller

C. The way they portray her superspeed in combat does not align with how you are talking it up. I have already pointed out that the writers do include it in some fights, but they never portray the "opponent frozen" perspective, like they do with proper CW Speedsters. She uses it more akin to how MoS Kryptonians do, like Faora used hers.

Hmm only issue with this is she's raced Flash twice now.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Hmm only issue with this is she's raced Flash twice now.

First time they were just running in an open field. So, it was simply a situation of propelling her limbs in a direction at a fast enough speed (which, as I have pointed out, the writers do make use of in some of her fights). Second time she was using flight. DCEU Clark can fly at similar, if not greater, speeds, yet he doesn't perceive the world in Speedster slowmo either.

And another indicator is how they perceive the world outside of combat as well. For example, when Barry types on a computer, or reads a book, he does it at superspeed. Kara does not.

^ Although when she raced Barry on foot, she did also chuck him mid-race.

And chasing Barry while flying must require reflexes to stop and turn when Barry does without smashing into buildings.

Personally I just think they just beef up her speed when Barry's around. But nonetheless it's canon.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
^ Although when she raced Barry on foot, she did also chuck him mid-race.

And chasing Barry while flying must require reflexes to stop and turn when Barry does without smashing into buildings.

Personally I just think they just beef up her speed when Barry's around. But nonetheless it's canon.

Characters being able to fly and maneuver rapidly while airborne doesn't really translate to combat reflexes. Otherwise, Chris Evans Human Torch would have some of the best combat reflexes around, seeing as he was keeping up with the Silver Surfer, despite the fact that the Surfer could just phase through any obstacle in his way, whereas Johnny had to go around/take evasive actions. She also didn't always follow the same routes he did during flight. He had to stick to the ground, duck in between obstacles etc. whereas she could just zip through clear air a lot of the time. Also, again, DCEU Superman had to zip in between buildings when pursuing Zod during their end MoS fight but, even based just on the JLA trailers alone, we can already see that that Flash's speed and perception of time is depicted a lot differently to Clark's.

And her actual combat use of superspeed is also canon, which paints a different picture to characters like Flash, and more akin to DCEU Kryptonians. But even that could be useful, because she could still theoretically do things like a superspeed shouldercharge or similar.

Race car drivers and jet fighter pilots also travel at very high speeds and can maneuver at those high speeds. Doesn't mean they have the reflexes of a boxer or can do very fast drum rolls like a professional drummer.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Race car drivers and jet fighter pilots also travel at very high speeds and can maneuver at those high speeds. Doesn't mean they have the reflexes of a boxer or can do very fast drum rolls like a professional drummer.

Pretty much. Just like skilled drummers or boxers wouldn't necessarily be able to fly/drive at high speeds with the same proficiency as professional racers/pilots. There are multiple factors, such as different mental processes, motions, muscle groups utilised etc. that come into play.

You guys are forgetting Distance?

It completes the equation and determines time.
Speed alone is irrelevant.
For example, if I were traveling at 1000 times the speed of light in space then I easily have the reflexes to avoid the Sun. That's because the distance is so large.

But moving fast while maneuvering and reacting in small distances shows reflex speed. So all the examples you guys gave are irrelevant.
SG has maneuvered and reacted in small distances while moving fast.

SG also has done multiple tasks in superspeed (like change into SG, perform various tasks for Ally McBeal, etc).

Originally posted by h1a8
You guys are forgetting Distance?

It completes the equation and determines time.
Speed alone is irrelevant.
For example, if I were traveling at 1000 times the speed of light in space then I easily have the reflexes to avoid the Sun. That's because the distance is so large.

But moving fast while maneuvering and reacting in small distances shows reflex speed. So all the examples you guys gave are irrelevant.
SG has maneuvered and reacted in small distances while moving fast.

SG also has done multiple tasks in superspeed (like change into SG, perform various tasks for Ally McBeal, etc).

Show her fighting at superspeed.