Oberyn Martell vs Baleman w/katana

IOW, I was right.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Now I'm not hugely knowledgeable about spears, but why is that? He's considerably stronger than Oberyn. I still think he loses because Baleman's swordfighting feats are fairly questionable, but why couldn't he parry the spear?

1. A spear has more mass and is actually very hard to parry with a sword.
2. A katana has a brittle blade, at least in comparison to most western weapons. He tries to parry with it one too many times he'll end up with a bent katana at best, a broken katana at worst.
3. Name me a time that Baleman actually parried something as powerful as a spear.

Originally posted by Silent Master
As I said in the other thread, Batman and Superman have always had some of the worst Fanboys out there, they just refuse to be unbiased when discussing anything about them

I hate Baleman. He's the worst Batman aside from Clooney. Oberyn just sucks and if you're entire argument is the choreography than Oberyn is far worse than Baleman.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Everyone here agrees that Oberyn was not going all out against Gregor. Seems to me you just don't want to admit it.

Well, if a bunch of people on a forum agree then it's gotta be true.

Oberyn beat the most feared warrior in the Seven Kingdoms, all while holding back because he wanted him to admit he murdered his family instead of killing him when he had the chance several times. He only got killed himself because he got really cocky in the end and underestimated just how much strength and hate Gregor had.

Batman used a sword for 30 seconds and was on the retreat, barely surviving that entire fight before an explosion saved him.

Originally posted by Psychotron

Well, if a bunch of people on a forum agree then it's gotta be true.

Or if everybody else sees blue but one guy insists it's red, guess who's probably color blind?

That's not how color blindness works.

But...if everybody saw the right colors and you're the only one who sees something different...you probably are colorblind.

That is relative. I know a lot of people who think the Viper/Mountain fight choreography was horrible.

Originally posted by Psychotron
That is relative. I know a lot of people who think the Viper/Mountain fight choreography was horrible.

Oh it was horrible, just so happens it's better than any any choreography in the TDK trilogy.

Originally posted by Psychotron
That's not how color blindness works.

I see you're trying to evade the point.

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. A spear has more mass and is actually very hard to parry with a sword.
2. A katana has a brittle blade, at least in comparison to most western weapons. He tries to parry with it one too many times he'll end up with a bent katana at best, a broken katana at worst.
3. Name me a time that Baleman actually parried something as powerful as a spear.

Not so sure about that. Outright stop with a sword, yes, very hard. Parrying is a matter of catching the spear haft with the flat of the sword and redirecting the force and momentum to a left or right angle away from oneself.

Not so sure about that either, a Katana while considerably thinner than say a standard European long sword, is more flexible and will bend more before it breaks compared to its stouter Euro counterparts. eg I've seen slow-mo footage of katanas cutting through animal carcasses and the amount of flexing they do without breaking is rather impressive. To the point you're left thinking "how did it not break?" This has to do with the methods of heating/folding the Japanese smiths use.

I don't think you need any degree of exceptionally high strength to parry/deflect a spear thrust, it's more a matter of having the skill to do it properly.

Originally posted by Robtard
Not so sure about that. Outright stop with a sword, yes, very hard. Parrying is a matter of catching the spear haft with the flat of the sword and redirecting the force and momentum to a left or right angle away from oneself.

Not so sure about that either, a Katana while considerably thinner than say a standard European long sword, is more flexible and will bend more before it breaks compared to its stouter Euro counterparts. eg I've seen slow-mo footage of katanas cutting through animal carcasses and the amount of flexing they do without breaking is rather impressive. To the point you're left thinking "how did it not break?" This has to do with the methods of heating/folding the Japanese smiths use.

I don't think you need any degree of exceptionally high strength to parry/deflect a spear thrust, it's more a matter of having the skill to do it properly.

I practice HEMA, so this is one topic (asides from archery) that I'm fairly versed at.

A longsword's blade (and other European blades) are very springy. You can bend them along the flat and they spring back into shape. A katana's blade is very stiff. It can bend but only to a very slight degree, otherwise it won't be able to spring back into shape. That said, every single steel sword will have a degree of flex to them. But as taught in kenjutsu, they try not to parry too much and instead focus on dodging attacks, simply because katanas are fragile and can easily bend or break of you block with it too much.

As far as spears go, a spear has enough mass to puncture plate armor if properly utilized. A sword has no hope of penetrating plate. That alone should tell you of the difference in mass. Yes, there are ways you can parry and deflect a spear with your sword but it's very difficult because, again, the spear has a lot of mass plus the spear wielder can stay out of range and keep sniping his opponent. It will take a very skilled swordsman, one who is much more skilled than the arrow wielder, to be able to close the gap and win. In a sense you're right, it's not exactly a matter of muscular strength that will make you parry the spear, though strength is always an advantage. You'll need very good skill, very powerful movements, very exact timing and placement of blade for leverage, and a pretty strong sword. All of which I'm not convinced Baleman has.

You can search any spear vs. sword video on youtube. There's a bunch of HEMA practicioners who cross-spar (and a few naginata vs. shinai as well). You'll see what I mean.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I see you're trying to evade the point.

I'm not, I already explained why a guy who can beat the shit out of groups of armed mercs, SWAT teams, thugs, etc is superior to a guy who can do flips and needs poison and luck to beat a big slow guy who can barely swing his sword.

But you're going to ignore that Batman used a Katana for 30 seconds. And all he did was barely block a few sword swings and run away until an explosion and a falling chunk of ceiling killed Ra's Decoy.

So he has no actual feats with the sword.

He can throw the nip sword away for all I care.

Originally posted by Psychotron
He can throw the nip sword away for all I care.

What you care doesn't matter here. Only thing that matters is OP.

OP says it's Batman in leather armor with a Katana. Vs Obery in leather armor with his spear.

So Bruce doesn't have any protection. Has a massive reach advantage. Has literally no showings with his weapon, while Oberyn is known as the best spear-fighter in the world and one of the best fighters in all of Westeros.

There's no throwing his weapon away. He has to use what OP says.

So Bruce loses. Because despite what you think, being awesome in one category doesn't make you awesome in another. The worlds top ranked sniper would not have that same level of efficiency in a fist fight for example.

And just because Bruce is somewhat decent in h2h(even though he gets beat up by Joker and random goons), he's got nothing with a blade. Not against Oberyn especially.

Originally posted by Psychotron
I'm not, I already explained why a guy who can beat the shit out of groups of armed mercs, SWAT teams, thugs, etc is superior to a guy who can do flips and needs poison and luck to beat a big slow guy who can barely swing his sword.

Armed mercs and thugs who fall down without even getting hit. Who all move far slower than Gregor. Heck, even I can beat up armed mercs as long as they fall down on their own.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Armed mercs and thugs who fall down without even getting hit. Who all move far slower than Gregor. Heck, even I can beat up armed mercs as long as they fall down on their own.

Damn, then I guess he stomps. He knocks Oberyn out without even needing to touch him before stabbing his neck. Flawless victory. 👆

Originally posted by NemeBro
Wait, so Baleman has telekinesis now? He can down people without even touching him, based on this "choreography rules all" concept?

Damn, then I guess he stomps. He knocks Oberyn out without even needing to touch him before stabbing his neck. Flawless victory. 👆

Or.... it just so happens that in the world Baleman lives, fighters just aren't that tough. They faint at the sight of violence. It's a bit more plausible than telekinesis.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Or.... it just so happens that in the world Baleman lives, fighters just aren't that tough. They faint at the sight of violence. It's a bit more plausible than telekinesis.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Or.... it just so happens that in the world Baleman lives, fighters just aren't that tough. They faint at the sight of violence. It's a bit more plausible than telekinesis.

An old Baleman has beaten Bane, and we all know that infamous collum feat. And he didn't need poison to do it either.