Snoke and the First Order

This excerpt gives a bit of insight into the origins of the First Order, along with Snoke:

"Snoke knew he himself was an unlikely fulcrum, just about the furthest thing from what the tattered remnants of Palpatine's Empire had imagined as a leader. The admirals and generals who'd survived the fury of the Empire's implosion and the New Republic's wrath had envisioned being led by someone else, anyone else: pitiless, devious Gallius Rax; dutiful, cautious Rae Sloane; the slippery political fanatic Ormes Apolin; or even an unhinged but ambitious military architect such as Brendol Hux. All of those would-be leaders had been co-opted, sidelined, or destroyed, leaving only Armitage Hux, the mad son of a mad father. And that one was but a mouthpiece, a miscast tinkerer whose rantings could only persuade the sort of rabble who blindly worshipped rage and lunatic certainty. Though galactic history would record it differently -Snoke would see to that- the evolution of the First Order had been more improvisation than master plan. That was another element visions tended to miss. Palpatine had engineered the Contingency to simultaneously destroy his Empire and ensure its rebirth, ruthlessly winnowing its ranks and rebuilding them with who and what survived. The rebuilding was to take place in the Unknown Regions, secretly explored by Imperial scouts and seeded with shipyards, laboratories, and storehouses--an enormously expensive effort that had taken decades, and been kept hidden from all but the elect. But the Imperial refugees' military preparations had been insufficient bulwarks against the terrors of the Unknown Regions. Grasping in the dark among strange stars, they had come perilously close to destruction, and it had not been military might that saved them. It had been knowledge--Snoke's knowledge. Which, ironically, led back to Palpatine and his secrets. Palpatine's true identity as Darth Sidious, heir to the Sith, had been an even greater secret than the Contingency. And the Empire's explorations into the Unknown Regions had served both aspects of its ruler. For Sidious knew that the galaxy's knowledge of the Force had come from those long-abandoned, half-legendary star systems, and that great truths awaited rediscovery among them. Truths that Snoke had learned and made to serve his own ends."

-TLJ

Evidently Palpatine had a contingency-plan for just about everything. 👆

Ahh Sheev; A cautious man and a meticulous planner. Just like me 🙂

Mas Amedda is Snoke.

"ORDER! WE SHALL HAVE ORDER!"

Nothing new, but OH is it satisfying to have it concisely placed in a canon text like this.

I need to get that book.

Here's a breakdown of the quote:

Snoke knew he himself was an unlikely fulcrum, just about the furthest thing from what the tattered remnants of Palpatine's Empire had imagined as a leader.

Snoke himself believed that he was not a fit ruler of the first order

The admirals and generals who'd survived the fury of the Empire's implosion and the New Republic's wrath had envisioned being led by someone else, anyone else: pitiless, devious Gallius Rax; dutiful, cautious Rae Sloane; the slippery political fanatic Ormes Apolin; or even an unhinged but ambitious military architect such as Brendol Hux. All of those would-be leaders had been co-opted, sidelined, or destroyed, leaving only Armitage Hux, the mad son of a mad father. And that one was but a mouthpiece, a miscast tinkerer whose rantings could only persuade the sort of rabble who blindly worshipped rage and lunatic certainty.

We knew this already

Though galactic history would record it differently -Snoke would see to that- the evolution of the First Order had been more improvisation than master plan.

Snoke was trying to implement revisionist history, and what the first order became was through the series of coincidences which added to Palpatine's bare-bones plan.

That was another element visions tended to miss. Palpatine had engineered the Contingency to simultaneously destroy his Empire and ensure its rebirth, ruthlessly winnowing its ranks and rebuilding them with who and what survived.

We already knew that

The rebuilding was to take place in the Unknown Regions, secretly explored by Imperial scouts and seeded with shipyards, laboratories, and storehouses--an enormously expensive effort that had taken decades, and been kept hidden from all but the elect.

we already knew that
(Although shipyards, laboratories, and storehouses is something to keep in mind and look out for)

But the Imperial refugees' military preparations had been insufficient bulwarks against the terrors of the Unknown Regions.

There are terrors in the unknown regions which even imperial military could not fight against

Grasping in the dark among strange stars, they had come perilously close to destruction, and it had not been military might that saved them.

"The dark" may refer to the dark side of the Force, implying that the "terrors" from the unknown regions are in fact related to the dark side of the force. We may be dealing with Force Demons, or Lovecraftian beings. Possibly even just nexuses or energies/ghosts/spirits of the dark side, some things not quite sentient but still with a will to harm.

It had been knowledge--Snoke's knowledge. Which, ironically, led back to Palpatine and his secrets.

Snoke has knowledge which can save people from terrors (potentially of the force) so powerful that even imperial military can't deal with them. And Palpatine knew about the existence of these secrets, and was on the verge of discovering them. Remember that Sidious had calls from the unknown regions that only he could hear. So more dark side knowledge in the new canon. I like it.

Palpatine's true identity as Darth Sidious, heir to the Sith, had been an even greater secret than the Contingency.

We already knew this

And the Empire's explorations into the Unknown Regions had served both aspects of its ruler.

Confirmation on the fact that Sidious went into the Unknown Regions both because he wanted the Empire to live on if it was ever destroyed, and because he wanted secrets of the dark side which he knew existed

For Sidious knew that the galaxy's knowledge of the Force had come from those long-abandoned, half-legendary star systems, and that great truths awaited rediscovery among them.

The unknown regions were home to abandoned, half-legendary star systems which knew secrets which had been lost to time. May explain the "Terrors" which haunt this region. The knowledge of the Force was introuced to the galaxy from these star systems, and Sidious knew this.

Truths that Snoke had learned and made to serve his own ends

Snoke knows what Sidious wanted to know

Originally posted by Zentrex
But the Imperial refugees' military preparations had been insufficient bulwarks against the terrors of the Unknown Regions.

There are terrors in the unknown regions which even imperial military could not fight against

Originally posted by Zentrex
Grasping in the dark among strange stars, they had come perilously close to destruction, and it had not been military might that saved them.

"The dark" may refer to the dark side of the Force, implying that the "terrors" from the unknown regions are in fact related to the dark side of the force. We may be dealing with Force Demons, or Lovecraftian beings. Possibly even just nexuses or energies/ghosts/spirits of the dark side, some things not quite sentient but still with a will to harm.

I did see a sentence on wookiepedia sourced to the star wars databanks which said that Thrawn was one of the biggest reasons the Imperials managed to survive as long as they did.

As for the Yuuzhan Vong...I don't know. You think they'd introduce something like that? I mean, there is a precedence for them, but it's an old idea, and kind of a crazy one. Force Demons, or hell even something completely new which we've never seen before would satisfy me more.
But...if it is indeed the Yuuzhan Vong, then what kind of secrets does Snoke know which allowed him to hold them back? That could make for a VERY interesting line of story to go down.

And yeah, you're right about the whole "dark" line.

Originally posted by Zentrex
I did see a sentence on wookiepedia sourced to the star wars databanks which said that Thrawn was one of the biggest reasons the Imperials managed to survive as long as they did.

Originally posted by Zentrex
As for the Yuuzhan Vong...I don't know. You think they'd introduce something like that? I mean, there is a precedence for them, but it's an old idea, and kind of a crazy one.

Filoni: "This is a scout ship that was trying to assess the strength of the Republic and who the Jedi were... I started to explore some of the armor... We never got that far."

...Obviously that plot/reveal was never fleshed-out(TCW ended prematurely), but I won't at all be surprised if the Vong appear in canon at some point in the near future -- especially with all this emphasis on the Unknown Regions. /shrug

Originally posted by Zentrex
But...if it is indeed the Yuuzhan Vong, then what kind of secrets does Snoke know which allowed him to hold them back? That could make for a VERY interesting line of story to go down.

Woah! Now I'm even more curious. I'll keep an eye out for any Yuuzhan Vong related concepts in the new canon.

I wish Filoni would get the good stuff out at the start of his shows before they get cancelled. Now we begin in a new era to a show that ends prematurely...

I can see Obi-Wan saying: "Fight with me, sons of the Republic! For Coruscant, for Endor, for Kashyyyk."

I think the dark things could simply be the navigation of the UR itself. Extremely dangerous even if mapped out.

Originally posted by Freedon Nadd
I can see Obi-Wan saying: "Fight with me, sons of the Republic! For Coruscant, for Endor, for Kashyyyk."

can you really?

It had been knowledge--Snoke's knowledge. Which, ironically, led back to Palpatine and his secrets. Palpatine's true identity as Darth Sidious, heir to the Sith, had been an even greater secret than the Contingency. And the Empire's explorations into the Unknown Regions had served both aspects of its ruler. For Sidious knew that the galaxy's knowledge of the Force had come from those long-abandoned, half-legendary star systems, and that great truths awaited rediscovery among them. Truths that Snoke had learned and made to serve his own ends."

-TLJ

^ 👆

It was Snoke's knowledge/power that saved the First Order from being obliterated by the "terrors" in the Unknown Regions... But now he's dead. What a twist it would be if some of those terrors started to return upon sensing his death. mmm

Originally posted by NewGuy01
can you really?

Ok, we leave Kashyyyk out of this because Mundi.

The novel also states that Snoke essentially masterminded Luke's downfall, just to remove him from play:

"One obstacle had stood in his way--Skywalker. Who had been wise enough not to rebuild the Jedi Order, dismissing it as the sclerotic, self-perpetuating debating society it had become in its death throes. Instead, the last Jedi had sought to understand the origins of the faith, and the larger truths behind it. Like his father, Skywalker had been a favored instrument of the will of the Cosmic Force. That made it essential to watch him. And once Skywalker endangered Snoke's design, it had become essential to act. And so Snoke had drawn upon his vast store of knowledge, parceling it out to confuse Skywalker's path, ensnare his family, and harness Ben Solo's powers to ensure both Skywalker's destruction and Snoke's triumph. Now the endgame he had foreseen was at hand."

-TLJ

Originally posted by Galan007
^ 👆

It was Snoke's knowledge/power that saved the First Order from being obliterated by the "terrors" in the Unknown Regions... But now he's dead. What a twist it would be if some of those terrors started to return upon sensing his death. mmm

Originally posted by Galan007
The novel also states that Snoke essentially masterminded Luke's downfall, just to remove him from play:

came true.

Did Snoke plan on dying?

The novel certainly leaves that open to interpretation, imo.

Tbh, Snoke's 'death'(still not entirely convinced that he's perma-dead, tbh) may have even been his way of "completing" Kylo's training, as he mentioned at the end of TFA. After all, the recent novelization also made it abundantly clear that Snoke's TP mastery was vastly superior to Kylo's:

"Rey could feel Snoke in her head, his consciousness a live, hungry thing, carelessly sifting and sorting through what wasn't his, what he had no right to. The Supreme Leader must have taught Kylo this ability, she realized. But he was far more skilled than his apprentice. Rey was unable to push back against him--his mere presence threatened to overwhelm her. And unlike with Kylo, she had no sense of that mind being left open to her. Snoke's presence felt like a pit, empty and cold and dark--as if the dark-side cave beneath Ahch-To had gone on forever."

-TLJ

...So the notion that Kylo could truly hide something from Snoke does seem a bit...inconsistent. /shrug