Thor/Bill/Jane vs HP Doomsday

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Entropy works against DD, not because of the power level (i.e. the energy levels) but because of what it is (DD is being attacked by the literal end of all things).

Equating slamming two Mjolnirs together isn't quite the same. No doubt, 100% agree, it's powerful. But it doesn't mean it works because of it's power levels.

But since DD has yet to encounter it, he has no special defense against this amount of power either. If we chose to think about it in the way that you are putting it, it would mean that anything other than the casual blast that reduced this same DD to bones would have no effect against him.

I would agree with you if we were talking about much weaker forces, but to rule out the possibility of these forces defeating him when we know that he has yet to encounter them, seems a little biased to me, unless you actually do believe that there is a possibility that they could defeat him? That's what this pretty much boils down to. We already know that there are Mid Meta's capable of defeating High Heralds based off of power set. Thor and Superman defy the odds all of the time, which is why I give them a strong possibility of being able to harm DD, but like I was trying to say, if nothing other than entropy can hurt DD then that's fine as well. No biggie.

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
You're acting as if Jane hasn't hurt Mangog, or Bill cracking Galan armor, or Thor beating Odin level beings before

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
How did vibran8um stop the stone when it was unraveling his armor in the scan ?
The vibranium didn't stop the stone until after the explosion.

we see the Vibranium not stop it as it unravels on his arm and only takes his armor .

Originally posted by Stoic
I'm thinking that the expectation is that Thor/Jane/Bill are supposed to fight like the rest of the JL without taking into account that they never ever need to get close to DD in order to burn the flesh off of him. DD has never once faced this kind of power, and thus he would have no defense against it.

Then we have people saying that Darkseid was a Sky Father, when he was a peer of Orion's in terms of power, which automatically launches Orion up into the Sky Father ranks without warrant, and since Superman can beat the shit out of either, it launches him even higher. What does that say about Wonder Woman recently doing better than Zeus against Darkseid if we choose to ignore context?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Right, nobody in JLA has feats like that.
Maybe because you know, the comic directly states it.
When was Orion ever a peer of Darkseid? Darkseid has manhandled Orion with one hand and koed him with just a wave of his hands.

When Orion went power crazy what did he turn around and do to Darkseid? And then we have Superman unleashed beating the mess out of Darkseid, and Thor evenly competing against Odin well before the latest Secret Wars printed when Odin fought Thor while in disguise. Orion was said to be a peer of Darkseid during DOTNG, and even though it became non canon, it still saw print, and was considered canon briefly. The bugs in that story was the cause of the nullification. Not the power level.

My point is this, they all rise to the occasion when plot calls for it. Thor survived attacks from beings that should have erased him in the first assault, and yet there we saw him Hyperion, and Starbrand doing the impossible against the Ivory King (Beyonders). We aren't taking about Captain America, Daredevil, Wolverine, Spiderman, and Iron Man attempting to stop Doomsday here. I personally have no problem saying that 2 God Blasts, and the Mother Storm may be able to turn DD to bones, because he has never encountered those types of forces, but to argue as if it were impossible seems extremely biased to me. They aren't hitting him with a shower head that was shooting out warm water. This is a significant amount of power that we are talking about.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Right, nobody in JLA has feats like that.
Maybe because you know, the comic directly states it.
When was Orion ever a peer of Darkseid? Darkseid has manhandled Orion with one hand and koed him with just a wave of his hands.

show where the comic directly states it

Originally posted by Stoic
When Orion went power crazy what did he turn around and do to Darkseid? And then we have Superman unleashed beating the mess out of Darkseid, and Thor evenly competing against Odin well before the latest Secret Wars printed when Odin fought Thor while in disguise. Orion was said to be a peer of Darkseid during DOTNG, and even though it became non canon, it still saw print, and was considered canon briefly. The bugs in that story was the cause of the nullification. Not the power level.

Orion was never a peer of Darkseid in DOTNG or anything.

What are you talking about?

My point is this, they all rise to the occasion when plot calls for it. Thor survived attacks from beings that should have erased him in the first assault, and yet there we saw him Hyperion, and Starbrand doing the impossible against the Ivory King (Beyonders). We aren't taking about Captain America, Daredevil, Wolverine, Spiderman, and Iron Man attempting to stop Doomsday here. I personally have no problem saying that 2 God Blasts, and the Mother Storm may be able to turn DD to bones, because he has never encountered those types of forces, but to argue as if it were impossible seems extremely biased to me. They aren't hitting him with a shower head that was shooting out warm water. This is a significant amount of power that we are talking about.

So is JLA and Doomsday steamrolled the team.

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
show where the comic directly states it

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/102593/4037302-07-03-2012-05.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/102593/4037303-07-03-2012-12.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/102593/4037304-07-03-2012-13.jpg

Thor had to retreat first and even with vibranium protecting him, he got KTFO.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Sure.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/102593/4037302-07-03-2012-05.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/102593/4037303-07-03-2012-12.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/102593/4037304-07-03-2012-13.jpg

Thor had to retreat first and even with vibranium protecting him, he got KTFO.

What? we literally see it explode in his face prior, and he still survived regardless of being Ko'ed

He retreated to get the vibranium cell to hold the stone, it wasn't for his own protection. The entire point of the vibranium cell is to hold the stone

Getting Ko'ed from something that was gonna unravel all creation as opposed to a regular universal attack isnt an low showings since he shoudl be spagettified like his armor was

Originally posted by abhilegend
But you said it was irrelevant against Loki, how is it suddenly relevant here?

Due to the paradoxical nature of two different timeline mjolnirs brought together.

Get it, halfwit Thorbag?

Gorr wasn't beaten by the two mjolnirs. The God bomb was absorbed by Thor using mjolnirs.

No space/time ruptured there. And it was literally said to be a time paradox.

My man, I can't keep correcting you every time you misread my post. Go back and re-read what I said. I said they don't have the expertise of Jane and Thor, and so, their performance is irrelevant.

Yes, AGAINST KANG, they used two Mjolnir's to weaponize a time paradox to defeat him.

In a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT COMIC, banging two Mjolnir's was also used to defeat Ultron Prime by summoning the primordial lighting that created the Universe:
https://imgur.com/QR3sIaV

I'm not saying he'll do the former, but the latter if that was the tactic they used to hang two hammers. Ultimately, my point here is that there is more than enough combined fire power here to put Doomsday down for a win.

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Thor resisted the unbinding stone which unknits all of creation soon as it's activated, it even devoured time itself.

it only managed to destroy Thor's armor around his arms before being deactivated.

Originally posted by abhilegend
facepalm

Thor had vibranium which stopped the stone. Context really doesn't matters at comicvine, does it?

His point was that Thor got close enough to trap the stone in the first place, an object which was devouring reality and time. I think. I hope. No idea who this sock is.

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
What? we literally see it explode in his face prior, and he still survived regardless of being Ko'ed

He retreated to get the vibranium cell to hold the stone, it wasn't for his own protection. The entire point of the vibranium cell is to hold the stone

Getting Ko'ed from something that was gonna unravel all creation as opposed to a regular universal attack isnt an low showings since he shoudl be spagettified like his armor was

hmmmmm.....who are you?

Much like Molecule Man, all Marks or Marcuses (Marcusi) are the same throughout the world. Much like the spelling can vary, so too can their appearances, but never who they are inside. Trust me, if you've met one Marc you've met them all. It's almost like a hivemind of people but they aren't actually connected mentally or emotionally, they just are the same. One of nature's mysteries.

Hes the hero KMC needs. Not the one that it deserves, but the one it needs.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Orion was never a peer of Darkseid in DOTNG or anything.

What are you talking about?

So is JLA and Doomsday steamrolled the team.

Darkseid said that Orion and Superman were his peers. Best go back and read that again. It made print. Not the point either, so no point in following that discussion to it's conclusion.

The Thor's possess enough power among them to remain out of DD's range, and blast the flesh off of him without people calling PIS if it happened in a comic.

This is hardly an outlandish conclusion to come to.

Originally posted by Stoic
But since DD has yet to encounter it, he has no special defense against this amount of power either. If we chose to think about it in the way that you are putting it, it would mean that anything other than the casual blast that reduced this same DD to bones would have no effect against him.

I would agree with you if we were talking about much weaker forces, but to rule out the possibility of these forces defeating him when we know that he has yet to encounter them, seems a little biased to me, unless you actually do believe that there is a possibility that they could defeat him? That's what this pretty much boils down to. We already know that there are Mid Meta's capable of defeating High Heralds based off of power set. Thor and Superman defy the odds all of the time, which is why I give them a strong possibility of being able to harm DD, but like I was trying to say, if nothing other than entropy can hurt DD then that's fine as well. No biggie.

Then you'd need to prove it was casual.

As for this level of power, Doomsday has faced a Kamikaze guardian who tore a hole in spacetime and the Omega beams.

The instant his GL ring got destroyed, was the instance the guardian kamikazed and exploded, so it wasn't as if he had the ring protecting him either.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Then you'd need to prove it was casual.

As for this level of power, Doomsday has faced a Kamikaze guardian who tore a hole in spacetime and the Omega beams.

The instant his GL ring got destroyed, was the instance the guardian kamikazed and exploded, so it wasn't as if he had the ring protecting him either.

That's faulty reasoning on your part, because we have no idea how much power it takes to tear apart the space time continuum.

Nor do we know how much power the GL hit with which resulted in his destruction.

Grey Hulk tore a hole into space time, but we can't begin to calculate the amount of force it took for him to do that.

On the other hand we've had years of examples on how powerful a God blast can be, and more recently we witnessed how powerful the Mother Storm was.

DD has never encountered this type of power. He has no specialized defense against it. You seem to be saying that no force outside of entropy can put DD down.

Is this what you are saying? If so then you are also saying that all 3 attacks from these Thor's would be impossible to stop DD. If so I disagree.

Originally posted by Stoic
That's faulty reasoning on your part, because we have no idea how much power it takes to tear apart the space time continuum.

Nor do we know how much power the GL hit with which resulted in his destruction.

Grey Hulk tore a hole into space time, but we can't begin to calculate the amount of force it took for him to do that.

On the other hand we've had years of examples on how powerful a God blast can be, and more recently we witnessed how powerful the Mother Storm was.

DD has never encountered this type of power. He has no specialized defense against it. You seem to be saying that no force outside of entropy can put DD down.

Is this what you are saying? If so then you are also saying that all 3 attacks from these Thor's would be impossible to stop DD. If so I disagree.

SERIOUSLYYYYYYYY?

Superman lifted infinity before as well. Lets not pretend that these outliner don't exist for the DC character. For every idiotic "universal" feat that Thor has, there is one for Superman.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
SERIOUSLY?

SERIOUSLYYYYYYYY?

Superman lifted infinity before as well. Lets not pretend that these outliner don't exist for the DC character. For every idiotic "universal" feat that Thor has, there is one for Superman.

I agree with this, which is why, I personally don't think Thor's going to beat Doomsday (I say personally, because I didn't even read Stoic's post, and if you except me to, shame on you) with some ridiculously powerful lightning bolt or hammer throw that happens 1 out of 100 times, but with something like a God blast or two Mjolnir's, that are consistently portrayed on a level necessary to win.

For example, if every time Hulk's nipples were drawn hard, he was Multiversal in strength, I'd argue he'd outwrestle Odin every time there was a light breeze.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Then you'd need to prove it was casual.

As for this level of power, Doomsday has faced a Kamikaze guardian who tore a hole in spacetime and the Omega beams.

The instant his GL ring got destroyed, was the instance the guardian kamikazed and exploded, so it wasn't as if he had the ring protecting him either.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
SERIOUSLY?

SERIOUSLYYYYYYYY?

Superman lifted infinity before as well. Lets not pretend that these outliner don't exist for the DC character. For every idiotic "universal" feat that Thor has, there is one for Superman.

Name these universal fts. I'm lost. Guide me my friend.

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
What? we literally see it explode in his face prior, and he still survived regardless of being Ko'ed

He retreated to get the vibranium cell to hold the stone, it wasn't for his own protection. The entire point of the vibranium cell is to hold the stone

Getting Ko'ed from something that was gonna unravel all creation as opposed to a regular universal attack isnt an low showings since he shoudl be spagettified like his armor was

He was koed even protected by the vibranium. What else do you need?