Rogol Zaar vs. Loebforce Rulk

Started by carver94 pages

Originally posted by MaZeRaIII
Not really a good form of stipulation here, since if people haven't forgotten, Phantom Zone is not your traiditonal prison dimension, the said dimension has depowering effect on its inhabitants, as Eradicator said Phantom Zone has "nullification forces" and later when Eradicator was trapped in Zone he couldn't use his energy powers due to those forces and Zod described PZ's energies as "poisonous" which weakened him in that story arc and took time to heal and wear off those energies, on top of that when Cyborg Superman was in the zone he also said that his powers don't work there and so on.....as well as even Dan Jurgens commenting on the "weakening" part, so using characters fighting inside the zone is not really good example to measure one's power-level.

https://imgur.com/a/RrOnAR1

So weakened Rogol fighting weakened rogues is not really gonna be a good power-level indicator overall.

Good post.

Carver man, y u saying fake news all the time? Probably unintentional, but still...

Originally posted by carver9
Yeah, you're probably right. He passed through his head... unclear if Dorm was defeated.

Thought he killed the Watcher... oh well. Still a beastly showing.

Unclear if he was affected at all. Rulk got what he came for and left, knowing Dormammu can't follow. Would like to read the script for that particular scene. Beating Dormammu in his own realm just doesn't sound right to me.

Not just any Watcher. Uatu himself. Don't get so f*cking greedy, carv 😂 Uatu might have survived, but Grandmaster wasn't so lucky.

And Ross probably would've killed Uatu if Savage Hulk hadn't intervened, y'know...

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Carver man, y u saying fake news all the time? Probably unintentional, but still...

Lol... that's why I said iirc.

Oh, ure right. whoops

Originally posted by MaZeRaIII
Not really a good form of stipulation here, since if people haven't forgotten, Phantom Zone is not your traiditonal prison dimension, the said dimension has depowering effect on its inhabitants, as Eradicator said Phantom Zone has "nullification forces" and later when Eradicator was trapped in Zone he couldn't use his energy powers due to those forces and Zod described PZ's energies as "poisonous" which weakened him in that story arc and took time to heal and wear off those energies, on top of that when Cyborg Superman was in the zone he also said that his powers don't work there and so on.....as well as even Dan Jurgens commenting on the "weakening" part, so using characters fighting inside the zone is not really good example to measure one's power-level.

https://imgur.com/a/RrOnAR1

So weakened Rogol fighting weakened rogues is not really gonna be a good power-level indicator overall.

You're assuming that Bendis will 'remember' that little tidbit, lol.

We've already seen Rogol in the PZ(where he fought/killed Nuclear Man), and he made no mention of feeling depowered or whathaveyou. Neither did Superman(who is also in the PZ) -- the only thing he mentioned is that his powers would slowly begin to wane the longer he was away from the sun:
https://i.imgur.com/Q4dZsEC.jpg

Don't get me wrong, though: I sincerely hope that Rogol doesn't get a feat of this magnitude... But this IS Bendis we're talking about. The man is just terrible. srsly

I hope Rogol will visit Apokolips next 🙂

Originally posted by Galan007
You're assuming that Bendis will 'remember' that little tidbit, lol.

Doesn't really matter whether he will remember that specific notion or not, since it still doesn't negate the fact how Phantom Zone works, since nullification aspect of it is a fundamental part of the dimension, like laws of physics are to our world.

Originally posted by Galan007
We've already seen Rogol in the PZ(where he fought/killed Nuclear Man), and he made no mention of feeling depowered or whathaveyou.

And how is this evidence that he was not weakened by PZ? Something not being mentioned doesn't automatically translate that it doesn't happen at the moment, you don't need to spell out beans in every issue with PZ when DC lore has continuosly already explained how Phantom Zone works, just like it doesn't need be mentioned every single time that Superman is a solar battery, we already know those notions.

It's like seeing some character explaining Speed Force, and not mentioning that it is fundamentally interwined with Multiverse or that it can allow you to time travel, and then say that since it was not mentioned therefore SF is not interwined with Multiverse or can't time travel in that specific moment, or whenever someone enters Dormammu's dimension and just calls it dimension without mentioning that it is magic type, and therefore since magic part was not mentioned therefore it is not magical, which is a bit fallacious type of argumentation to say the least.

In short, fundamental aspect of something not being mentioned doesn't act as contradictory stipulatiation or makes the said aspect vanish.

Originally posted by Galan007
Neither did Superman(who is also in the PZ) -- the only thing he mentioned is that his powers would slowly begin to wane the longer he was away from the sun:

Again, him not mentioning PZ effects doesn't automatically trasnlate that it doesn't happen, the nullification forces are part of Phantom Zone's laws, mentioned or not, it's irrelevant, just like we don't need something of lore to be mentioned every single time, when we already know the fundamentals of those notions, in this case we know how Phantom Zone's laws works, that part is unchangeable, thus it does not need to be mentioned overall.

As for his statement, well yeah, his powers do wane without the sun, but nothing contradicting the fundamental aspect of the Phantom Zone.

Simple example here, - remember when New 52 Wonder Woman defeated New 52 Mongul who was trapped inside the Phantom Zone, you know the same Mongul who was handily taking on New 52 Superman, so by default we already know the clear difference between Diana's and Mongul's power-levels, yet the one with superior power lost, which doesn't make sense, except the fight happened in PZ with Mongul being there longer than Diana, to which the forces of PZ did play certain effect on the outcome overall, it doesn't need to be mentioned there that Mongul was weakened for us to understand that he was weakened, since we know how PZ works, and on top of that him losing to someone weaker than himself.

Originally posted by Galan007
Don't get me wrong, though: I sincerely hope that Rogol doesn't get a feat of this magnitude... But this IS Bendis we're talking about. The man is just terrible.

Bendis being Bendis is nothing new, it is expectable, but i don't think he will make Rogol beat Superman's villains, more like he will make a pact with them (with lies of course).

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Carver man, y u saying fake news all the time? Probably unintentional, but still...

He's learnt after that debacle with maestro....

Originally posted by MaZeRaIII
Doesn't really matter whether he will remember that specific notion or not, since it still doesn't negate the fact how Phantom Zone works, since nullification aspect of it is a fundamental part of the dimension, like laws of physics are to our world.
This is Bendis we're talking about. The guy has a longstanding history of not adhering to established canon. He does whatever the f*ck he wants.

Originally posted by MaZeRaIII
And how is this evidence that he was not weakened by PZ?

Again, him not mentioning PZ effects doesn't automatically trasnlate that it doesn't happen

Because typically if a character's power is meant to be significantly weakened, we are explicitly informed of such... But we weren't here. To the contrary, both Rogol and Superman each commented that they 'felt great' in the PZ. So as of now, it doesn't look like it is impacting their powers at all.

This is Bendis.

Originally posted by MaZeRaIII
Bendis being Bendis is nothing new, it is expectable, but i don't think he will make Rogol beat Superman's villains, more like he will make a pact with them (with lies of course).
I certainly hope Rogol doesn't beat them outright, and if he does, I hope there is at least *some* kind of an explanation(like the rogues being weakened by the PZ, for example.) That would at least make it easier to stomach.

But again, this is Bendis. You never know wtf he's going to do.

Rogol beats Rulk ass. He just casually crushed Nuclear Man as if he were dealing with a lightweight.

Lol... this argument is hilarious. The Phantom Zone weakens people but this time it doesnt count because it will probably not get mentioned in the book. If Bendis write a book with Superman being beside kryptonite and he falls to his knees and beat by an average thug, it doesnt count because his weakness to kryptonite wasnt mentioned in the book.

Go read Future Imperfect.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... this argument is hilarious. The Phantom Zone weakens people but this time it doesnt count because it will probably not get mentioned in the book. If Bendis write a book with Superman being beside kryptonite and he falls to his knees and beat by an average thug, it doesnt count because his weakness to kryptonite wasnt mentioned in the book.

If it weakens people wouldn't that still mean that the denizens (all of them) of the Phantom Zone were equally weakened? So if they weren't in the Phantom Zone Rogol would have still caved Nuclear Man's head in right? Isn't that what would happen Carver? Rogol after all is also in the Phantom Zone.

Originally posted by Stoic
If it weakens people wouldn't that still mean that the denizens (all of them) of the Phantom Zone were equally weakened? So if they weren't in the Phantom Zone Rogol would have still caved Nuclear Man's head in right? Isn't that what would happen Carver? Rogol after all is also in the Phantom Zone.

The effects of the Phantom Zone isnt immediate.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Go read Future Imperfect.

Can we read it together. I'll Skype you.

Originally posted by carver9
Can we read it together. I'll Skype you.

Do you need your hand holding? Knew it.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... this argument is hilarious. The Phantom Zone weakens people but this time it doesnt count because it will probably not get mentioned in the book. If Bendis write a book with Superman being beside kryptonite and he falls to his knees and beat by an average thug, it doesnt count because his weakness to kryptonite wasnt mentioned in the book.

You are goddamn right ! 😆

Yeah but in theory being in pz gives everyone the same even playing field as they would have in the regular physical universe no? Theoretically speaking... It would still count in some way no?

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... this argument is hilarious. The Phantom Zone weakens people but this time it doesnt count because it will probably not get mentioned in the book. If Bendis write a book with Superman being beside kryptonite and he falls to his knees and beat by an average thug, it doesnt count because his weakness to kryptonite wasnt mentioned in the book.
Lol.

Are those developmental delays getting in the way of your ability to comprehend a sentence again? Legitimately curious, because that isn't what I was saying. At all.

Again, the PZ-neutering thing could still very well be in effect here. Just saying that as of now, Bendis hasn't mentioned it(to the contrary, both Superman and Rogol currently 'feel great' inside the PZ)... And because we're talking about Bendis here, it wouldn't surprise me if he says "f*ck canon", like he's done SO many times in the past, and ignores the PZ's pre-established rules/facts for the sole purpose of wanking his new pet character. I certainly hope he doesn't, but I won't be shocked if he does.

Now, please stop trying to faux-troll before you hurt yourself. 👆