Read the stips!! Batman/Punisher vs Thor

It's funny how Thor went from Odin this and that, to nearly despising Odin these days.

I think that Thor's constitution, toughness, strength, and the natural speed he'd get from being that strong vs his weight should be too much for these guys. However, Batman can hurt Grundy, which should allow him to hurt Thor (even though it makes little sense).

In reality, these two would have better luck toppling a mountain than beating a guy capable of being tossed through one and having the endurance to get up after it.

How is this not abhorrent spite?

Bat kick?

Well yes, but outside of that.

In a comic, Batman would wing it until Thor gets pissed and uses an AOA attack. Not sure if Frank would last nearly as long as Bats. Bats/Cap or Bats/DD would be fun. This would be entertaining to watch but wouldn't end well once Thor gets pissed.

Originally posted by -Pr-
How is this not abhorrent spite?

Because in round 1, Batman alone has showings of taking down herald level foes. He's used pressure points on Grundy, Super Titan Gladiator, has KOd Cheetah with a punch, and taken out another of WWs foes (I forgot his name) with MA. That's skill.

Speedwise, he has tagged Kid Flash, outrun HV after it was fired, escaped from Jay etc. That's speed.

Has taken blows from Mongul, Martian Manhunter, Wonder Woman etc. That's durability.

Conversely, Thor HAS shown to have been vulnerable to pressure point attacks (Mantis, who hit him with her fragile wrists). HAS been shown to have been outsped by street levellers.

And now, Batman has Frank backing him up, who has some skill himself, is speedy enough to have tagged Spidey, and is durable as phuck.

Round 2? They have knives that they're familiar with. The aforementioned pressure points? Imagine being stabbed with them.

Round 3? They each need to slash Thor five times. Thor needs to make 20 slashes before they do so. I think it's VERY competitive. Again, Bruce alone has taken Lobo's fingers off before he even noticed.

Bada: no AOA attacks are allowed. It's pure h2h in round 1, knives against Thor in 2, and essentially a game of tag in round 3 (the slashes don't have to KO anyone, they just need to happen).

My bad. I'm not at my best. Lol.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85

Round 2? They have knives that they're familiar with. The aforementioned pressure points? Imagine being stabbed with them.

And Frank has plenty of knife feats...

Originally posted by Galan007
Punisher:

Outlier? Not really, as Frank was smart enough to go for the weak spots back in 1990:

- http://i.imgur.com/DULjNHo.jpg
- http://i.imgur.com/JeLLuQT.png

The knife throw was fatal and took care of the guy.

He's accurate as f*ck with knives, even at a distance:

Does the same thing to Black Widow's gauntlet:

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
And now, Batman has Frank backing him up, who has some skill himself

👆

These guys... they use judo throws and karate kicks and wrestling holds and dance an' punch like boxers, like the greats...

https://i.imgur.com/ZakYbJY.jpg

Shōrin-ryū:

https://i.imgur.com/f5UNwbJ.jpg

Chin Na:

https://i.imgur.com/N376oZD.jpg

Hwa Rang Do:

https://i.imgur.com/UpBOeVH.jpg

Ninjutsu (of course):

https://i.imgur.com/gRy2mvb.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
is speedy enough to have tagged Spidey.

And can dodge him, too...

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
and is durable as phuck.

That he is... 🤣

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Because in round 1, Batman alone has showings of taking down herald level foes. He's used pressure points on Grundy, Super Titan Gladiator, has KOd Cheetah with a punch, and taken out another of WWs foes (I forgot his name) with MA. That's skill.

Speedwise, he has tagged Kid Flash, outrun HV after it was fired, escaped from Jay etc. That's speed.

Has taken blows from Mongul, Martian Manhunter, Wonder Woman etc. That's durability.

Conversely, Thor HAS shown to have been vulnerable to pressure point attacks (Mantis, who hit him with her fragile wrists). HAS been shown to have been outsped by street levellers.

And now, Batman has Frank backing him up, who has some skill himself, is speedy enough to have tagged Spidey, and is durable as phuck.

Round 2? They have knives that they're familiar with. The aforementioned pressure points? Imagine being stabbed with them.

Round 3? They each need to slash Thor five times. Thor needs to make 20 slashes before they do so. I think it's VERY competitive. Again, Bruce alone has taken Lobo's fingers off before he even noticed.

[B]Bada: no AOA attacks are allowed. It's pure h2h in round 1, knives against Thor in 2, and essentially a game of tag in round 3 (the slashes don't have to KO anyone, they just need to happen). [/B]

Bruce is presented as a guy who is fantastically better than anything in the real world, but who still wears bullet-proof armor and dodges gunfire because it'll put a hole in him. Who consistently struggles with metahumans. Who uses gadgets and his tactical mind to make up for the lack of power. Etc. He doesn't outspeed lasers, he's not noted in-comic as being 'faster' than a speedster

He's not.

But his strikes have affected heralds... especially heralds with pretty much the same type of invulnerability as Thor - such as Wonder Woman:

You complained about the Public Enemies instance, when Grundy was initially mind-controlled (said control broke when he got exposed to Batman's tear gas)...

... so how about this showing, then?

Posted it before, but you ignored it.

This time, it was Grundy who had the element of surprise against Bruce --- he still got KO'd.

Grundy varies and is INCONSISTENT

I mean, Bruce has been KO'ed by far, far less than that. If we're going to look at every single appearance he's had. He's been badly beaten up by far, far less than Wonder Woman. He's also threatened enough by bullets to actually want to DODGE when people shoot at him. For goodness sakes he lost to Slade with prep recently

So my question is do we acknowledge that sometimes the writing is just bad? Or does every single feat count here, cherry-picked to please the picker's side of the discussion?

Spidey and Cap also affected heralds a dozen times, more than Batman

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
Grundy varies and is INCONSISTENT

Like every character in DC and Marvel comics.

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
I mean, Bruce has been KO'ed by far, far less than that. If we're going to look at every single appearance he's had. He's been badly beaten up by far, far less than Wonder Woman. He's also threatened enough by bullets to actually want to DODGE when people shoot at him. For goodness sakes he lost to Slade with prep recently

He has.

So it should be easy for you to argue for Thor winning the first round and perhaps even the second. Bring it on.

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
So my question is do we acknowledge that sometimes the writing is just bad? Or does every single feat count here, cherry-picked to please the picker's side of the discussion?

It's not exactly cherry-picking, if said feats get replicated enough times.

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
Spidey and Cap also affected heralds a dozen times, more than Batman

Which you failed to prove in the other thread.

Not saying you're wrong -- you just failed to deliver.

yes it is. This isn't outlier Batman we're discussing, it's normal Bruce whos a peak human/meta

What other thread?

This is my first mentioning Spidey and Cap affecting heralds. I don't remember

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
yes it is. This isn't outlier Batman we're discussing, it's normal Bruce whos a peak human/meta

Who also happens to wear a really durable armor.

He survived Shazam's lightning. He survived Superman's heat vision.

Tanked punches from Super Titan Gladiator.

Got blindsided and smashed into concrete by a jokerized Diana.

It keeps happening.

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
What other thread?

This is my first mentioning Spidey and Cap affecting heralds. I don't remember

Oh, you know. The one in which you pretended to have read Captain America comics - specifically the one with him fighting Rhino for the whole issue 😛

0_0 Rhino isn't a herald

...what are you talking about...?

You tried to prove in that thread that Cap hits harder than Batman, the point is. And you failed to do so.

Also... strength/durability-wise, Rhino can be considered a herald - he's no different than Grundy (who happens to be in the low herald tier); he has his low and high showings.