Plutonian vs Sentry

Originally posted by Diesldude

first you wank the feat and then try to pass it on as ordinary by saying that any high herald can perform it just so that others don’t look deeper into your claims.

Well, that's certainly an... interesting line of thinking.

I'm still wanking the feat. Standing under the pull of half a black hole / the weight of a star system is an insane feat by regular comic book standards. It's not like comic book characters shatter nearby moons during all of their fights on distant planets. But every now and then they do it. Again, an insane feat.

Even withstanding the force of half a black hole is an insane feat and requires at least the herald level to do deal with it. But when it comes to high herald I don't think it's that big of a deal. We've seen Superman and Thor flying out of black holes. We've seen Silver Surfer fighting inside a black hole. And I'd argue that Plutonian is an even more powerful character. It's just that withstanding the pull of half a black hole is one of his greatest feats, so I brought it up. He arguably has even greater feats, which push his levels.

Originally posted by Diesldude

The prison guards, were able to control the gravity of the prison with pinpoint accuracy. They could increase the gravity of the prison to pin a prisoner from normal planetary level to whatever they wanted, in this case it was a hundred fold. Not full capacity of a half a blackhole. And it wasn’t always turned on, they used it only when they had to take control of a situation with rowdy prisoners.

"in this case it was a hundred fold"

It's like you read the "hundred fold" and then stopped reading.
Continue reading and you'll see another warden saying that he wants the device at its maximum capacity. Before that he is warned that it would liquify the prisoners. They increase the capacity to the max, even state that and in the next scan we see most prisoners being liquified.

So yes, Plutonian withstood the entire pull of half a black hole. Casually, while being in a vegetative state. It's an insane feat not many comic book characters have.

I have no idea what you're crying about.

Originally posted by Enzeru
Well, that's certainly an... interesting line of thinking.

I'm still wanking the feat. Standing under the pull of half a black hole / the weight of a star system is an insane feat by regular comic book standards. It's not like comic book characters shatter nearby moons during all of their fights on distant planets. But every now and then they do it. Again, an insane feat.

Even withstanding the force of half a black hole is an insane feat and requires at least the herald level to do deal with it. But when it comes to high herald I don't think it's that big of a deal. We've seen Superman and Thor flying out of black holes. We've seen Silver Surfer fighting inside a black hole. And I'd argue that Plutonian is an even more powerful character. It's just that withstanding the pull of half a black hole is one of his greatest feats, so I brought it up. He arguably has even greater feats, which push his levels.

"in this case it was a hundred fold"

It's like you read the "hundred fold" and then stopped reading.
Continue reading and you'll see another warden saying that he wants the device at its maximum capacity. Before that he is warned that it would liquify the prisoners. They increase the capacity to the max, even state that and in the next scan we see most prisoners being liquified.

So yes, Plutonian withstood the entire pull of half a black hole. Casually, while being in a vegetative state. It's an insane feat not many comic book characters have.

I have no idea what you're crying about.

The black hole feat is not near his top feats though.
Tanking star powered punches without any harm is much better and having picosecond perceptions is even better (his best imo).

The picosecond perceptions is what makes Plutonian wins this fight since we all know he has the strength to ko Sentry.

Originally posted by Enzeru
Well, that's certainly an... interesting line of thinking.

I'm still wanking the feat. Standing under the pull of half a black hole / the weight of a star system is an insane feat by regular comic book standards. It's not like comic book characters shatter nearby moons during all of their fights on distant planets. But every now and then they do it. Again, an insane feat.

Even withstanding the force of half a black hole is an insane feat and requires at least the herald level to do deal with it. But when it comes to high herald I don't think it's that big of a deal. We've seen Superman and Thor flying out of black holes. We've seen Silver Surfer fighting inside a black hole. And I'd argue that Plutonian is an even more powerful character. It's just that withstanding the pull of half a black hole is one of his greatest feats, so I brought it up. He arguably has even greater feats, which push his levels.

"in this case it was a hundred fold"

It's like you read the "hundred fold" and then stopped reading.
Continue reading and you'll see another warden saying that he wants the device at its maximum capacity. Before that he is warned that it would liquify the prisoners. They increase the capacity to the max, even state that and in the next scan we see most prisoners being liquified.

So yes, Plutonian withstood the entire pull of half a black hole. Casually, while being in a vegetative state. It's an insane feat not many comic book characters have.

I have no idea what you're crying about.

👍 I didn’t read that part. I was going off of memory and stopped reading after I found what I needed. Impressive feat and definitely higher IMO higher than high herald feat.

😂 ....You don't ever read ANYTHING

@Enzeru, yeah diesl is kinda known for not fully comprehending something as simple as comics, it's why dudes like me take it easy with him

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
😂 ....You don't ever read ANYTHING

@Enzeru, yeah diesl is kinda known for not fully comprehending something as simple as comics, it's why dudes like me take it easy with him

With that said, this is probably the only time I’ve ever been wrong and it had to do with misremembering the scan. I’ve already explained this.

Originally posted by h1a8

Tanking star powered punches without any harm

It's like you people legit don't read the comics you want to talk about. And you wonder why I don't like responding to you.

https://i.imgur.com/Du6PjAV.jpg

Does that look like tanking star punches without any harm? The Plutonian was a bloody mess after the onslaught. He was done and helpless to a point, where he couldn't stop Modeus from raping him.

Originally posted by Enzeru
It's like you people legit don't read the comics you want to talk about. And you wonder why I don't like responding to you.

https://i.imgur.com/Du6PjAV.jpg

Does that look like tanking star punches without any harm? The Plutonian was a bloody mess after the onslaught. He was done and helpless to a point, where he couldn't stop Modeus from raping him.

You right. I was mistaken. But still a good feat I would say.

Who do you say wins this?

Originally posted by h1a8

You right. I was mistaken. But still a good feat I would say.

Who do you say wins this?

I'm not sure. It's too good and too even of a fight. In my mind it's a draw.

They both have slight advantages over the other in certain areas. Strength (probably) and speed (certainly) for the Plutonian. Toughness (certainly) and versatility / X-Factor (probably) for the Sentry.

Originally posted by h1a8
You right. I was mistaken. But still a good feat I would say.

Who do you say wins this?

Originally posted by h1a8
The black hole feat is not near his top feats though.
Tanking star powered punches without any harm is much better and having picosecond perceptions is even better (his best imo).

The picosecond perceptions is what makes Plutonian wins this fight since we all know he has the strength to ko Sentry.

KO Sentry? Lol, Sentry had his head split wide open. Learn about who you're arguing against h1. Sentry under optimal conditions can't be KO'd if Bob doesn't allow it to be. Sentry is a thought construct. You didn't know this?

Originally posted by Stoic
KO Sentry? Lol, Sentry had his head split wide open. Learn about who you're arguing against h1. Sentry under optimal conditions can't be KO'd if Bob doesn't allow it to be. Sentry is a thought construct. You didn't know this?

Sentry has been koed against Bob's will.
Blue Marvel and WWH are just two such cases.

Sentry is a strange bird. Theres the Sentry that has low feats like the Blue Marvel, WWH, and the Helicarrier episode and then theres the Sentry that rips through dimensions, creates his own world, and destroys planets while fighting Photon.

Originally posted by h1a8
Sentry has been koed against Bob's will.
Blue Marvel and WWH are just two such cases.

He was weakened at that period. I did mention under optimal conditions.

Originally posted by h1a8

Sentry has been koed against Bob's will.
Blue Marvel and WWH are just two such cases.

Originally posted by Stoic

He was weakened at that period. I did mention under optimal conditions.

Context matters.

I mean, I've read every single Sentry comic multiple times and I would have to think really, really, really hard to come up with an instance, where Sentry straight up loss, without any weird circumstances being present.

Stoic is right... There was something off with the Sentry during the World War Hulk and Blue Marvel instance.
Against World War Hulk Sentry was weakened, since he was struggling with his mental issues. And his mental issues make him weaker and easier to defeat. He still took on one of the most powerful Hulks and fought him to a standstill.
Against Blue Marvel you had the Negative Zone leaking into the universe and messing with Sentrys power. Sentry was still pretty much winning the fight, told Blue Marvel to stand down, got flash KOed, returned and defeated Blue Marvel.

Even more important: Character development matters.

What some people are doing, is the same as if I said that Superman can't beat character XYZ, because he is only as fast as strong as a locomotive and as fast as a speeding bullet. That's by far not enough to defeat any modern powerhouse.
But at that point I'd have a legion of Superman fanboys calling me an idiot and saying that Superman evolved and gained more powers and more power since he was first introduced.

But they ignore the very same thing about the Sentry.

Name me an instance, where the Sentry was KOed again, after the fights against World War Hulk and Blue Marvel. Tough, isn't it? Why though?

Sentry fought the Molecule Man and got ripped apart. He immediately returned, defeated the Molecule Man and stated that he had now figured out how his powers work.And now look at some of his appearances afterwards:

Got his head sliced off by an empowered Captain America and continued fighting. Got hit by the lightning of an empowered Thor and continued fighting. Got hit by a nuke, while he was weakened and only reverted back to his human form. Ripped his own head apart and was still conscious. Got his brains smushed in by Thor and was still conscious. In a weakened state got the crap beat out of him by a Sentry level being and remained conscious.

It's like... At which point do you realize that the Sentry doesn't seem to care about KOs any longer? If you can rip your own head apart for laughs and giggles... If you don't get KOed after getting your brain smushed in... Then there is no way of KOing you. Stoic is right, when he says that the Sentry doesn't really exist any longer. He is one manifested persona of a schizophrenic reality warper, who can not be killed.

Originally posted by Enzeru
Why, thank you, M'Lady. I won't be staying long though.

https://imgur.com/a/SQ9ML

Yes, they used it at its full capacity. Half a black hole worth of force.

It's an amazing feat, but I don't think it's something out of the ordinary for even Marvel high heralds. If I remember correctly, then Thor flew into a black hole to grab Red Hulk and fly him out. So escaping its power strikes me as something high heralds can do consistently... and I'd always argue that the Plutonian and the Sentry are above the high herald level.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Just recently a black hole nearly killed pretty much every marvel cosmic hero including Silver Surfer.

One wrong does not undo multipe rights.

https://i.imgur.com/VeEJdPH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/gZMsdFg.jpg

Silver Surfer has a better track record dealing with black holes fine than being severely endangered by them.

Originally posted by Enzeru
[b]Context matters.

I mean, I've read every single Sentry comic multiple times and I would have to think really, really, really hard to come up with an instance, where Sentry straight up loss, without any weird circumstances being present.

Stoic is right... There was something off with the Sentry during the World War Hulk and Blue Marvel instance.
Against World War Hulk Sentry was weakened, since he was struggling with his mental issues. And his mental issues make him weaker and easier to defeat. He still took on one of the most powerful Hulks and fought him to a standstill.
Against Blue Marvel you had the Negative Zone leaking into the universe and messing with Sentrys power. Sentry was still pretty much winning the fight, told Blue Marvel to stand down, got flash KOed, returned and defeated Blue Marvel.

Even more important: Character development matters.

What some people are doing, is the same as if I said that Superman can't beat character XYZ, because he is only as fast as strong as a locomotive and as fast as a speeding bullet. That's by far not enough to defeat any modern powerhouse.
But at that point I'd have a legion of Superman fanboys calling me an idiot and saying that Superman evolved and gained more powers and more power since he was first introduced.

But they ignore the very same thing about the Sentry.

Name me an instance, where the Sentry was KOed again, after the fights against World War Hulk and Blue Marvel. Tough, isn't it? Why though?

Sentry fought the Molecule Man and got ripped apart. He immediately returned, defeated the Molecule Man and stated that he had now figured out how his powers work.And now look at some of his appearances afterwards:

Got his head sliced off by an empowered Captain America and continued fighting. Got hit by the lightning of an empowered Thor and continued fighting. Got hit by a nuke, while he was weakened and only reverted back to his human form. Ripped his own head apart and was still conscious. Got his brains smushed in by Thor and was still conscious. In a weakened state got the crap beat out of him by a Sentry level being and remained conscious.

It's like... At which point do you realize that the Sentry doesn't seem to care about KOs any longer? If you can rip your own head apart for laughs and giggles... If you don't get KOed after getting your brain smushed in... Then there is no way of KOing you. Stoic is right, when he says that the Sentry doesn't really exist any longer. He is one manifested persona of a schizophrenic reality warper, who can not be killed. [/B]

Are you suggesting that it was the writer's intention that Sentry was weakened in his fight with WWH and Blue Marvel?

Because that's the only thing that matters. Let's not pretend that these characters exist and we can find actual theories to explain stuff.

Originally posted by h1a8

Are you suggesting that it was the writer's intention that Sentry was weakened in his fight with WWH and Blue Marvel? Because that's the only thing that matters.

No, that's not what I'm suggesting. I'm just suggesting, that you can't leave out context and important parts of a characters backstory, because you want to interpret things in your own way.

Sentry was struggling with his phobia and couldn't leave his house for days, while Hulk was on a rampage. Was that purely written as a way of depowering the Sentry, so that Hulk could stand a chance? Or was it written, so that Hulk could go on a rampage for a couple of issues and then force the Sentry to intervene, even though he was struggling with his mental state? I'd say it's more to keep the Sentry away than to depower him... but Sentry being depowered still applies, because there is more to comics than just one arc written by one writer. We've seen all the other instances, where Sentry was stable and still afraid to cut loose, because of what would happen to Earth. Once he wasn't on Earth, he cut loose and destroyed planets. And even in World War Hulk he would have destroyed the planet, if Hulk hadn't stopped him. It would have just taken him more time until his escaping energies engulfed the entire planet and burnt it to a ciner.

What about the Negative Zone stuff during his fight with Blue Marvel? Mainly there to mess with Sentrys powers and have him be less formidable against Blue Marvel – a character weaker than Thor, who is again weaker than Sentry? Or was it mainly there to increase the tension of the story and have the entire planet at risk due to the invading Negative Zone energy? I'd say it was more the latter and about how the entire planet was at risk... than it was to depower the Sentry and give Blue Marvel a fighting chance. But that arc too is not only limited to that one story written by one writer. Look at what happened to Sentry, when he was in the Negative Zone during his second mini series. He was struggling, losing power and required Hulks help.
Again, you can't have the one without the other.

And believe me, when I tell you that I would also prefer a clear-cut answer, even if it went against the Sentry. Arguing would be much simpler then. "He lost so there is that", but I once again invite you to show me any instance involving the Sentry, where he straight up lost with no context involved.
Look at him dying at the hands of Thor. You have legions of people talking about Thor killed the Sentry and that he must be more powerful than him. But the same people ignore all the context, where an empowered Thor couldn't kill the Sentry. The writers intent there was also that the Sentry couldn't be defeated and that he only went away, because he allowed it to happen. That's what the writer flat out stated. What do you say to that intent?
You know what I mean? People are just so selective and biased with what they want to believe.

Originally posted by Enzeru
One wrong does not undo multipe rights.

https://i.imgur.com/VeEJdPH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/gZMsdFg.jpg

Silver Surfer has a better track record dealing with black holes fine than being severely endangered by them.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Surfer gets owned by a black hole

"Almost crushed to nothingness".

😂

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not so fast Brandon.

Koed by a black hole again.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11133/111332122/6101113-2425527315-RCO01.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11133/111332122/6101114-4560853732-RCO01.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11133/111332122/6101115-4938731777-RCO01.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11133/111332122/6101116-3034425536-RCO01.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11133/111332122/6101117-2265725141-RCO01.jpg

Koed again by a black hole.

Originally posted by Enzeru
No, that's not what I'm suggesting. I'm just suggesting, that you can't leave out context and important parts of a characters backstory, because you want to interpret things in your own way.

Sentry was struggling with his phobia and couldn't leave his house for days, while Hulk was on a rampage. Was that purely written as a way of depowering the Sentry, so that Hulk could stand a chance? Or was it written, so that Hulk could go on a rampage for a couple of issues and then force the Sentry to intervene, even though he was struggling with his mental state? I'd say it's more to keep the Sentry away than to depower him... but Sentry being depowered still applies, because there is more to comics than just one arc written by one writer. We've seen all the other instances, where Sentry was stable and still afraid to cut loose, because of what would happen to Earth. Once he wasn't on Earth, he cut loose and destroyed planets. And even in World War Hulk he would have destroyed the planet, if Hulk hadn't stopped him. It would have just taken him more time until his escaping energies engulfed the entire planet and burnt it to a ciner.

What about the Negative Zone stuff during his fight with Blue Marvel? Mainly there to mess with Sentrys powers and have him be less formidable against Blue Marvel – a character weaker than Thor, who is again weaker than Sentry? Or was it mainly there to increase the tension of the story and have the entire planet at risk due to the invading Negative Zone energy? I'd say it was more the latter and about how the entire planet was at risk... than it was to depower the Sentry and give Blue Marvel a fighting chance. But that arc too is not only limited to that one story written by one writer. Look at what happened to Sentry, when he was in the Negative Zone during his second mini series. He was struggling, losing power and required Hulks help.
Again, you can't have the one without the other.

And believe me, when I tell you that I would also prefer a clear-cut answer, even if it went against the Sentry. Arguing would be much simpler then. "He lost so there is that", but I once again invite you to show me any instance involving the Sentry, where he straight up lost with no context involved.
Look at him dying at the hands of Thor. You have legions of people talking about Thor killed the Sentry and that he must be more powerful than him. But the same people ignore all the context, where an empowered Thor couldn't kill the Sentry. The writers intent there was also that the Sentry couldn't be defeated and that he only went away, because he allowed it to happen. That's what the writer flat out stated. What do you say to that intent?
You know what I mean? People are just so selective and biased with what they want to believe.

You using the stupid iphone apostrophes.

If Sentry wasn't weakened per writer's intentions then he wasn't weakened in any way. These are fictional characters were anything (including illogical things) can happen. The writer gave no context in the WWH fight or the Blue Marvel fight as to why Sentry was able to be koed. Therefore, you are making shit up.