Originally posted by cdtm
Thought it over.You can take the win.
Never had a problem being in an uphill debate against, say, K-M arguing against Iron Fist. But K-M also never went out of his way to insult people.
So not worth it. You win.
👆
Next time, pay attention and actually read what others post before rehashing the same tired arguments. Then maybe people won't insult you.
Or just don't be such a snowflake.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
👆Next time, pay attention and actually read what others post before rehashing the same tired arguments. Then maybe people won't insult you.
Or just don't be such a snowflake.
I read some it. It works both ways though.
But really, we were talking past each other.
Your argument was essentially that all energy includes magic, right?
Weren't you also the one who posted Darth Vader breaking an indestructible metal? Or was that Galan? Does that prove he can break adamantium?
But ok, lets go with all energy. That's a pretty hard statement to disprove, because it includes literally every kind of energy. And Goku is entirely dependent on his ki. So where does that leave me?
Magic pole is out. Akido is out. Ki and brawling is out.
So Goku is out of luck.
In my defense though, I think the argument that a multiversal being having trouble is built on a falicy that suggests more power = slam dunk. That's actually one of my pet peeves, the idea pecking orders are set in stone.
That's why I keep bringing up Starfox renderering Pre Retcon Beyonder helpless, or Phoenix Jean tampering with his emotions. He's more powerful than anything, yet they affected him with their powers.
But no one notices that past the dazzle of "Made LT scared".
That's also why I love that Superman took multiversal Darkseid down a peg with a whistle. People call it stupid, I call it inspirational. Proves not everything is a Vsbattle.com game of numbers.
The funny thing is literally ANY Shonen character would be better here against Aquarian.
Kenichi, Baki,and Shibukawa have no-strength needed techniques (And bonus, Kenichi proved his works without a throw, which is the standard finisher)
Ranma Saotome may be a bit harder, because so many of his skills rely on speed or power. But he'd probably turn himself into girl Ranma and sneak attack him or something.
Originally posted by carver9
Add two more times to that where he was choked out. Cap wasn't the only one to do it.
And he was out to fight and take his opponent out asap, whilst at 10 feet (his field's radius)?
Scans.
Edit: Never said Cap was the only one, btw. Quantum Man (Quantum?) did it too - search my posts here and you will clearly see me mentioning it, lmao. Even posted the scans.
But now you have educated yourself on Aquarian, NOW, after weeks and pages, you can FINALLY step up to debate, lol, instead of talking out of your ass.
Lmmfao... Dark, you are rude as hell. I honestly don't see a point in me posting the scans since you've already seen them. It seems like early Aquarian is different from the later version of him. People don't, fall over, have heart attacks anymore just by being around him. He's like classic Juggernaut who use to have a forcefield but rarely if ever use it in his earlier showings.
Originally posted by carver9
Lmmfao... Dark, you are rude as hell. I honestly don't see a point in me posting the scans since you've already seen them. It seems like early Aquarian is different from the later version of him. People don't, fall over, have heart attacks anymore just by being around him. He's like classic Juggernaut who use to have a forcefield but rarely if ever use it in his earlier showings.
Rude?
You spent weeks, and pages, arguing against someone you had no clue on.
It's all still canon - early/late, whatever. Unless you have a specific scan showing him being depowered or repowered, it all counts. There is no such thing as 'classic Aquarian' or whatever, lol. Unless you have the scans?
And it is simple as to why its different. He got a better handle on his powers, and was a massive pacifist who wouldn't say boo to a fly. Again, I will repost:
Firstly, are you seriously arguing he would be killing his supporters? Lmao, ok.
Secondly, he walks casually up to Quantum Man (after shutting him down), calls him friend. Quantum Man throws a punch at him. He catches it casually, and still keeps calling him friend and tries to talk to him.
In YOUR challenge, Aquarian isn't walking up to Goku (lol), calling him friend (lol) and asking him how his day is going. As per you, Aquarian is trying to take him out ASAP, to win by either death or KO.
All the examples of him getting choked out (that I know of) are of him being a hippy dippy pacifist. Which you explicitly turned off.
So again, how is Goku choking an Aquarian who is out to win ASAP out?
Originally posted by cdtm
I read some it. It works both ways though.But really, we were talking past each other.
Your argument was essentially that all energy includes magic, right?
Weren't you also the one who posted Darth Vader breaking an indestructible metal? Or was that Galan? Does that prove he can break adamantium?
But ok, lets go with all energy. That's a pretty hard statement to disprove, because it includes literally every kind of energy. And Goku is entirely dependent on his ki. So where does that leave me?
Magic pole is out. Akido is out. Ki and brawling is out.
So Goku is out of luck.
In my defense though, I think the argument that a multiversal being having trouble is built on a falicy that suggests more power = slam dunk. That's actually one of my pet peeves, the idea pecking orders are set in stone.
That's why I keep bringing up Starfox renderering Pre Retcon Beyonder helpless, or Phoenix Jean tampering with his emotions. He's more powerful than anything, yet they affected him with their powers.
But no one notices that past the dazzle of "Made LT scared".
That's also why I love that Superman took multiversal Darkseid down a peg with a whistle. People call it stupid, I call it inspirational. Proves not everything is a Vsbattle.com game of numbers.
Firstly, yes, my argument was all energy = well, all energy. If Superman has a statement saying he is immune to all diseases, all I (or, more likely, Carv) has to do to disprove said statement, is to post scans of Superman being sick. If there is a statement saying Iron Fist knows ALL martial arts in the universe, then all I need to disprove it is post scans showing he doesn't know mystical Wakandan shadow-fu or whatever.
As for Vader breaking it, that's Galan, not me. The fact it was broken, though, kinda disproves that its unbreakable, though. Whereas adamantium has proven itself many times over.
As for the multiversal being, it was used to show A: Aquarian when he is actually fighting, not just being all chummy with his opponents, and B: that the LIMITS to what he can negate are beyond Goku's power output.
Main point is, however, that ALL energy above a low threshold, gets negated. Magic, heat, light, sound, kinetic, it doesn't matter what the EFFECTS of the energy are, they are all still energy.
Which he negates.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Firstly, yes, my argument was all energy = well, all energy. If Superman has a statement saying he is immune to all diseases, all I (or, more likely, Carv) has to do to disprove said statement, is to post scans of Superman being sick. If there is a statement saying Iron Fist knows ALL martial arts in the universe, then all I need to disprove it is post scans showing he doesn't know mystical Wakandan shadow-fu or whatever.As for Vader breaking it, that's Galan, not me. The fact it was broken, though, kinda disproves that its unbreakable, though. Whereas adamantium has proven itself many times over.
As for the multiversal being, it was used to show A: Aquarian when he is actually fighting, not just being all chummy with his opponents, and B: that the LIMITS to what he can negate are beyond Goku's power output.
Main point is, however, that ALL energy above a low threshold, gets negated. Magic, heat, light, sound, kinetic, it doesn't matter what the EFFECTS of the energy are, they are all still energy.
Which he negates.
It's a bad match for Goku then. Fact is, he's a one trick pony. Overwhelm opponents with bigger ki blasts or beat them down with blitz's.
He doesn't have one single example of real skill.
In theory I guess later versions of Goku can use tk to choke him out like Vader did, but he's never really use tk like that before, so..
Which is what I said. Carv spent ages arguing that Goku speedblitzes, so I then chose a character who would specifically negate speedblitzes.
If anything, you should've loved it. Goku has more offensive power than Aquarian...but its not just a game of numbers and whose power levels are higher than the other.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Which is what I said. Carv spent ages arguing that Goku speedblitzes, so I then chose a character who would specifically negate speedblitzes.If anything, you should've loved it. Goku has more offensive power than Aquarian...but its not just a game of numbers and whose power levels are higher than the other.
It's a similar wall though.
I guess the word "power" isn't descriptive. It's more of an "I win button".
Chalk it up to time on CBR, and mods forbidding arguments that Silver Surfer speed blitz's everyone and throws out enough energy to create stars. And time freeze.
It got kind of ridiculous with the lists of topics not to be argued.
As applies to Aquarian, that Null Field is about as cheap of an "I win" button as there is. It takes a very, very specific approach to do anything at all...
And that against a pacifist who isn't fighting back.
Originally posted by carver9
But Dark, you know absolutely nothing about Goku and you were debating right alongside me on who would win.
That's the beauty of it.
I don't need to know anything but the barest details with Goku. I know he has no TK at this point, no exotic haxx attacks - he's just super fast, strong and has energy projection. That cover it?
Aquarian negates all that. What more do I need to know? You already told me his character - that he starts the fight blitzing (lol).
So tell me ,what do I need to know?
Yeah, it's not like Carv even thought about it lol. But as he has said:
Originally posted by carver9
I specifically said that Goku and whomever will be trying to take each other out. Which means that they are going for either the kill right away or a knock out. That does not mean that a person start fighting like a versatile monster. Going for the drop versus turning someone into a versatile monster is 2 different things. If I say Martian Manhunter is trying to take someone out immediately that doesn't mean thar he will just stand in one spot, use intagibility, go into the ground or up in the sky at mind rape, blast, etc, etc... it means that he is trying to end the fight as quickly as possible. There's a difference between dropping someone immediately vs using your powers in ways that's rarely if ever displayed.
I basically got him to argue for weeks (against Fantomex etc) that Goku speedblitzes and rushes in.
Perfect for Aquarian.