Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
I already laid out the actual context to the "feat", you ignored it, and went off with your bias interpretation of the events.
Do you think it's possible for a boy like me to discuss matters with a ghoul like you in a respectable format on the same wavelength? Do you think it possible we both digest what each other says and offer reasonable counterpoints and alternate viewpoints?
With all due respect I don't, and that's why I'm talking with Leodicktits.
Originally posted by One Big Mob
Is this not an issue though?Certainly with the wording you have enough proof or more to state what's more likely between the two events.
If I show you a picture of two people fighting all you can glean from it is that they in fact fought. If I then describe the fight in more detail - that it in fact was one-sided, or one guy threw an infinite combo while the other did nothing - then you would have to factor that into your original view of this fight. It's additional context that you don't get from most comic fights, and it's no different here.
If you can posit that it is a durability feat based on the pictures then why can't it be what Kyle actually states? Certainly the writer on twitter gives Kyle's word verisimilitude, no?
If you're trying to be good faith and grant a morsel of dignity to it, then being adamant about it not being a shared feat isn't being good faith when more proof exists about it being a shared feat. Welcoming durability welcomes the other things too. Just because possibilities exist doesn't mean that one can't rise above like a black fist through white supremacy.
While I agree all are possible based on the presentation I still agree that one has more substance to it. People are free to interpret things how they want within the confines of probability however when the most cogent interpretation is disregarded - that's a question of what exactly your aim is. It'd be different if you stated that "shockwaves" have merit but you see it this way instead - you're still allowing that to be true but it doesn't personally have enough "weight" for you. The people who disregard Occam's razor usually end up slicing their ballsack when they find it's sharper than they thought.
I'm all for discussions and criticisms of feats, and some things backed by evidence simply aren't likely depending on the context - even if they do indeed have evidence - but the thing you're allowing is the one that gets knocked out as you go through the options. It's a start on the path to truth, not the end. It's a doorway that you might prefer after finding the answer. I'm not opposed to it being a pure durability feat myself... but that's with an acceptance of it being unlikely and within the confines of a discussion. I can't weigh that more against something with more evidence in good faith; I can just believe it more.
If it can be a durability feat, then it can be shockwaves in this context. The true ironclad stance against it is believing nothing happened imo. No slippery slope, don't even entertain there was a fight. Orion looked at him and the Golem started exploding like a scan so Orion ran away.
---
Regardless though, I know durability/survivability might be a copout in comics but think of the semantics this creates. He didn't help destroy the solar system he just point blank tanked the attack that destroyed it. Much better. I knew Orion sucked!
you raise fair points, but, do you see at any point in the battle exactly when orion decides to boom tube out...? or do you see any battle being fought, like, AT ALL? the scene where they stand in front of each other? even you said it looks like the power is coming from the golem. any other indication of a battle anywhere?
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Old Man Leo.Leoni.
Lecherous Leonidas.
Leodicktits.
The names are many, the poster, legendary.
you're missing one of the greats but i can't remember it! i think thingy used it. damn. all i remember was that it was pretty hilarious. or maybe it was blue area vet that used it. so many trolls, so little space in my head for them. 👆
Originally posted by carver9
Why is this still open? Based off strength, speed, durability and power output, Bill's win this. You all factor these things in other threads involving DC characters, why not here? Bills hold every single advantage and one showing doesn't take away from that. This is a spite thread. Orion doesn't have enough fts to suggest him taking a majority against Bills.
Originally posted by leonidasIt takes 3 seconds for the blast. One full panel, a prior explosion, and reflections are more than most get. I'm not sure why you'd need more panels for one attack at that length of time.
you raise fair points, but, do you see at any point in the battle exactly when orion decides to boom tube out...? or do you see any battle being fought, like, AT ALL? the scene where they stand in front of each other? even you said it looks like the power is coming from the golem. any other indication of a battle anywhere?
After they arrive in the system does Orion boomtube in. That leaves time from the blast to the arrival for him to port out. Once he starts charging the Omega Beams most likely. If you're going the angle of him boomtubing out of the initial blast then there's a strong delay in the time it takes to Boomtube. The blast was already finished by the time the GLs get there but there was still energy coming out of the Boomtube. The energy had already encompassed Orion when we see the two in the big shot so it's not possible for him to have Boomtubed out of that based on the context. In fact the energy was surrounding both a panel after a planet was running for their lives so even more doubt that he escaped when it was already huge and he was right there.
The battle had simply continued and The Golem started charging its power so Orion left. In fact he specifically was porting to Hal Jordan to get help so that allows another reason for him to port away from battle to that specific spot.
The battle happened. Questioning its existence because of the art depicting a big blast doesn't take away from the validity of the additional context. Orion standing there while doing nothing and being blasted is possible in comics of course but seems unlikely when he already knows he needs help to beat it and Orion being a battle retard isn't just going to deer in the headlights just because he's weaker.
Just because we don't know what happened initially before the big blast or the seconds after it destroyed the solar system that doesn't mean we ignore the attack.
Solar system intact
3 second countdown
Big light appearing in sky with people running for fear
We get a look at what caused that light with Orion and Golem in close proximity
Hal appears and the solar system is shredded
Orion Boomtubes a couple seconds later
Golem uses attacks a couple seconds later that take a while to charge
Later Kyle and the writer attribute it to a battle
Just because something happens off-panel that doesn't give us leeway to invent context that erases Orion standing right there. If someone takes one blast all we really need is to see them in that blast without opposing context stating they dodged. In that short of timespan without additional context we can be pretty sure Orion didn't stop time for everyone but the Golem and Orion and then did backflips to other planets so they could destroy them individually while Orion ski kickflipped through Boomtubes, grinded off the Golem, lost him for 138 seconds until the Golem wall rode off the sun and did a triple frontflip through a moon Orion was hiding on all while tracking him. They looked at each other with regret knowing in another life both could find love in each other's embrace but Orion was cursed with his last name being Capulet and Golem Patrick Montague could never escape being excommunicated from his family if they were to just touch lips... only once... For in this world of woe Orion was just a sk8er boi and The Golems said see ya later skid.
We can invent context or we can use what we know/all we need to know how blasts work in comics. I'm not seeing a need to do mental skatenastics over something fairly simple that doesn't need pages of context piled on it tbh. Big blast Orion there with nothing going against it? Hmmm.
Originally posted by leonidas
you're missing one of the greats
Yeah, he forgot about "leodickus":
How it is not a vs thread leodickus,it is a battle of wills ass wipe.It is a battle of wills,or can you not comprehend that?
Master Zom was the greatest kmc poster of all time.
Originally posted by carver9
Why is this still open? Based off strength, speed, durability and power output, Bill's win this. You all factor these things in other threads involving DC characters, why not here? Bills hold every single advantage and one showing doesn't take away from that. This is a spite thread. Orion doesn't have enough fts to suggest him taking a majority against Bills.
Pre-flashpoint Orion is too much, honestly. Current stomps.