Originally posted by carver9
He had help against Ironclad and bfred him afterwards. 🤦🏿https://ibb.co/jWfVhdz
https://ibb.co/SNh3xKc
https://ibb.co/LvQxBNVNice try though
He went up against all four of them. If each one was as strong as him, he couldn't have won.
Originally posted by Endless Mike
BTW, I read the Death Metal issues and here is my impression of what was going on:Perpetua was setting up alternate versions of 3 crises (COIE, Infinite Crisis, and Final Crisis) in 3 different universes in the Dark Multiverse, and channeling the crisis energy they generated, via people made into 'antennae', to make her powerful enough to conquer the normal multiverse, which had 52 universes, and she was conquering them one at a time.
Superboy Prime smashed those universes where the alternate crises occurred, which stopped the flow of crisis energy.
So that feat was destroying 3 universes, not 3 multiverses. But later in the same story, he needed the help of about a dozen others just to 'destabilize' one version of Earth (it looked like they didn't even completely destroy it, just damaged it so the evil Batman couldn't use it to focus energy to make his new multiverse).
So it's kind of inconsistent. But still a very impressive feat.
Yeah, the original crises involved multiverses, but considering the facts that:
A. These versions of the crises were stated to be taking place within the dark multiverse (singular)
B. The events of each were shown to be significantly different from the originals, and this was noted as an important plot point
C. Even after SBP's punch, the dark multiverse (which had 52 universes) still existed in some form
D. The crisis energy that these crises provided to Perpetua was only sufficient for her to conquer a multiverse of 52 universes one at a time
This looks like the destruction of 3 universes, not 3 multiverses.
Unless, of course, you have further evidence showing that each of those realities was a multiverse.
(Don't get me wrong, it's still probably the most impressive feat posted so far, if you don't take the infinite strength feats literally).
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Yeah, the original crises involved multiverses, but considering the facts that:A. These versions of the crises were stated to be taking place within the dark multiverse (singular)
B. The events of each were shown to be significantly different from the originals, and this was noted as an important plot point
C. Even after SBP's punch, the dark multiverse (which had 52 universes) still existed in some form
D. The crisis energy that these crises provided to Perpetua was only sufficient for her to conquer a multiverse of 52 universes one at a time
This looks like the destruction of 3 universes, not 3 multiverses.
Unless, of course, you have further evidence showing that each of those realities was a multiverse.
(Don't get me wrong, it's still probably the most impressive feat posted so far, if you don't take the infinite strength feats literally).
I actually would say SBP's showing against DK( the evil Batman) in Dark Nights: Death Metal The Secret Origin is more impressive than the Crises Punch. Though it isn't a pure strength feat per se.
Besides, I think that story is the best in the Death Metal event and it also is a perfect conclusion for SBP's journey. I personally recommand you to read it
https://readcomiconline.li/Comic/Dark-Nights-Death-Metal-The-Secret-Origin
Originally posted by Endless Mike
C. Even after SBP's punch, the dark multiverse (which had 52 universes) still existed in some form
Originally posted by Galan007*And beneath the proper multiverse sits the Dark Multiverse: a literal dark reflection of the prime creation. It is defined as "a Realm much older and much vaster than ours. An oceanic, subconscious Realm our tiny multiverse floats on":
https://i.imgur.com/ZQXKej9.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/KQv5YBW.jpg
Edit:
Galan also organized relatively recent DC Cosmology in the quote, you could check them if you want to know what the recent DC Cosmology
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Yeah, the original crises involved multiverses, but considering the facts that:A. These versions of the crises were stated to be taking place within the dark multiverse (singular)
Dark Multiverse is infinite in nature.
B. The events of each were shown to be significantly different from the originals, and this was noted as an important plot point
The very nature of the COIE means it has to involve infinite Earths. So did Final Crisis. The events differed such that the villains won.
C. Even after SBP's punch, the dark multiverse (which had 52 universes) still existed in some form
Dark Multiverse is infinite, not just 52 universes. In fact just one part of the Dark Multiverse could contain entire 52 universes as seen in Tales from Dark Multiverse : Dark Nights Metal.
Its an Elseworld contained within the Dark Multiverse which contained a copy of the main DC multiverse.
D. The crisis energy that these crises provided to Perpetua was only sufficient for her to conquer a multiverse of 52 universes one at a time
That doesn't mean anything, at all.
This looks like the destruction of 3 universes, not 3 multiverses.
Unless, of course, you have further evidence showing that each of those realities was a multiverse.
(Don't get me wrong, it's still probably the most impressive feat posted so far, if you don't take the infinite strength feats literally).
Its not universes by any means.
Originally posted by abhilegend
It doesn't matter if you think it's not infinite, the entire creation was in that book.
Originally posted by carver9
"Here in Limbo, there is NO MATERIAL THINGS TO BE DESTROYED. LIMBO IS A LIVING "MEMORY".Why are you not using this scan against Superman, Dark? Just picture if this was Hulk. You have all of this evidence. I need you to use it.
Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
He was trying to argue because Limbo's matter is broken and Limbo is a living memory, so Superman didn't physically lift itWhich I suppose Carver forget that Superman specifically mentioned strength was involved in lifting said book
Originally posted by carver9
"Here in Limbo, there is NO MATERIAL THINGS TO BE DESTROYED. LIMBO IS A LIVING "MEMORY".Why are you not using this scan against Superman, Dark? Just picture if this was Hulk. You have all of this evidence. I need you to use it.
So I have re-read the comic (thus far, all of my arguments that have defeated you have been based on random memories).
You have misunderstood the scan. You read that panel, and you interpret it as Quantum Superman saying the matter in Limbo is not there, or something.
But that is wrong.
Quantum Superman is telling Superman not to worry about combining with Ultraman. Earlier in the book, we are clearly told:
Not once, but twice:
Pretty important plot point, no?
But Quantum Superman is explaining to Superman that he wouldn't be annihilated, and to trust him - aftewards, he can still go save Lois:
Ultimately, even if they combine, Quantum Superman is telling him that in Limbo, they wouldn't be destroyed - because the memory will continue to live on. I mean, we clearly see outsiders (Superman, Ultraman, Shazam , Overman etc) interacting with *things*, so there is clearly *stuff* in Limbo.
So I don't understand what your argument is. Are you arguing that Limbo is just made of memories, no physical matter? Then what are the ships anchoring themselves to? What *trash* are the ships taking? What is the infinite computer of the Ultima Thule reading, interacting with, if it is just metaphysical memory? We even see Shazam pointing out a shard from the Rock of Eternity (and bonus, Overman handling some random tech):
TL;DR: Limbo has physical matter, but Quantum Superman's statement was merely to reassure Superman that his sacrifice would not mean he would be destroyed, so he can still go on to save Lois afterward. So you are misunderstanding that scan and running with 'there is no physical matter in Limbo' - which is wrong, because Limbo DOES have matter.
Then we go onto the next part of your posts, that because Ultraman read to the end, it isn't infinite. Which is silly, because:
A: you can have a beginning and an end to infinity - there are infinite numbers between 1 &2; and
B: Ultraman was clearly wrong:
The Infinite Book contains every possible book (which was my question to you for six long years, lol):
So all Ultraman did, was read to the end of *A* book, where Mandrakk won. Obviously, Mandrakk...did not win -there is more than one story, after all. Evil did not win.
