Abortion

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
9 times out of 10 a person who ends up pregnant elected to have sex.

I'd assume a good deal more actually.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
If they didn't consider pregnancy then that is their own stupid fault. Don't kill the kid just because you're an idiot.

It's not a kid. It's a lump of cell, being a parasite in your body. I am strongly for the right to severe ties with an actual Human Being that is a parasite to your body for 9 months (violinist example), a lump of cells is quite a few steps below that actually.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
People need to stop being so "accepting" of everything and look at reality. Guess what? It is possible to NOT HAVE SEX if you don't want a baby. Just because we are hormonially teased doesn't mean we have to drop our pants every chance we get.

Nope, but it feels good. And if we want that we should do it. We should be careful of the consequences (STDs and Pregnancy and its consequences, though), but luckily there are ways to decrease the risk of that (through condoms, drugs, abortion, adoption, etc.).

Originally posted by Bardock42
I'd assume a good deal more actually.

you're probably right

It's not a kid. It's a lump of cell, being a parasite in your body. I am strongly for the right to severe ties with an actual Human Being that is a parasite to your body for 9 months (violinist example), a lump of cells is quite a few steps below that actually.

Then I guess that comes down to what you believe, because even scientists have trouble with the classification of life. And even more trouble with sentience.

And even at that... it's not being a paracite.

paracite

–noun

1. an organism that lives on or in an organism of another species, known as the host, from the body of which it obtains nutriment.

2. a person who receives support, advantage, or the like, from another or others without giving any useful or proper return, as one who lives on the hospitality of others.

3. (in ancient Greece) a person who received free meals in return for amusing or impudent conversation, flattering remarks, etc.

Nope, but it feels good. And if we want that we should do it. We should be careful of the consequences (STDs and Pregnancy and its consequences, though), but luckily there are ways to decrease the risk of that (through condoms, drugs, abortion, adoption, etc.).

Which once again brings me to a statement of immeasurable truth: "People are too pre-occupied with whether or not they can that they never stop to think whether or not they should."

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC

Then I guess that comes down to what you believe, because even scientists have trouble with the classification of life. And even more trouble with sentience.

And even at that... it's not being a paracite.

paracite

–noun

1. an organism that lives on or in an organism of another species, known as the host, from the body of which it obtains nutriment.

2. a person who receives support, advantage, or the like, from another or others without giving any useful or proper return, as one who lives on the hospitality of others.

3. (in ancient Greece) a person who received free meals in return for amusing or impudent conversation, flattering remarks, etc.

You are technically right that it is not a "parasite" due to it being the same species. The rest of the implications of the word are there though. It leeches off it's host body. If the host does not want that, she should have all right to terminate the connection.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Which once again brings me to a statement of immeasurable truth: "People are too pre-occupied with whether or not they can that they never stop to think whether or not they should."

I don't think that is true. And, I also don't think that your idea of "should" should apply to anyone else but yourself. If you think you shouldn't, go ahead, and don't do it.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Which once again brings me to a statement of immeasurable truth: "People are too pre-occupied with whether or not they can that they never stop to think whether or not they should."

No, you're wrong. You're wrong because sex isn't about "Should", as sex is no longer limited to occuring for one reason.

If the sole reason (Not purpose, reason) for sex was to reproduce, then obviously doing it without wanting a kid would be something you SHOULDN'T do.

It's not, though. Therefore, it's fine to do. There are many reasons people have sex aside from the purpose of intercourse existing, and therefore; "Do I want sexual pleasure that is derived from intercourse?" is a question. The answer "Yes I do.", is therefore not wrong, regardless of if the attachment is "But I don't want a kid.", because there are steps taken to ensure that doesn't happen.

-AC

Originally posted by Bardock42
You are technically right that it is not a "parasite" due to it being the same species. The rest of the implications of the word are there though. It leeches off it's host body. If the host does not want that, she should have all right to terminate the connection.

A "Paracite" introduced by their own actions. I have no sympathy for them.

I don't think that is true. And, I also don't think that your idea of "should" should apply to anyone else but yourself. If you think you shouldn't, go ahead, and don't do it.

But don't you see. If people actually took the steps to not try to gratify their every desire, beginning with things like not having sex unless they know they can live with the concequences, or not stealing that thing they want but don't have the money for, things would begin to happen. People would begin to become diciplined, and ever so slowly things like drunk driving, theft, and even rape would begin to become less pervalent. It wouldn't dissappear completely, but it would deminish. But it has to start somewhere.

Instead, people view life as a Burger King commercial. "Have it your way." And the media only supports this view of life. More and more often people are shown the good side of these things, but rarely the bad. And people believe it, even if not conciously.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
A "Paracite" introduced by their own actions. I have no sympathy for them.

Could you call it "parasite". How did you even find the definition of the word, as you are so bent on misspelling it?

And, yes, I noticed you don't have much sympathy for actual living human beings, while potential human beings and leeching lumps of cells, stand quite highly on your "love" list.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
But don't you see. If people actually took the steps to not try to gratify their every desire, beginning with things like not having sex unless they know they can live with the concequences, or not stealing that thing they want but don't have the money for, things would begin to happen. People would begin to become diciplined, and ever so slowly things like drunk driving, theft, and even rape would begin to become less pervalent. It wouldn't dissappear completely, but it would deminish. But it has to start somewhere.

Instead, people view life as a Burger King commercial. "Have it your way." And the media only supports this view of life. More and more often people are shown the good side of these things, but rarely the bad. And people believe it, even if not conciously.

That really just seems a step away from a 1984ish nightmare. Why should people not have sex with one another if they want to, it doesn't hurt anyone (no, potential fetuses which potentially become humans and are potentially aborted, do not count). Again, you feel your personal feelings towards sex and what should and should not happen, is not necessarily what other people feel should or should not happen.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
But don't you see. If people actually took the steps to not try to gratify their every desire, beginning with things like not having sex unless they know they can live with the concequences, or not stealing that thing they want but don't have the money for, things would begin to happen. People would begin to become diciplined, and ever so slowly things like drunk driving, theft, and even rape would begin to become less pervalent. It wouldn't dissappear completely, but it would deminish. But it has to start somewhere.

This is the part you people don't get. People ARE dealing with the consequences of say, pregnancy. Just because abortion is not a manner of doing it that YOU agree with, it doesn't mean they aren't doing it.

Pregnancy is a possible consequence of sex, people accept that when having sex. If it happens and they didn't wish it to, they deal with that consequence, sometimes, with abortion. That's dealing with the consequences, and if they can live with that, why is it any of your business?

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Instead, people view life as a Burger King commercial. "Have it your way." And the media only supports this view of life. More and more often people are shown the good side of these things, but rarely the bad. And people believe it, even if not conciously.

You get one life, one. One ever. In all eternity.

Give me ONE good reason why "Have it your way." isn't a good outlook, provided you are not infringing upon anybody else? By the way, infringing as in...properly infringing. Not "Oh, my morals are upset by what you do.", that's called being stupid.

If you're living life not doing things because you might make someone with ultra sensitive morals a bit upset, someone who doesn't even matter, then you might as well not be here. Because ironically, that's more disrespectful to life than any frivolous abortion.

-AC

Originally posted by Bardock42
Could you call it "parasite". How did you even find the definition of the word, as you are so bent on misspelling it?

ah, my apologies. I seem to want to press c instead of s when spelling parasite.

That really just seems a step away from a 1984ish nightmare. Why should people not have sex with one another if they want to, it doesn't hurt anyone (no, potential fetuses which potentially become humans and are potentially aborted, do not count). Again, you feel your personal feelings towards sex and what should and should not happen, is not necessarily what other people feel should or should not happen.

you have missed my point entirely. Read it again. It's not about my personal feelings about sex. It is about dicipline, and what in this world could be averted if we just stopped to think, instead of just doing.

You get one life, one. One ever. In all eternity.

Give me ONE good reason why "Have it your way." isn't a good outlook, provided you are not infringing upon anybody else? By the way, infringing as in...properly infringing. Not "Oh, my morals are upset by what you do.", that's called being stupid.
-AC

Because of what it leads to. Every action has farther reaching hands than people realise. even something that is consitered a relatively small act can have greater repercussions than most people think.

And it also comes down to the individual. what starts as a "little" thing invariably grows. The more you live, placing your own desires first, the more that becomes accepted. and one day, you will find yourself consitering something you thought you would never constier.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[B]

This is the part you people don't get. People ARE dealing with the consequences of say, pregnancy. Just because abortion is not a manner of doing it that YOU agree with, it doesn't mean they aren't doing it.

Pregnancy is a possible consequence of sex, people accept that when having sex. If it happens and they didn't wish it to, they deal with that consequence, sometimes, with abortion. That's dealing with the consequences, and if they can live with that, why is it any of your business?

Because, when there are alternatives that do not involve killing, people should use them. And there ARE alternatives.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC

you have missed my point entirely. Read it again. It's not about my personal feelings about sex. It is about dicipline, and what in this world could be averted if we just stopped to think, instead of just doing.

But you seem to include "not having sex if you don't want a baby" in this discipline thing, and, frankly, I am not interested in discussing other discipline issues in the abortion thread.

Originally posted by Bardock42
But you seem to include "not having sex if you don't want a baby" in this discipline thing, and, frankly, I am not interested in discussing other discipline issues in the abortion thread.

Just citing some extra examples of what is deemed "small stuff". and what would happen if we actually took a step to improve ourselves.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Just citing some extra examples of what is deemed "small stuff". and what would happen if we actually took a step to improve ourselves.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Because of what it leads to. Every action has farther reaching hands than people realise. even something that is consitered a relatively small act can have greater repercussions than most people think.

And it also comes down to the individual. what starts as a "little" thing invariably grows. The more you live, placing your own desires first, the more that becomes accepted. and one day, you will find yourself consitering something you thought you would never constier.

That's rubbish.

It doesn't have farther reaching hands just because you're overly sensitive to shit that doesn't literally nor factually affect you.

You seem to have a crushing phobia of experiencing new things, but as long as everyone is docile, things are great. You've not given any good arguments yet. Just "Don't do what you want.". So what? We'd be indulging your desire for us to not be happy, how does that work? You're asking us to consider your way, but you consider nobody else's.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Because, when there are alternatives that do not involve killing, people should use them. And there ARE alternatives.

Yeah, alternatives. Alternatives that are exactly that; additional options.

People don't have to use them, nor should they if they don't want to. You're being very silly.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Just citing some extra examples of what is deemed "small stuff". and what would happen if we actually took a step to improve ourselves.

What bullshit.

"Improve ourselves.", who are you? Who are you to tell me or anyone else that we need improving?

Improve what you feel is wrong about yourself, keep your nose out of everyone else's business. Some people disagree with your opinion of them, they may not feel they need improving. What, are they wrong? Are you right about everyone? You somehow know what's better for people than they do?

-AC

I just noticed the poll was at 212 to 194, in favor of yes. I never would have thought it would have been that close.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I just noticed the poll was at 212 to 194, in favor of yes. I never would have thought it would have been that close.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Unrelated things. Not suited for thread. Not sure why brought up.

Not entirely. People stop trying to live their lives based on what makes them "Feel good" things like abortion become... un-profitable... and thus end. You take away the people who go to these places because they are being... unresponsible... with their bodies, their profits fall, and an industry dies.

People begin to dicipline themselves instead of trying to make themselves "happy", they can more easily resist the urge to do things like rape. Abortions become less desired.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Not entirely. People stop trying to live their lives based on what makes them "Feel good" things like abortion become... un-profitable... and thus end. You take away the people who go to these places because they are being... unresponsible... with their bodies, their profits fall, and an industry dies.

People begin to dicipline themselves instead of trying to make themselves "happy", they can more easily resist the urge to do things like rape. Abortions become less desired.

Discipline is something that people try to achieve in order to attain "what feels good", for example, they work hard and very disciplined to get a better career and improve their lives. Or it is pursued for it's own sake as enjoyment. You want discipline to be applied to very specific things that you chose as important...discipline, as such, is neutral, though.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Not entirely. People stop trying to live their lives based on what makes them "Feel good" things like abortion become... un-profitable... and thus end. You take away the people who go to these places because they are being... unresponsible... with their bodies, their profits fall, and an industry dies.

You think people have abortions because they feel good? Seriously?

Let me clarify something I've clarified many times in this thread; I don't think FRIVOLOUS abortions are a good thing. I don't think people misusing their RIGHT to an abortion is a good thing, but it's a small price to pay for that right. People will misuse any freedom they have, but then there are many more who do not, and those shouldn't suffer.

On that note, you are not allowed to decide for people what they must do with their own bodies. You've got one, be responsible for your own.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
People begin to dicipline themselves instead of trying to make themselves happy, they can more easily resist the urge to do things like rape. Abortions become less desired.

Do you read this shit before you post it?

Honestly. Have you read that back and thought "I'm happy with this post."?

-AC

Originally posted by Bardock42
If people would stop living their life around what "feels good", the entire basis of the worlds economy would collapse, and the lives of many, many, many people would be a whole lot less enjoyable. Why, exactly, do you think that is desirable?

not entirely. I'm not saying to completely stay away from things that makes you feel good. That'd be foolish. I'm just saying think before you leap.

Oh, and by the way... the world does not have a single economy.

Discipline is something that people try to achieve in order to attain "what feels good", for example, they work hard and very disciplined to get a better career and improve their lives. Or it is pursued for it's own sake as enjoyment. You want discipline to be applied to very specific things that you chose as important...discipline, as such, is neutral, though.

That's not true at all. The best example of dicipline is roman soldiers. They would march into battle... they wouldn't hide, they wouldn't question, they wouldn't try to get out of it, because they knew that it was what needed to be done. Did it make them happy to be marching toward something that would probably kill them? Probably not, but they did it because they had the dicipline to put one foot infront of the other and do what needed to be done, rather than what made them happy.

Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
That's not true at all. The best example of dicipline is roman soldiers. They would march into battle... they wouldn't hide, they wouldn't question, they wouldn't try to get out of it, because they knew that it was what needed to be done. Did it make them happy to be marching toward something that would probably kill them? Probably not, because they had the dicipline to put one foot infront of the other and do what needed to be done, rather than what made them happy.

So, essentially you want a society of non-thinking, un-emotional robots?

That's essentially what you want isn't it? You believe that no happiness is worth no selfishness (Despite your wishes being selfish)?

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri

You think people have abortions because they feel good? Seriously?

Let me clarify something I've clarified many times in this thread; I don't think FRIVOLOUS abortions are a good thing. I don't think people misusing their RIGHT to an abortion is a good thing, but it's a small price to pay for that right. People will misuse any freedom they have, but then there are many more who do not, and those shouldn't suffer.

On that note, you are not allowed to decide for people what they must do with their own bodies. You've got one, be responsible for your own.

However, if you have less people missusing their right to have sex... you have less people who will desire to have an abortion.

Do you read this shit before you post it?

Honestly. Have you read that back and thought "I'm happy with this post."?

-AC

Simply because you lack the mental capacity to comprehend that if people actually work at something that they can learn to resist such urges doesn't mean it can't be done.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
So, essentially you want a society of non-thinking, un-emotional robots?

That's essentially what you want isn't it? You believe that no happiness is worth no selfishness (Despite your wishes being selfish)?

-AC

read back over my post again... prove to me that you have an intellect. I never said that there was anything wrong with occasionally doing stuff that makes you happy. But do it responsibly with a disiplined mind... and you will actually find that life becomes easier, and in the end you find that you can be happy with simply being alive.