Originally posted by Nemesis X
Anyways, abortion is child killing and that's just sick. Killing isn't allowed but it's allowed for doctors to cut up infants inside of someone? You know there's something wrong with this picture.
A) Many states have legal execution and B) a fetus is far from the same thing as an infant during the stages that abortion is legal.
Originally posted by Nemesis X
touche
Since you are incapable of answering the question, I'll assume you have a poor opinion of practicing birth control. This assumption comes from the fact that you not only blame only women for pregancies, but also that you seem to think that every preganacy is the result of woman's flagrant alcohol abuse or a woman's inability to deny a man sex when sober; I assume it's because you think that women are cock hungry. This also makes me think you are incappable of talking a woman into sex and likely this provides a crutch for you to rely on the biblical idiocy that because Eve ate the apple women are responsible for your concept of wrong-doing and human weakness and sin.
You think abortion is wrong because it's killing a little person. But, you seem to think that condoms and the birth control pill are a bad thing. Perhaps you think that sex is an action based, by god, soley on the act of procreation? Maybe you think that procreation should occur strictly by a man and a woman that are married in the eyes of god? Should we burn married couples that practice birth control in the marital bed like the jews to which you compare all abortion? How far do you take it? Abortion is murder, but so is birth control? Sex is wrong unless you're married, but worse than two men kissing if it involves sex without procreating and involving birth control? If I'm off the mark here, all you have to do is answer my original qustion.
Originally posted by Ace of Knaves
Since you are incapable of answering the question, I'll assume you have a poor opinion of practicing birth control. This assumption comes from the fact that you not only blame only women for pregancies, but also that you seem to think that every preganacy is the result of woman's flagrant alcohol abuse or a woman's inability to deny a man sex when sober; I assume it's because you think that women are cock hungry. This also makes me think you are incappable of talking a woman into sex and likely this provides a crutch for you to rely on the biblical idiocy that because Eve ate the apple women are responsible for your concept of wrong-doing and human weakness and sin.You think abortion is wrong because it's killing a little person. But, you seem to think that condoms and the birth control pill are a bad thing. Perhaps you think that sex is an action based, by god, soley on the act of procreation? Maybe you think that procreation should occur strictly by a man and a woman that are married in the eyes of god? Should we burn married couples that practice birth control in the marital bed like the jews to which you compare all abortion? How far do you take it? Abortion is murder, but so is birth control? Sex is wrong unless you're married, but worse than two men kissing if it involves sex without procreating and involving birth control? If I'm off the mark here, all you have to do is answer my original qustion.
That speech of yours reveals that you have no sense of humor. I said the bar thing just to be funny. And people say I kill jokes.
Originally posted by Nemesis XYes, you calling a fetus an infant is what's wrong.
Get a psychiatrist lady.Anyways, abortion is child killing and that's just sick. Killing isn't allowed but it's allowed for doctors to cut up infants inside of someone? You know there's something wrong with this picture.
Anyways, many places have the option to give up your child after it's birth into government or non-profit care. Which is not a bad system, really, saves children from ending up in a dumpster. Similarly I am uncomfortable with late-late term abortions, if the fetus is viable it should get the chance, I think. Not to stay in its mother's womb of course, but by being delivered or otherwise extracted. When the fetus can not survive by itself and has to be connected (in a rather parasitical way) to its mother, I feel the woman has just the same the right to disconnect this and should not be forced to endure it.
Originally posted by Nemesis XAnd when exactly, at what point in time does it become a child?
Get a psychiatrist lady.Anyways, abortion is child killing and that's just sick. Killing isn't allowed but it's allowed for doctors to cut up infants inside of someone? You know there's something wrong with this picture.
The mother has the right to give up her child for adoption when it is out of her so if the fetus were classified as a child then she would have the right to give it up as well; OOPS it is still inside of her. 😉
Originally posted by Ace of Knaves
Is that code for saying you don't support abortion but couldn't come up with a reasonble argument for your perspective?
No, not really. "Believe me, I've been there" refers to several descussions I have been in, whether it be religion, politics, video games, or abortion. I have held my own in several discussions, and been completely destroyed in several discussions.
I learn from those I win aswell as the ones I loose.
The "you are just digging yourself deeper and deeper with everything you say." is simply a statement of truth.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Yes, you calling a fetus an infant is what's wrong.Anyways, many places have the option to give up your child after it's birth into government or non-profit care. Which is not a bad system, really, saves children from ending up in a dumpster. Similarly I am uncomfortable with late-late term abortions, if the fetus is viable it should get the chance, I think. Not to stay in its mother's womb of course, but by being delivered or otherwise extracted. When the fetus can not survive by itself and has to be connected (in a rather parasitical way) to its mother, I feel the woman has just the same the right to disconnect this and should not be forced to endure it.
My main thing is that the fetus deserves the chance to live, no matter how embrionic it is. The growing human fetus didn't do anything to deserve to be terminated except be the product of the fertilisation of the wrong woman's egg.
Infact the only time I see Abortion as a viable option is when the life of the mother is at stake. Adoption is a perfectly accaptable alternative.
It brings many of the same ends as abortion:
[List]You will be free to prusue goals and dreams
You will not have to care for a baby before you are ready.
You will not have the financial burden of caring for a child.
You will not have to worry about finding a sitter, missing out on the fun with your friends and being tied down[/list]
The main differences, however is that...
With adoption the child was given a chance to live.
whearas with abortion that child's chance at life is gone, with no hope of recovering it. I really don't see how people can live with that.
And many don't
More often than not, when realisation strikes the woman she becomes excedingly unhappy, and sometimes depressed at the thought of what would have been her child.
Adoption gives hope that that child will get to live a good life, abortion... well, it will never get that chance.
It may not be legally alive at this point, or even legally human, but it is growing towards that point. It is a human fetus.
People have said to me before that it is essentially stupid to stand for something that may or may not grow to be a human, but that may is why I stand. It is a HUMAN fetus whether you like it or not, the DNA, genetics, everything about it is human. It is designed to grow into what we know as human. It will not grow into anything else infact, there are three options and only three options for what will happen to it (1) it will develop to what we know as human (2) something will go wrong, causing a miscarrage and it will die, or (3) it will be killed.
I mean you have different types of people who get pregnant:
The teen who couldn't say no
The woman who will lie down with anyone with a... wang...
Prostitutes
Porn stars
rape victims
Girlfriends
Wives
friends with benefits
etc.
Not every woman who ends up pregnant is just throwing herself around to every man there is. Or even having un-protected sex with the few people she does have sex with. Sometimes condoms break, sometimes birth control fails, sometimes things just go wrong. However, unless your own life is at risk by giving birth to that child, I don't think you have the right to take away it's chance at life.
[stupid 15 minute limit]
I do however agree to the idea of making sure that women the child can be placed in foster care. Afterall there is to my knowledge no such thing as being "pro-abortion", ie no one sane supports something that would increase the number of abortions that happen.
That's the main reason I think the "pro-life" group is disingenuous, they imply in name and rhetoric that the other side is somehow "pro-death" which isn't true. Making options clear, understandable and available is the most important thing, IMO. Outlawing abortion makes that impossible.
Originally posted by THE JLRTENJACThe problem is that the woman is forced to endure what could basically be described as torture by a parasite inhabiting her body against her will, and as a full, free human being she should not be forced to give her body to that. Sure if your argument is it shouldn't be killed actively, fair enough, then it should just be separated from the mother, if it can't survive alone that's not the woman's problem. How would you feel if some person was chained to your body (lets currently not address all the other downsides and risks of pregnancy) and you got told you will have to be chained to that person for 9 months taking it everywhere sharing everything and if you separate it it dies? Would you think it right that you'd be forced to do that?
My main thing is that the fetus deserves the chance to live, no matter how embrionic it is. The growing human fetus didn't do anything to deserve to be terminated except be the product of the fertilisation of the wrong woman's egg.Infact the only time I see Abortion as a viable option is when the life of the mother is at stake. Adoption is a perfectly accaptable alternative.
It brings many of the same ends as abortion:
[List]You will be free to prusue goals and dreams
You will not have to care for a baby before you are ready.You will not have the financial burden of caring for a child.
You will not have to worry about finding a sitter, missing out on the fun with your friends and being tied down[/list]
The main differences, however is that...
With adoption the child was given a chance to live.
whearas with abortion that child's chance at life is gone, with no hope of recovering it. I really don't see how people can live with that.And many don't
More often than not, when realisation strikes the woman she becomes excedingly unhappy, and sometimes depressed at the thought of what would have been her child.
Adoption gives hope that that child will get to live a good life, abortion... well, it will never get that chance.
It may not be legally alive at this point, or even legally human, but it is growing towards that point. It is a human fetus.
People have said to me before that it is essentially stupid to stand for something that may or may not grow to be a human, but that may is why I stand. It is a HUMAN fetus whether you like it or not, the DNA, genetics, everything about it is human. It is designed to grow into what we know as human. It will not grow into anything else infact, there are three options and only three options for what will happen to it (1) it will develop to what we know as human (2) something will go wrong, causing a miscarrage and it will die, or (3) it will be killed.
I mean you have different types of people who get pregnant:
The teen who couldn't say no
The woman who will lie down with anyone with a... wang...
Prostitutes
Porn stars
rape victims
Girlfriends
Wives
friends with benefits
etc.Not every woman who ends up pregnant is just throwing herself around to every man there is. Or even having un-protected sex with the few people she does have sex with. Sometimes condoms break, sometimes birth control fails, sometimes things just go wrong. However, unless your own life is at risk by giving birth to that child, I don't think you have the right to take away it's chance at life.
Originally posted by Symmetric ChaosThat's the main reason I think the "pro-life" group is disingenuous, they imply in name and rhetoric that the other side is somehow "pro-death" which isn't true. Making options clear, understandable and available is the most important thing, IMO. Outlawing abortion makes that impossible.
This is correct. Should be the Anti-Abortion (Or Pro-Anal) crowd Vs. The Pro-Choice crowd
Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
My main thing is that the fetus deserves the chance to live, no matter how embrionic it is. The growing human fetus didn't do anything to deserve to be terminated except be the product of the fertilisation of the wrong woman's egg.Infact the only time I see Abortion as a viable option is when the life of the mother is at stake. Adoption is a perfectly accaptable alternative.
It brings many of the same ends as abortion:
[List]You will be free to prusue goals and dreams
You will not have to care for a baby before you are ready.You will not have the financial burden of caring for a child.
You will not have to worry about finding a sitter, missing out on the fun with your friends and being tied down[/list]
The main differences, however is that...
With adoption the child was given a chance to live.
whearas with abortion that child's chance at life is gone, with no hope of recovering it. I really don't see how people can live with that.And many don't
More often than not, when realisation strikes the woman she becomes excedingly unhappy, and sometimes depressed at the thought of what would have been her child.
Adoption gives hope that that child will get to live a good life, abortion... well, it will never get that chance.
It may not be legally alive at this point, or even legally human, but it is growing towards that point. It is a human fetus.
People have said to me before that it is essentially stupid to stand for something that may or may not grow to be a human, but that may is why I stand. It is a HUMAN fetus whether you like it or not, the DNA, genetics, everything about it is human. It is designed to grow into what we know as human. It will not grow into anything else infact, there are three options and only three options for what will happen to it (1) it will develop to what we know as human (2) something will go wrong, causing a miscarrage and it will die, or (3) it will be killed.
I mean you have different types of people who get pregnant:
The teen who couldn't say no
The woman who will lie down with anyone with a... wang...
Prostitutes
Porn stars
rape victims
Girlfriends
Wives
friends with benefits
etc.Not every woman who ends up pregnant is just throwing herself around to every man there is. Or even having un-protected sex with the few people she does have sex with. Sometimes condoms break, sometimes birth control fails, sometimes things just go wrong. However, unless your own life is at risk by giving birth to that child, I don't think you have the right to take away it's chance at life.
Lots of "I think" and "I believe" and "I mean" in your opinions of what another person does with their body.
Interesting how the quality of life hasn't come up yet.
Pro-choice doesn't mean that if I get pregnant tomorrow, I'm gonna happily skip to the nearest abortion clinic while whistling a jaunty tune, then high five the doctor like "Yay, we did it!".
It is true that the aftermath of an abortion can cause depression and other mental issues, but you can't say that giving up a baby cannot.
First, what's the guarantee that the baby gets adopted? Second, if the baby does get adopted, what are the odds it's a normal family? Emotionally, financially, mentally? Can they feed him, keep him warm, love him?
If in the first nine months in the womb, mother and baby don't connect, it's gonna screw the kid up big time. Look it up.
And if you're really pro-life, get active. There are kids all around the world who need your help. 'Cause their lives are what? Couple of years of suffering and then a painful death. If they knew that you're worried about some little ball of cells you have nothing to do with while they have nothing to eat, no clean water, and every day could be their last, they'd think you're just simply cruel. (Sorry for the activist tone.)