Abortion

Don't know, the putting babies up for adoption angle and stating negative "what if" scenarios sounds kinda silly.

You'd probably have a hard time finding people who were placed for adoption/given to the state, saying "yeah, I wish mother had just aborted me." Sure, the odd Emo or two, maybe.

Originally posted by Robtard
Don't know, the putting babies up for adoption angle and stating negative "what if" scenarios sounds kinda silly.

You'd probably have a hard time finding people who were placed for adoption/given to the state, saying "yeah, I wish mother had just aborted me." Sure, the odd Emo or two, maybe.

But you'd find a lot who might say "I wish that my life didn't suck".

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
But you'd find a lot who might say "I wish that my life didn't suck".

Probably mostly Emos and/or teens going through their angst.

Originally posted by Ace of Knaves
What a tremendously beneficial and productive contribution to your argument.

Originally posted by Nemesis X
Get a psychiatrist lady.

Anyways, abortion is child killing and that's just sick. Killing isn't allowed but it's allowed for doctors to cut up infants inside of someone? You know there's something wrong with this picture.

yes, because i was being oh so serious. stop taking things so literally.

i've stated my opinion of abortion in this thread. i feel no need to repeat it. there's the search tool if you feel so inclined.

That you are joking is fine, but anti-choice proponents actually leap to this conclusion about anyone who disagrees with them; so perhaps it would be wise not to give them ammo to misconstrude the alternative's perspective on these issues.

or maybe people need to dissect why their thought process automatically draws up to the conclusions they want to attack the most. i've given no one any ammo. they interpreted what i said how they wished because that's what they wanted to hear.

Originally posted by Fallen
or maybe people need to dissect why their thought process automatically draws up to the conclusions they want to attack the most. i've given no one any ammo. they interpreted what i said how they wished because that's what they wanted to hear.

Perhaps that was my point.

ah, well, i'm not going to censor myself because others feel uncomfortable with what i say.

i'll continue to make morbid comments when i feel the impulse.

Originally posted by Fallen
ah, well, i'm not going to censor myself because others feel uncomfortable with what i say.

i'll continue to make morbid comments when i feel the impulse.

I didn't say you should censor yourself. Simply be prepared to be taken seriously by those that consider this a modern American holocaust.

i might as well stop adding disclaimers then. i'll leave it to others to decide if i'm being serious or not. i'll do no further explaining. if someone has a heart attack and condemns my soul, so be it.

Your independence and strong will intimidate me. I wish I was you.

I found out recently that my sister had an abortion once. Just saying.

Originally posted by Ace of Knaves
Your independence and strong will intimidate me. I wish I was you.

you should. you really should. on both accounts.

but i warn you, its not an easy gig.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I found out recently that my sister had an abortion once. Just saying.

Do you view her as worse for it now?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Do you view her as worse for it now?

Nah. Just a weakness. Not everyone is strong enough to raise a child. Not every woman is strong enough to endure pregnancy and child birth. Not everyone is strong enough to try giving up their child for adoption.

It takes a stronger person, in this day and age, to want to do the kid thing AND do a good job. That's why I'm thankful that something like abortion exists...some people shouldn't even think about having children.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Nah. Just a weakness. Not everyone is strong enough to raise a child. Not every woman is strong enough to endure pregnancy and child birth. Not everyone is strong enough to try giving up their child for adoption.

It takes a stronger person, in this day and age, to want to do the kid thing AND do a good job. That's why I'm thankful that something like abortion exists...some people shouldn't even think about having children.

I think that is a silly view, but as long as you support the outcome I support it's cool.

Speech by the 'bama at Notredame

Article: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_obama_notre_dame

SOUTH BEND, Ind. – President Barack Obama strode head-on Sunday into the stormy abortion debate and told graduates at America's leading Roman Catholic university that both sides must stop demonizing one another.

Obama acknowledged that "no matter how much we want to fudge it ... the fact is that at some level, the views of the two camps are irreconcilable." But he still implored the University of Notre Dame's graduating class and all in the U.S. to stop "reducing those with differing views to caricature. Open hearts. Open minds. Fair-minded words. It's a way of life that always has been the Notre Dame tradition."

One of the noisiest controversies of his young presidency flared after Obama, who supports abortion rights but says the procedure should be rare, was invited to speak at the school and receive an honorary degree. "I do not suggest that the debate surrounding abortion can or should go away," the president said.

The Rev. John Jenkins, Notre Dame's president, introduced Obama and praised the president for not being "someone who stops talking to those who disagree with him." Jenkins said too little attention has been paid to Obama's decision to speak at an institution that opposes his abortion policy.

Ahead of Obama's address, at least 27 people were arrested on trespassing charges. They included Norma McCorvey, the plaintiff identified as "Roe" in the Roe v. Wade Supreme Court decision that legalized abortion. She now opposes abortion and joined more than 300 anti-abortion demonstrators at the school's front gate.

More than half held signs, some declaring "Shame on Notre Dame" and "Stop Abortion Now" to express their anger over Notre Dame's invitation to Obama.

Obama entered the arena to thunderous applause and a standing ovation from many in the crowd of 12,000. But as the president began his commencement address, at least three protesters interrupted it. One yelled, "Stop killing our children."

The graduates responded by chanting "Yes we can", the slogan that became synonymous with Obama's presidential campaign. Obama seem unfazed, saying Americans must be able to deal with things that make them "uncomfortable."

The president, in prepared remarks released by the White House, ceded no ground. But he said those on each side of the debate "can still agree that this is a heart-wrenching decision for any woman to make, with both moral and spiritual dimensions.

"So let's work together to reduce the number of women seeking abortions by reducing unintended pregnancies, and making adoption more available, and providing care and support for women who do carry their child to term."

He said he favored "a sensible conscience clause" that would give anti-abortion health care providers the right to refuse to perform the procedure.

Before taking on the abortion issue, Obama told graduates they were part of a "generation that must find a path back to prosperity and decide how we respond to a global economy that left millions behind even before this crisis hit an economy where greed and short-term thinking were too often rewarded at the expense of fairness, and diligence, and an honest day's work."

Obama's appearance appeared additionally complicated by fresh polls that show Americans' attitudes on the issue have shifted toward the anti-abortion position.

A Gallup survey released Friday found that 51 percent of those questioned call themselves "pro-life" on the issue of abortion and 42 percent "pro-choice." This is the first time a majority of U.S. adults have identified themselves as "pro-life" since Gallup began asking this question in 1995.

Just a year ago, Gallup found that 50 percent termed themselves "pro-choice" while 44 percent described their beliefs as "pro-life."

A Pew Research Center survey found public opinion about abortion more closely divided than it has been in several years.

Pew said its latest polling found that 28 percent said abortion should be legal in most cases while 18 percent said all cases. Forty-four percent of those surveyed were opposed to abortion in most or all cases.

Gallup said shifting opinions lay almost entirely with Republicans or independents who lean Republican, with opposition among those groups rising over the past year from 60 percent to 70 percent.

The abortion issue also is front and center as Obama considers potential nominees to fill the vacancy left by the retirement this summer of Justice David Souter. Abortion opponents are determined to see Roe v. Wade overturned, but only four court justices out of nine have backed that position. Souter has opposed arguments for overturning the ruling.

The Catholic Church and many other Christian denominations hold that abortion and the use of embryos for stem cell research amount to the destruction of human life, are morally wrong and should be banned by law.

The contrary argument holds that women have the right to terminate a pregnancy and that unused embryos created outside the womb for couples who cannot otherwise conceive should be available for stem cell research. Such research holds the promise of finding treatments for debilitating ailments.

Within weeks of taking office in January, Obama eased an executive order by President George W. Bush that limited research to a small number of stem-cell strains.

On the Notre Dame campus, members of an abortion rights group also protested while a plane pulling an anti-abortion banner circled above. Tara Makowski of Seattle, who received a master's degree Saturday from the school, said she was dismayed by the way Notre Dame was being characterized.

"Seeing us being portrayed nationally as radical conservative has been really tough," she said. "People need to realize that the majority of students and faculty" favored Obama's visit.

But Bishop John D'Arcy, whose diocese includes Notre Dame, skipped commencement. He attended an open-air Mass and rally. He said he wanted to support the students protesting Obama's speech.

"All of you are heroes, and I'm proud to stand with you," he said.

Obama was the ninth president to receive an honorary degree from Notre Dame and sixth sitting president to address graduates. Other commencement speakers have included Dwight Eisenhower, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush and George W. Bush.

Back in Washington, Vice President Joe Biden attended Mass with his family at Holy Trinity Church, where a granddaughter received her first Communion.

Full Text of the Speech: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_obama_notre_dame_text

Right-wing talking heads will skew this into "Obama wants to kill babies for money."

"So let's work together to reduce the number of women seeking abortions by reducing unintended pregnancies, and making adoption more available, and providing care and support for women who do carry their child to term."

I think Obama is better about this abortion thing than I am...as far as being as neutral as possible.

It is rather selfish and cold to do an abortion, even from a non-thesit perspective. However, they shouldn't be denied the ability to abort when the "baby" isn't even fully human yet.

But why should someone be rewarded for not making responsible love, but decides to keep the baby? Why should more of my tax dollars go towards supporting a douchebag b****, the douchebag bastard, and possibly the douchebag man? Wouldn't it be cheaper to just abort for ALL parties involved? We certainly don't need more humans in some locations. I don't want to pay for babies.

Obama is absolutely correct in his assessment that we need to prevent the pregnancies to begin with in addition for the moral perk of adoption support. This, all in addition to keeping abortion legal. I can't think of a better middle ground.

Now, I'm sure these are not all Obama's ideas, but he had to agree to do it and he spoke it and agrees with it. A very level headed president, imo. Sure, I don't agree with everything in his polices, but he is definitely a very good president. I like this guy.

Who doesn't? 😄