Weakest person
Who's the weakest person that can survive being hit by Jiren attack? Pure durability, no gimmicks.
Weakest person
Who's the weakest person that can survive being hit by Jiren attack? Pure durability, no gimmicks.
To be that guy (because someone has to be):
Based on? In DBZ collateral damage is meant to be king, right? So would I be correct in basing the destructive output on collateral damage in that scene?
Or is it a 'well, Jiren is level 9000000, and he later says (not in this scene) that it's his most powerful attack, ergo etc etc'?
Logical power-scaling.
During BoG, a massively suppressed Beerus and a n00b-SSG Goku could have destroyed the universe as a side effect of their punches/kicks colliding. Additionally, the "super-dense energy ball" created as a result of their ki attacks colliding could have destroyed the universe as well(had Beerus not negated it.)
Fast-forward to early in the ToP, and Jiren(who hadn't even began powering-up yet) was casually blocking strikes from SSG Goku(who had become vastly more powerful than he was during BoG) with a single finger:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG_Nkveg9xw&t=0m55s
Fast-forward to later in the ToP(where carver's clip is from), and a powered-up Jiren charges an 'all-out' ki attack and launches it at Omen Goku.
tl;dr
Both physical and energy attacks already had universe-busting potential as far back as BoG... And Jiren is many, many orders of magnitude beyond that.
...And no, collateral damage doesn't mean much in DB. Otherwise Roshi, with a PL of 139, would still be a top contender, due to his moon-busting feat.
Originally posted by cdtm
Beerus was the universe buster, doesn't really prove Goku on his own is. Especially since he still isn't even close to Beerus level after all his upgrades.Arale knocked him around easily enough, is she a universe buster too?
Beerus Universal attack, Goku canceled that shit out. A suppressed Beerus is universal, a full powered, we don't know where he is at power wise but FAR above that. Jiren attack is by far the most powerful attack in the entire series minus him powering up beyond that level. Let's just say, Hulk and Superman ain't tanking this attack AND Beerus. So who's enduring it?
Originally posted by Galan007
Logical power-scaling.During BoG, a massively suppressed Beerus and a n00b-SSG Goku could have destroyed the universe as a side effect of their punches/kicks colliding. Additionally, the "super-dense energy ball" created as a result of their ki attacks colliding could have destroyed the universe as well(had Beerus not negated it.)
Fast-forward to early in the ToP, and Jiren(who hadn't even began powering-up yet) was casually blocking strikes from SSG Goku(who had become vastly more powerful than he was during BoG) with a single finger:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG_Nkveg9xw&t=0m55sFast-forward to later in the ToP(where carver's clip is from), and a powered-up Jiren charges an 'all-out' ki attack and launches it at Omen Goku.
tl;dr
Both physical and energy attacks already had universe-busting potential as far back as BoG... And Jiren is many, many orders of magnitude beyond that....And no, collateral damage doesn't mean much in DB. Otherwise Roshi, with a PL of 139, would still be a top contender, due to his moon-busting feat.
Well Nebula Man is a universe - and Superman took his attacks just fine:
Hard to gauge. Just because someone is the physical embodiment of a universe, doesn't mean that every single attack they generate contains universe-busting potential... I'd also add that 'just' calling Jiren's attack a universe-buster is likely an extreme low-ball. There are so many orders of magnitude between BoG-level power(which was already universe-busting) and Jiren-level power, that it's hard to even wrap my head around. /shrug
Also, this seems to be a durability-themed thread(ie. who could survive said attack.)
Originally posted by carver9Yeah, the Kamehameha that MUI Goku used to drop 'Limit Breaker' Jiren was logically more powerful by a huge margin.
Jiren attack is by far the most powerful attack in the entire series minus him powering up beyond that level.
I also assume that you're only referring to the DBS anime, because Jiren-level power is pretty much irrelevant by current manga scaling.
Originally posted by Galan007
Hard to gauge. Just because someone is the physical embodiment of a universe, doesn't mean that every single attack they generate contains universe-busting potential... I'd also add that 'just' calling Jiren's attack a universe-buster is likely an extreme low-ball. There are so many orders of magnitude between BoG-level power(which was already universe-busting) and Jiren-level power, that it's hard to even wrap my head around. /shrugAlso, this seems to be a durability-themed thread(ie. who could survive said attack.)
Superman has many, many examples against that though, as you know better then most. Galaxy, universe, Multiverse, he's seen it all at some point.
Just off the top of my head, in Death of the New Gods when the source wall broke, Superman's barrier was retracted/shattered, and he stood out there riding the loose energy as Scott and Metron enjoyed protection.
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-6a0312f4899be239df942dc49596719f-lq
Kind of a low quality scan but you can just about make out Metrons words.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85Right.
Yeah, it's difficult to say because the two mediums are so different, with different tropes.I mean, how would we quantify an IMP, for example. That's literally infinite, so would mean it's universe++ - but comics don't work like that.
I think it just comes down to who you think can survive something like that. As mentioned, Jiren's attack was logically universe(+)-busting... So I'd imagine that we'd have to delve into abstract-esque tiers of power to find someone who could soak it.
Originally posted by Galan007
Right.I think it just comes down to who you think can survive something like that. As mentioned, Jiren's attack was logically universe(+)-busting... So I'd imagine that we'd have to delve into abstract-esque tiers of power to find someone who could soak it.
Yeah, and I think we are both in agreement when I say comics just isn't set up like that, with the PIS (a forum/battle board construct) that exists.
For example, Cho-Hulk was punching the Moon with hits that registered 123 on the Richter scale. That's enough to destroy the universe or something like that (Magnon/Astner/h1 can check). Of course, we chalk that up to PIS - even though it happened in a canon comic.
Cyborg has hit Johnny Quick with a million decibels, lol. That's.... universe+ energy attacks. Again, canon comic.
Supergirl got hit with a BILLION decibels from magical Silver Banshee. That's.... hyperbole?
But if we want to compare these two universes on a similar base, either we take all examples at face value equally, or we subject all examples to scrutiny.
I don't disagree, because yeah, it's hard to quantify cross-genre stuff like this.
As mentioned, Jiren's ki blast was logically universal at the very least... But like you said, plenty of comic characters have one-off showings to suggest they might be able to soak something like that(with the PIS-force in effect, of course.) So I dunno. /shrug