Originally posted by FootGarment
Please. Gideon's penis is far too large for any human's mouth to contain. But really, is that the best you can come up with after getting curbstomped in... what is it now, our last ten consecutive debates? Get back to me when you lose that old age sense of wit and can actually manage to intellectually keep up with the Almighty God (Gideon). Until then, quit the bitching.And yes, that's right, I'm talking to you Nebaris, what now?!
Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Read almost any book mentioning Sidious,
No. It's your job to provide your own proof, not mine.
he is described as the most powerful Sith.
Right, and you appear to have not grasped the fact that the word "powerful" is ambiguous and that narration isn't always presented from an omniscient perspective.
Even Death Star, the most recent novel mentioning him calls him the most powerful Sith ever.
Right, apparently you're either an idiot, or have no clue what "proof" actually is, because telling me that a book says such a thing is not actually proving that the book says it. It's on you to provide a quote at the very least, and a page number is almost always necessary.
But, though it's really not on me to prove you wrong, I feel like dispelling the ridiculous idea that Sidious is factually stated as being the most powerful (in a combat sense) Sith Lord in this recent EU novel.
Here's the actual entire passage surrounding the quote you're referring to:
Vader could sense the hostility of some of the men behind Tarkin, but that was of no importance. Hostile words or actions he could and would deal with, but thoughts of the weak-minded were no threat.
Tarkin, oily and smooth as always, was a man who knew where his best interests lay, and as long as his own plans matched those of the Emperor, he was a useful tool. Which was good, because Vader would not hesitate to use that tool.
The Rebels were turning out to be more troublesome than many had expected. The Emperor had known it would be thus, of course; the resistance had not been a surprise to him. The Emperor was completely in concert with the dark side of the Force. He was the most powerful Sith who had ever existed.
As would Vader be, someday.
But that was in the future. Now he had more mundane duties. There were problems with the construction of this station. When Vader left, those problems would be corrected. He would return as necessary to correct more troubles as they appeared, and he would also return at times when things were proceeding smoothly, just to remind Tarkin and his senior officers that the Emperor's eye was always watching them.
Always.
Now, as can be seen, the passage constantly refers to Vader's thoughts, feelings, and perceptions, which would make it very likely that the passage is indirectly voicing him. This idea is cemented with the sentence that follows directly from the one you've been referring to:
"As would Vader be, someday."
If the passage were really being spoken directly from an omniscient source, then we would be forced to subscribe to the idea that Vader -- at some point in time -- eventually did become the most powerful Sith Lord there's ever been, and managed to surpass Sidious, yet we know that never happened. In other words, the only way in which the sentence would make sense would be if it were coming from the perspective of a fallible source, and in this case, that fallible source quite clearly is Vader, as supported above, and further supported by the idea that he's shown to possess that belief (that he would oneday surpass Sidious) in numerous sources.
Not to mention, even if that were actually directly coming from an omniscient narrator (which it definitely isn't), the word "powerful" is ambiguous, and in this context, to assume that it refers to a personal level of combat adeptness is completely ridiculous. Refer to the sentence just before the one you've been referring to, where it's said that:
"The Emperor was completely in concert with the dark side of the Force."
I doubt you even understand what that means, so I'll tell you; it means that every action that Palpatine took, and every goal he possessed, were all with the full interests of the dark side at heart. In other words, he was as dedicated towards it as one can get. That sense of dedication made him powerful, in the sense that he was willing to be patient where others wouldn't (waiting for decades until he could eradicate the Jedi and conquer most of the Galaxy for instance) and do things which he completely detested (such as his pleasantries with the Jedi, his most hated enemies).
So to recap, there's no way in which you can conclusively prove that the statement speaks in respect to battle prowess, and the context would make it appear that such an idea is certainly not the case.
Quit making me look sily.
As I said, I was going to, but your comment in the other thread was just too hurtful.
foot garment why are you doing this? why do you think every one here is wrong? what make you think out all the people here and alll the debating they have done about star wars not as a group but as individuals about star wars make you think that you are right on everything?
If you have a question about some thing ask.if you think some one is wrong ask, how they are right, how does that make sense?
Until then no one give a flying fvck about your pesonal crusade!!!
Originally posted by FootGarment
I'm afraid that's not the only thing discrediting the argument, and I'm afraid failing to understand the concept of ambiguity makes you an idiot.
What a beacon of wit. And you have the temerity to lecture others about it? How very desperate. Though twenty-one banned accounts does seem to hint at some severe psychological issues.
Sport. 😉
I thought you'd default on some nice Ad Hominem rather than attempt to argue the point with me. Well at least you're finally realising that you can't quite compete with the NMan. I guess that's something. Now I'd suggest attempting to engage Kadesh or Darth Sexy in a debate, I mean everyone deserves to win once in a while eh, and it's not something that will happen if you continue this odd vendetta you appear to have against me. Publius is looking down on you, and he's not impressed.
Originally posted by Atticus
foot garment why are you doing this? why do you think every one here is wrong? what make you think out all the people here and alll the debating they have done about star wars not as a group but as individuals about star wars make you think that you are right on everything?If you have a question about some thing ask.if you think some one is wrong ask, how they are right, how does that make sense?
Until then no one give a flying fvck about your pesonal crusade!!!
I feel that Neb's quote 'proving that Vader surpassed Palpatine' is misread. It seems more to be suggesting that Vader has the potential to become the greatest Sith Lord ever; as Vader's viewpoint is the viewpoint used, he does not forsee himself leaving the Sith.
I don't recall Vader ever becoming the most powerful Sith Lord. If he had, he would have done away with Palpatine and taken the mantle of Dark Lord of the Sith for himself, the title of Master.
But he hadn't, had he?
Originally posted by Captain REX
I feel that Neb's quote 'proving that Vader surpassed Palpatine' is misread. It seems more to be suggesting that Vader has the potential to become the greatest Sith Lord ever; as Vader's viewpoint is the viewpoint used, he does not forsee himself leaving the Sith.I don't recall Vader ever becoming the most powerful Sith Lord. If he had, he would have done away with Palpatine and taken the mantle of Dark Lord of the Sith for himself, the title of Master.
But he hadn't, had he?
well palp broke his will at the end of rots so even if he was powerful enough, he wont rebel, but you mods just glance oover the profanity huh?
Originally posted by Captain REX
I feel that Neb's quote 'proving that Vader surpassed Palpatine' is misread. It seems more to be suggesting that Vader has the potential to become the greatest Sith Lord ever; as Vader's viewpoint is the viewpoint used, he does not forsee himself leaving the Sith.I don't recall Vader ever becoming the most powerful Sith Lord. If he had, he would have done away with Palpatine and taken the mantle of Dark Lord of the Sith for himself, the title of Master.
But he hadn't, had he?
The misreading appears to have been on your part. Neb wasn't arguing that Vader had surpassed Palpatine. He was using the statement to support the idea that the short passage was coming from Vader's PoV rather than the omniscient narrator's. If the passage were coming from the omniscient narrator, the statement: "As would Vader be someday (the most powerful sith who had ever existed)" would mean that Vader would have had to eventually surpass Sidious and any Sith before him, which is factually not true. Meaning that the passage is definitely not coming from the omniscient narrator, rendering the quote that people have claimed makes Sidious the most powerful Sith ever - canonically - void.
Originally posted by MutantMessiah
The misreading appears to have been on your part. Neb wasn't arguing that Vader had surpassed Palpatine. He was using the statement to support the idea that the short passage was coming from Vader's PoV rather than the omniscient narrator's. If the passage were coming from the omniscient narrator, the statement: "As would Vader be someday (the most powerful sith who had ever existed)" would mean that Vader would have had to eventually surpass Sidious and any Sith before him, which is factually not true. Meaning that the passage is [b]definitely not coming from the omniscient narrator, rendering the quote that people have claimed makes Sidious the most powerful Sith ever - canonically - void. [/B]
Why are you speaking in 3rd person NOobaris. Everybody knows its you so you look even more like an idiot.
ROFL!!! MAking that claim void? That is the dumbest thing you've ever said by far. Nobody even has to refute this piece of crap for it to be false. You lose again, tool.