Originally posted by Porsche
EVEN if he let Wolverine tackle him, was that smart considering he could have stabbed him in the gut as the picture shows? ANSWERHis hands were NOT in position to break Wolverine's neck before his got the first punch in the picture (the one where they say he could have thrown him). He could have died there. I can show the whole scans (as I have done at least 3 times now) but I felt this would emphasize my point
i'm not debating strategy or his brains, i'm stating what happened. and you are lying about the fact that spidey (at least according to wolverine) could have killed wolvie as well. his hands WERE around wolvie's throat even as wolvie had his hands under spidey's chin. in the panel BEFORE the one you showed, wolvie says -- and i quote --
"we both know the only way for you to beat me is for you to use all your strength -- and snap my neck. bang. you win. thing is, i'm betting my life you ain't got the guts for that. you don't know how to kill."
so, to use your method of proof, while wolvie was talking, spidey could have snapped his neck. dead wolvie.
and whirly, i don't KNOW if spidey could have snapped his neck. that's an OOOLLLLDDDDDD argument. obviously having his vertebrae lined with adamantium is meaningless because it's the soft tissue and nerve damage that would kill him. there is no ratioanl explanation why he COULDN'T break his neck. it is NOT like spidey would need to break adamantium to break his neck. but . . .. that would leave a LOT of unanswered questions as regards wolvie . . .
Originally posted by who?-kid
Wolverine supporters always complain when normal people call the graveyard fight a fight with lots of PIS and CIS in it.There are reasons for that, however.
1. For some reason, Spider-Man was scared. Spider-Man is one of the most courageous (and human) heroes of Marvel, and has a very large rogue gallery he beats up every day, but all of a sudden, he was... scared...to die.
"speedermen z brafr den dat!"
Originally posted by who?-kidNot after that first fight. . . But it was a first fight afterall. . .
Why was he all of a sudden so scared ? I don't know. What I do know however, is that he has in all the fights NEVER been scared of Wolverine. Not even once, not even close.
Wolverine was probably faster than he expected and that spidersense was probably screaming at him, he had to ignore it to push foreward to hit him. . .
Originally posted by who?-kidSpiderman wasn't moving slow. . . Nowhere near slow. 🤨
2. Spider-Man IS faster than Wolverine. Only the diehard Wolverine fans will say they are about equal, but that's bollocks. But again, in this fight, Spider-Man moves slow and Wolverine moves very fast.
Wolverine couldn't even hit him until he let him tackle him.
Originally posted by who?-kidBecause you're misinterpreting the fight? How was SPiderman moving slow? He said he felt slow, but that's probably because he was expecting Wolverine to go slower.
Why ? Beat me.[]/b]
Originally posted by who?-kidProbaly wasn't thinking straight, you'll notice the fight starts with Spiderman grabbing wolverine from behind and leaping sideways, after that Wolverine takes a few swipes at him (and misses of course) and his spidersense was screaming at him about how dangerous those claws are, that caused him to panic because as I said before this was their first fight.
[B]3. Spider-Man doesn't use his web. Why ? I don't know, in lots and lots and lots and lots of fights, he uses his webs but here he decided to fight close combat style. He uses his web as much as CA uses his shield or Thor uses his hammer.
Originally posted by who?-kidYes because the writer hasd to be drunk. 🙄
I don't know what the writer was drinking that day...
Originally posted by who?-kidBecause he was probably a bit paniced still. having a danger sense can be a hassle sometimes when it is constatly yelling at you that Something is lethal.
4. On top of that, Spider-Man lets Wolverine tackle him...I don't think he has ever done that in his life... why oh why oh why ?
But again, this was their first fight, and spiderman was unfamiliar with Wolverine.
Originally posted by who?-kidIT ended in a draw because Wolverine didn't want to kill spiderman. . .
ConclusionA slow moving, non-web using and scared Spider-Man still gave Wolverine a hard time, and it still ended in a draw, in a twenty year old fight.
creshok asketh:
<<Do you have a sarcasm detector?
And why couldn't Wolverine have stabbed Spiderman when he tackled him?>>
😑
damn, you DO get defensive on this thread, don't know? i was AGREEING with you. YES, wolvie COULD have stabbed him. YES it was stupid. spidey must have known wolvie wasn't really TRYING to kill him. had he fully believed that, the whole fight would have been done differently. no way they would have fought in such close quarters.
but foregt that: you never answered my question. CAN spidey beat wolverine?
Originally posted by leonidas
i'm not debating strategy or his brains, i'm stating what happened. and you are lying about the fact that spidey (at least according to wolverine) could have killed wolvie as well. his hands WERE around wolvie's throat even as wolvie had his hands under spidey's chin. in the panel BEFORE the one you showed, wolvie says -- and i quote --"we both know the only way for you to beat me is for you to use all your strength -- and snap my neck. bang. you win. thing is, i'm betting my life you ain't got the guts for that. you don't know how to kill."
so, to use your method of proof, while wolvie was talking, spidey could have snapped his neck. dead wolvie.
and whirly, i don't KNOW if spidey could have snapped his neck. that's an OOOLLLLDDDDDD argument. obviously having his vertebrae lined with adamantium is meaningless because it's the soft tissue and nerve damage that would kill him. there is no ratioanl explanation why he COULDN'T break his neck. it is NOT like spidey would need to break adamantium to break his neck. but . . .. that would leave a LOT of unanswered questions as regards wolvie . . .
Take a look at the post you quoted me on. You must be referring to a different panel. When the landed on the floor, Wolverine came down with a punch to the face. Look at Spiderman's hands. Look again... got it? One more time just to make sure. Ok. The final panel they may both be able to "kill" each other (Wolv could Def kill spidey but not vice versa) but Wolv already had many previous opportunities to finish him... but we know Wolv wasn't trying to kill him. Spiderman would never had had the chance to put his hands on Wolverine's head if at any point Wolverine wanted him dead.
Originally posted by leonidasWolverine was mistaken or lying to spiderman.
i'm not debating strategy or his brains, i'm stating what happened. and you are lying about the fact that spidey (at least according to wolverine) could have killed wolvie as well. his hands WERE around wolvie's throat even as wolvie had his hands under spidey's chin. in the panel BEFORE the one you showed, wolvie says -- and i quote --"we both know the only way for you to beat me is for you to use all your strength -- and snap my neck. bang. you win. thing is, i'm betting my life you ain't got the guts for that. you don't know how to kill."
so, to use your method of proof, while wolvie was talking, spidey could have snapped his neck. dead wolvie.
and whirly, i don't KNOW if spidey could have snapped his neck. that's an OOOLLLLDDDDDD argument. obviously having his vertebrae lined with adamantium is meaningless because it's the soft tissue and nerve damage that would kill him. there is no ratioanl explanation why he COULDN'T break his neck. it is NOT like spidey would need to break adamantium to break his neck. but . . .. that would leave a LOT of unanswered questions as regards wolvie . . .
Because how would Spiderman have broken 616 Wolverine's neck?
10 tons back then is what Spiderman's strength was.
Want me to bring up the various examples of how Wolverine's skeleton was held together by the 616 weapon X bonding process?
I am so glad Spiderman gave it his all! I'll bet firelord and sinsister 6 wished he gave it his all like this all the time🙂
LOL YES please show me Cresh how the 616 bonding works and post up the crucify scene because its um how do you say IMPOSSIBLE anatomically the way you described unless the bonding is bogus🙂
Originally posted by Creshosk
Wolverine was mistaken or lying to spiderman.Because how would Spiderman have broken 616 Wolverine's neck?
10 tons back then is what Spiderman's strength was.
Want me to bring up the various examples of how Wolverine's skeleton was held together by the 616 weapon X bonding process?
Yeah, the 616 version bones don't come apart for whatever reason. Countless examples have illustrated this. Could be his bones are all connected via ball&socket joints?
He could have turned his neck in a way that hurt him but nothing he couldn't heal from. We've seen him take much worse.
Originally posted by leonidas
<<Want me to bring up the various examples of how Wolverine's skeleton was held together by the 616 weapon X bonding process?>>skeleton. if the bonding extended to the soft tissue, please explain how he moves his neck.
Weapon X program may have added material to his bones in places to prevent them from coming apart.
He's a mutant, maybe he was born that way.
Originally posted by leonidasSorry, but with all I put with from the spiderman supporters I tend to get really cynical.
creshok asketh:<<Do you have a sarcasm detector?
And why couldn't Wolverine have stabbed Spiderman when he tackled him?>>😑
damn, you DO get defensive on this thread,
Originally posted by who?-kidTackled him with sheathed claws. The Spider sense probably stopped screaming at him as much, when Wolverine was no longer lethal and would probably just be a painful threat.
don't know? i was AGREEING with you. YES, wolvie COULD have stabbed him. YES it was stupid. spidey must have known wolvie wasn't really TRYING to kill him.
Originally posted by who?-kidHe was sort of paniced from the first Wolverine swipe.
had he fully believed that, the whole fight would have been done differently. no way they would have fought in such close quarters.
Originally posted by who?-kidWell, I've been trying to figure out how exactly.
but foregt that: you never answered my question. CAN spidey beat wolverine?
Can't pummel him. Webbing is tricky, cause its hard to get him in a position he can't get out of.
So what else is there?
I'm not saying that there isn't a way for Spiderman to win. I just haven't seen anyhting that gives him a win yet, so I can't say for certain how many times out of ten either can win.
Right now it's mostly draws, Wolverine winning more after that as Wolverine can take Spiderman down. But I'm still looking for a way for Spiderman to take Wolverine down.
Its this simple......Spiderman and Wolverine are flagship characters. Meaning thier fan bases are very die-hard fans. As much as people in here would denie that they come in with any sort of pre-determaned veiw, this whole set of arguments has been based on certian points of A)bad writing B) Bad inerpritations of artists or c) BS stories. Spidey is not god, he can't dodge everything...he has been hit by people much slower and less trained than Logan. Webs are a good tool....they are not/nor have I ever seen them be what most people decribe in this thread.....unbreakable weapons. From what I've seen on this thread (I've prolly only read like 100 pages or so) its people argueing whenther Wolverine could hold his own. On one side you have the spider-supporters saying spiderman wins 9 out of 10 times. Then on the other side you have people saying wolviey could, key word, could take it to Spiderman. The wolvie based argument is that he is very dangerious and has the ability to hit, hurt or kill spiderman....not that spiderman is useless in this fight like the otherside is saying about Wolvie. The best thing I seen was a post (sorry I can't remember who) that pretty much stated that it depended on the enviroment....and in a lot of ways he is correct. I understand that there is a popular hatered of my favorite adimantium laced character....I understand some of it...particuraly the fanboy arguments. But much of the hatered I have no idea where it comes from.......I hear people say he's too powerfull and whatnot and then on other threads they defend superman or GL, its rather hypocritical. eatherway thats a moot point. Does Wolverine have a good shot here? Yes absolutly. He is a damn good fighter, the enhanced sences just further that along, he heals rapidly (granted not Morrison like...but still impressive.) and has unbreakable bones. He can beat Spidey. does that mean peter can't win? No. Spidey also has good chances in this fight. He is increadably fast, strong and has spider-sence. So both of them are very equaly matched...thats why this tread is so damn long. So depending on the circumstances and whatnot....5 out of 5 the both would win....in an equal opertunity enviroment.
<<Yeah, the 616 version bones don't come apart for whatever reason. Countless examples have illustrated this. Could be his bones are all connected via ball&socket joints?>>
😆
i love the 'for whatever reason', bit . . .
there ARE no ball and socket joints in the spine. vertebrae are seperated by soft tissue.
Originally posted by leonidasIt didn't. But how are you going to move the cord without touching or moving the vertebrae?
<<Want me to bring up the various examples of how Wolverine's skeleton was held together by the 616 weapon X bonding process?>>skeleton. if the bonding extended to the soft tissue, please explain how he moves his neck.
Which are somehow held together.
We know the bones are held to gether from various events where he should have and would have lost limbs or his head twice, had the adamantium not held his bones together.
Two different Swordsmen have landed shots intended to go between the vertebrae, but failed to do so. if there had been nothing to hold his head on, he would have been decapitated. . . but he wasn't.
Two different occasions all the flesh(everything down to the bone) was burned away, and we see his joints. . . with nothing holding his arm together. . . but it didn't fall apart.
There have even been people strong enough to pull normal human bones apart fail to pull Wolverine's apart.
In timelines that diverge from 616 AFTER the weapon X bonding process Wolverine has been killed and only his skeleton has remained, but in both occurances his skeleton was in one peice, it wasn't a pile of bones.
In an alternate reality that diverged before the weapon X bonding process, then he looses his hand.
In another reality that was probably never part of 616 he is ripped in half.
Originally posted by leonidasAnd multiple seperation attempts have failed in the 616 universe.
<<Yeah, the 616 version bones don't come apart for whatever reason. Countless examples have illustrated this. Could be his bones are all connected via ball&socket joints?>>😆
i love the 'for whatever reason', bit . . .
there ARE no ball and socket joints in the spine. vertebrae are seperated by soft tissue.
What does that tell you?
<<Well, I've been trying to figure out how exactly.
Can't pummel him. Webbing is tricky, cause its hard to get him in a position he can't get out of.
So what else is there?
I'm not saying that there isn't a way for Spiderman to win. I just haven't seen anyhting that gives him a win yet, so I can't say for certain how many times out of ten either can win.
Right now it's mostly draws, Wolverine winning more after that as Wolverine can take Spiderman down. But I'm still looking for a way for Spiderman to take Wolverine down.>>
cool. 😉