Juggernaut or The Hulk?

It's becoming such a headache to reply to someone as pointless as you. Because we've already reached the point that we know where we stand, you're clearly trying to convince me otherwise, I'm not trying to convince you to do anything. So unless you are gonna come through with decisive evidence that is gonna convince me of an outcome to a fight that hasn't justifiably happened in the context we are referring, I'm not gonna keep replying to stuff about Living Tribunal, Onslaught and such. Because it's irrelavant.

"Judging by this picture, that's almost exactly what he did. Except he was turning ON a power that negated Juggernaut's."

Not possibly that he was powering himself up? He was definately without a doubt, 100% provable, negating Juggernaut's energy?

"can hulk beat him?? i think you will agree the answer is a definate no... if you dont, i dont know what to say about that."

In an ARM wrestling match? More likely than actually beating him in a fight, which is a no.

"it IS credible, because it affected hulks persona. hulk in mainstream was funneling energy from a "pocket universe". "

First it's a legitimate universe, then a pocket one. Make your mind up.

"havnt you ever read the marvel/dc crossover with galactus and darkseid??? just as a reference... silver sufer and one of those damn green lanters say the universes are "claiming what is theres". it was energy. not energy drawn from each and every person in it. but it was energy from the universe itself think about it. kinda like galactus. he has a phenominal/unlimited amount of energy."

Yes I have and fair play to your point there. My whole point in bringing War Hulk up was that as a fight, it is recorded and also as I said. There really is more to the energy thing than you make it out to be. We've been there, you don't agree. So it's not going anywhere.

"what have i changed my opinion on???"

Many times within the "unstoppable debates" it's been shown that to you, it's been "about" different things.

"it wasnt created in this thread, and its not his official name.................when you change everything about the person, are they even the same person anymore?? no, they are then an imposter. hence the name "imposternaut". "jobbernaut". you can think of many that would fit."

Then why act as such? Qualities changing do not equate to actual person change.

"hulk wasnt fighting back?? like when juggernaut charged him, and he jumped over cain marko (juggernaut in street clothes) and he fell to the ground. or when juggernaut charged him over the waterfall, hulk wasnt holding his fists up in a punching/threatening manner?? hulk was just defeated before he could mount an AFFECTIVE counter attack. he was fighting back."

You admit he didn't launch a counter attack, just a defence, then say he fought back. He didn't. If he knew who it was he would have. Juggernaut clearly has insecurities about his own power coz Hulk taunted him about it next issue and he got pissed off.

"not juggernaut vs hulk + heroes reborn universe + main stream universe."

By that theory, this thread is "Hulk Vs Juggernaut+Cain Marko". This is so irrelevant.

I've replied to all that I have an opinion on. We both know where we stand and we both keep saying this thread is Hulk/Juggernaut. Which you and I have done to death. If we were saying things each other hadn't heard I would understand. Still, can go as long as you want.

-AC

Originally posted by Mainstream
exactly how strong is the Juggerant...he in the above 100 ton class right?

Most likely. When he does something strengthwise, he doesn't seem strain that much. Except against Hulk for the same reasons he was knocked out by Superman in one punch most likely. He can increase his strength at will but Cain hasn't shown the ability to use that directly.

my word were going round in circles here lol. every time new guys get on here we go back to the beginning of this debate.
* hulk is marvels top muscle guy likwe it or not, he wont lose to juggie.
* these two havent had an all out battle without some form of controversy so dont bother using past fights.
* hulk as a character i perfectly capable of getting strong enough to, well , do anything really, thats how he was developed as a character so beating up on juggie is well within the confines of hulk as a character. i dont see a reason why hulk would not get so strong as to render cytoraks power irrelevant. perfectly possible.
* juggie on strength is not in hulks class, as hulk is obviously unlimited. hulk also heals quicker as he gets madder, so what exactly is juggie gonna do to beat hulk????? he wont knock him out before he gets stronger ( unless the story is poorly written) so dont use that, hulk has stood up to incredibly powerful punches before without being knocked out, ( as well as the times he has been knocked out by say namour, abom, etc) and were talking savage hulk hereso more often than not he is able t take whats thrown at him.
*hulk as a character was created to be able to beat anyone. do any feat of amazing strength/power should it be needed without breaking outside his actual character ( some guys here need to actually read some bios, look at some history etc here). so beating up on anyone is not past him whatever magic etc should the story require it.
* juggie could win as namour has knocked hulk down etc, this depends on the writer and also the nature of the story etc, thats why i think hulk is cool. he can lose to someone like namour then smash a planet twice the size of earth in another story, or demolish gladiator etc.

Originally posted by Tough Guy
* juggie on strength is not in hulks class, as hulk is obviously unlimited. hulk also heals quicker as he gets madder, so what exactly is juggie gonna do to beat hulk?????

What the? If a monkey had infinite strength I could still slit its throat with a kitchen knife. Strength doesn't equal durability.

yes hulk would heal, very quickly unlike a monkey.next question??
( read my posts properly please)

Originally posted by Tough Guy
yes hulk would heal, very quickly unlike a monkey.next question??
( read my posts properly please)

Healing has nothing to do with straight durability. And I did read it properly. I read it properly the last time somebody posted it and the time before. Physical strength isn't durability.

If we're being pedantic, which seems to be the flavour of the thread, something with infinite strength would necessarily be insanely durable.

whobdamandog, don't multiple post like on the last page anymore. If you want him to answer the question that badly, then pm him, don't flood the thread like that.

so many posts happend when I was gone! wow!

Say Tron, you are a moderator now???? congrats

This thread is becoming so... repeated.

Whatever.

Originally posted by IRTMU-Dragon
This thread is becoming so... repeated.

Whatever.

C'mon man, this thread is over a year and a half old. Of course it's repetitive.

It was only 17 pages in when I joined back in July.

So it can't be a year and a half old Pretty damn long though.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
It was only 17 pages in when I joined back in July.

So it can't be a year and a half old Pretty damn long though.

It's pretty close to a year and a half old. About a year and 3 months to be more precise.

Must have been relatively inactive before I joined then. Or kick started again just before.

-AC

Originally posted by Tron
It's pretty close to a year and a half old. About a year and 3 months to be more precise.

Oh hell naw.😂

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Not possibly that he was powering himself up? He was definately without a doubt, 100% provable, negating Juggernaut's energy?

ok, one last time i'm going to try and explain this to you. onslaught separated hulk from banner. banner was in one universe, hulk in the other. hulk was funneling energy from BOTH universes. juggernauts magic only functions against 1 of those universes. apocalypse allowed hulk to harness that energy. yes, its 100 percent provable. he only stopped juggernaut, because of a negation factor. not with strength.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
In an ARM wrestling match? More likely than actually beating him in a fight, which is a no.

hulk cannot beat living tribunal in 1) an arm wrestling match 2) a physical fight. he couldnt even beat champion. champion would have murdered him, and he manifests his power from 1 universe physically. imagine what LT could to to him 😉 oh, and hulk couldnt even beat thing in an arm wrestling match. think about. provided it wasnt madder/stronger hulk. but that hulk on paper should have started at a base strength higher than thing. therefore should have won.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
First it's a legitimate universe, then a pocket one. Make your mind up.

heroes reborn is a legitimate universe. juggernauts magic functions against 1 universe, and its laws. not the other. which is why hulk could negate juggernauts magic, in that one issue. regardless if its a so called "legitimate" universe or a pocket universe (which is still a universe) juggernauts magics didnt function against it.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yes I have and fair play to your point there. My whole point in bringing War Hulk up was that as a fight, it is recorded and also as I said. There really is more to the energy thing than you make it out to be. We've been there, you don't agree. So it's not going anywhere.

the marvel/dc crossovers we were talking about, they are my favorites. the best written IMO. but i'm not sure what you are saying here.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Many times within the "unstoppable debates" it's been shown that to you, it's been "about" different things.

i've said the same thing, from beginning to end... i never disputed that war stopped him. or that war won the fight. i'm just relating to you that war didnt do it with strength. and that juggernauts power (or anybodies) for that matter is NOT absolute. any power can be worked around. juggernauts was worked around.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Then why act as such? Qualities changing do not equate to actual person change.

the "imposternaut" isnt just quality changing. it changed the character completely. it changes his written and "recorded" history. the writer openly admits to not caring about the characters pasts. he also admits to wanting colossus, and jamming juggernaut on the team to replace colossus. you cant draw a line from "imposternaut" to the real juggernaut.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You admit he didn't launch a counter attack, just a defence, then say he fought back. He didn't. If he knew who it was he would have. Juggernaut clearly has insecurities about his own power coz Hulk taunted him about it next issue and he got pissed off.

isnt fighting back also defending yourself??? if somebody punchs you, are you not gonna fight back??? what is fighting back called?? a counter attack.... hulks just wasnt very affective. also, juggernaut doesnt have "insecurities" about his power. hulk taunted him, and juggernaut got angry. its because the juggernaut power makes its wielder an angry fellow. the point of being the juggernaut is destruction. juggernaut was just willing to prove himself.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
By that theory, this thread is "Hulk Vs Juggernaut+Cain Marko". This is so irrelevant.

well, cain marko doesnt help out the juggernaut power. hulk being the focal point of 2 universes worth of energy, increases hulks power. cain marko is just the body that houses the juggernaut power. this thread is about juggernaut and hulk, not hulk with his upgrades. if you want to play like that, lets roll in juggernaut whom was 100 ft tall and was controlled by "an outside influence" and harnessed the full power of the juggernaut. who would win then??

How did I know he was gonna reply solely to every single thing I said?

Here we go again:

"yes, its 100 percent provable. he only stopped juggernaut, because of a negation factor. not with strength."

Good stuff.

I don't believe he is unstoppable by definition, which was my point by bringing the stopping up.

"oh, and hulk couldnt even beat thing in an arm wrestling match. think about. provided it wasnt madder/stronger hulk. but that hulk on paper should have started at a base strength higher than thing. therefore should have won."

In fights, Thing gets whooped. So it's irrelevant. Need to stop refering to everyone else but Juggernaut. It's actually giving people headaches to read this thread, including myself. It's stopped becoming fun due to the sheer irrelevance and misinterpretation of this thread. People can say what they like about the fact that I'm saying it now but I am genuinely finding it boring.

"i'm just relating to you that war didnt do it with strength. and that juggernauts power (or anybodies) for that matter is NOT absolute. any power can be worked around. juggernauts was worked around."

I don't get how he can be manipulated, beaten and overcome over the history of Marvel Universe existance, yet be referred to as this unstoppable being. By I don't get it, I do...I just think it's rather foolish.

"the "imposternaut" isnt just quality changing. it changed the character completely. it changes his written and "recorded" history. the writer openly admits to not caring about the characters pasts. he also admits to wanting colossus, and jamming juggernaut on the team to replace colossus. you cant draw a line from "imposternaut" to the real juggernaut."

As much as I agree with you 90%, I don't believe you can sever ties. That's just an opinion. I believe he was refered to as Juggernaut, butchered maybe. But Juggernaut all the same.

"isnt fighting back also defending yourself??? if somebody punchs you, are you not gonna fight back??? what is fighting back called?? a counter attack.... hulks just wasnt very affective. also, juggernaut doesnt have "insecurities" about his power. hulk taunted him, and juggernaut got angry. its because the juggernaut power makes its wielder an angry fellow. the point of being the juggernaut is destruction. juggernaut was just willing to prove himself."

Counter-Attack means countering an attack.....with an attack. Hulk didn't, Hulk blocked and dodged. If he went into a fighting pose and nothing connected, it doesn't equate to having countered. So you can't say that it was an ineffective attack. If Juggernaut was so sure he'd beat him, he could have turned up in the suit. He wouldn't have got pissed when Hulk said he couldn't beat him without slying it.

"if you want to play like that, lets roll in juggernaut whom was 100 ft tall and was controlled by "an outside influence" and harnessed the full power of the juggernaut. who would win then??"

An ADDITIONAL outside influence. If you wanna dip into incarnations all it takes is The Maestro for this thread to be over.

-AC

so you think maestro could beat a 100 ft tall juggernaut... who's power and strength grew in proportion to his size??? i find that funny...

thats the only thing i wanted to comment on. maestro still had trouble with thor. thor in warrior maddness, but it was still thor none the less. juggernaut in "8th day" form dispatched thor easier than maestro did.

oh, i guess i did want to comment on another thing. you said stop refering to everybody but juggernaut. i'm just relating to you that you said hulk could beat LT in an arm wrestling match, but he couldnt beat thing 😉

i'm also relating to you the like opponents they have fought. hulk and juggernaut are one in the same. both physical rivals in strength. they both attack in the same way, so the only way to compare (besides there battles with each other) is the battles with like opponents.

such as thing, and thor....