Juggernaut or The Hulk?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Until Hulk takes and dies from the God-Force I'm not gonna assume it'll kill him. Not saying it wouldn't, so don't confuse that.

If you weight up how many times Juggernaut has take the God-Force blast next to how many times the X-Men have beat him, not very impressive.

How many times has Hulk been beat by a cement pit? None.

-AC

How are you even drawing a legitament comparison?

Apples and Oranges much?

Juggernaut's ability to take a godly blast....to the number of times an entire team of good guys with varying powers including 4....(Xavier, Jean, White Queen, Psylocke) telepaths.

Hulk would get beat even faster by the X-men. He doesn't have ANY protection against telepathic attacks. Atleast Juggernaut has a helmet.

Beat by a cement pit? Surely you don't consider being delayed by a pit of cement a loss!

Hell, Thor's god-blast cracked the ground below Juggernaut causing him to fall into a huge pit...which was later filled with molten metal (steel or iron) and then cast deep into space.

Thor didn't consider that a victory.

So why is Juggernaut being slowed down by a pit of cement considered a loss?

I said beat.

He was overcome by the cement pit. He wasn't fighting the cement pit so it can't be a loss can it? You know perfect well what I meant by saying beat. When you "beat" a game, you haven't won a fight have you?

"Hell, Thor's god-blast cracked the ground below Juggernaut causing him to fall into a huge pit...which was later filled with molten metal (steel or iron) and then cast deep into space.

Thor didn't consider that a victory."

Do you? I pretty much believe the fight ended at that point. Thor's idea of victory probably didn't work within the bounds of winning an actual fight. That's his character's nature.

"Hulk would get beat even faster by the X-men. He doesn't have ANY protection against telepathic attacks. Atleast Juggernaut has a helmet."

I honestly don't think the X-Men are a match for Hulk, telepaths or not, but that's not part of this thread Hulk Vs X-Men. I used it as an example. Juggernaut has one mind. Easy to take with telepathy. The last noteable time someone tried to take over Hulk with telepathy, he cause a psionic backlash that knocked everyone around him, out. Including Juggernaut. Again, that's neither here nor there though.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
If you weight up how many times Juggernaut has take the God-Force blast next to how many times the X-Men have beat him, not very impressive.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
However, there's never gonna be a winner until it's Hulk Vs Juggernaut one on one without some kind of trick. Eg: Juggernaut disguised or what not.

lol..this thread will never die....

"You're going to keep humping that but refuse to awknowledge it's always because of a telepathic assault?"

Alot will be solved if posts are read. Now go, my padawan, and read.

"That was just pure stupidity on Hulk's part. How many times does he see 11 foot normal men walking around? And how many hits would of it taken before he realized it wasn't just a construction worker? Had he not gotten knocked out."

Back then Hulk wasn't the sharpest knife in the drawer. If that was Juggernaut in his suit, different story.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Alot will be solved if posts are read. Now go, my padawan, and read.

Back then Hulk wasn't the sharpest knife in the drawer. If that was Juggernaut in his suit, different story.

"If he was smart enough to put on a t-shirt, he should of been smart enough to fight back."

Should of and would of are irrelevant. He didn't, Juggernaut didn't show up in suit. So it's always gonna be there. If they ever fight again and there's no sneak attacks or tricks. We'll see.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I said beat.

He was overcome by the cement pit. He wasn't fighting the cement pit so it can't be a loss can it? You know perfect well what I meant by saying beat. When you "beat" a game, you haven't won a fight have you?

Honestly, if i knew perfectly well what you meant, i'm sure i would have come up with a better answer. As it is, I don't have that particular comic, but from the way you have to put the silver lining on it....I'm going to go ahead and say NO, trapping Juggernaut in cement and running away from him doesn't count as beating him. It counts as running away from him.

"Hell, Thor's god-blast cracked the ground below Juggernaut causing him to fall into a huge pit...which was later filled with molten metal (steel or iron) and then cast deep into space.

Thor didn't consider that a victory."

Do you? I pretty much believe the fight ended at that point. Thor's idea of victory probably didn't work within the bounds of winning an actual fight. That's his character's nature.

Honestly...no.

Anytime you need to warp your opponent out into space in order to survive the battle, then it really shouldn't be considered a defeat. Essentially all Thor did was buy himself time to run away.

"Hulk would get beat even faster by the X-men. He doesn't have ANY protection against telepathic attacks. Atleast Juggernaut has a helmet."

I honestly don't think the X-Men are a match for Hulk, telepaths or not, but that's not part of this thread Hulk Vs X-Men. I used it as an example. Juggernaut has one mind. Easy to take with telepathy. The last noteable time someone tried to take over Hulk with telepathy, he cause a psionic backlash that knocked everyone around him, out. Including Juggernaut. Again, that's neither here nor there though.

-AC

You get 1/2 a point for the last answer.

The Hulk was successfully assaulted and dominated by a much weaker telepath than Professor Xavier or Jean Grey. I don't quite remember the guy's name but he was a timid looking little guy.

What the X-men do to Juggernaut is assault his mind. They attack it, they don't try to control it. Hulk was a slave under mind control, a straight on psychic attack with the intent of putting the big fella down would be significantly different.

Or am I wrong in assumeing that Professor Xavier's power and Jean's power both trump the other guy's?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Back then Hulk wasn't the sharpest knife in the drawer. If that was Juggernaut in his suit, different story.

Well, I could've swore that version of Hulk WAS the sharpest knife in Banner's drawer.😐

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
If he was smart enough to put on a t-shirt, he should of been smart enough to fight back.

😂

I almost lost a lung on this one.

"Anytime you need to warp your opponent out into space in order to survive the battle, then it really shouldn't be considered a defeat. Essentially all Thor did was buy himself time to run away."

Then I imagine many of Marvel's victories don't count to you? I class that as a defeat by way of ending the battle.

"Honestly, if i knew perfectly well what you meant, i'm sure i would have come up with a better answer. As it is, I don't have that particular comic, but from the way you have to put the silver lining on it....I'm going to go ahead and say NO, trapping Juggernaut in cement and running away from him doesn't count as beating him. It counts as running away from him."

That was a Spider-Man fight anyway, I was using it as an example. The fact that Juggernaut was halted by a cement pit. Outsmarting someone into being incapacitated during a fight obviously doesn't count as a victory to you. So that's just falling on what we perceive as a loss.

"They attack it, they don't try to control it. Hulk was a slave under mind control, a straight on psychic attack with the intent of putting the big fella down would be significantly different. "

I don't really see why we're getting into this based on the one example I used but whatever. They would have to attack each and every consciousness he has, not an easy task.

"Or am I wrong in assumeing that Professor Xavier's power and Jean's power both trump the other guy's?"

Yeah but they're not involved. The X-Men have become part of this fight based on an example I used. B-bit pointless.

"Well, I could've swore that version of Hulk WAS the sharpest knife in Banner's drawer."

Now he is, wasn't exactly ultra smart at the time apparantly. My point was, there has never been a clear cut one on one fight between the two with no if's or but's. If there was, I believe it would be alot different results. I believe Juggernaut knew that or he wouldn't have turned up without looking like Juggernaut.

-AC

abomination when he FIRST faught hulk nearly killed him, he was of course far stronger then. hulk has had the upper hand since alpha, i know the comic where he throws abon into a chopper at the end, thats not the fight i mean.
*tron, ur as always arguing alongside my point yet totally missing it. juggie is not marvels top tough guy, the one they call on to do the unimaginable ( break onslaughts armour, hold up a friggin mountain range etc) hence thats why hulk is potentially able to beat , well , anyone, he has no boundry to his raw power, ( essential in a fight) and well juggie does, ( though of course this is not known and he is very powerful too potentially). hence why hulk actually getting strong enough to not only bet but hurt juggie, ( ie overpower cyttorak) is possible for hulk.
* my point b4 was yes u could write spidey beating collosus, but 1 on 1 in a punch up, then no, that would be outside the character of spidey as his strength is like 10 times less as is his durability etc. were talking a brawl here and hulk in a brawl CAN be written smashing anyone due to the nature of his powers, and who he has been designed to be as a character.
* Now the controversy to my argument, of course juggie is as powerful as those who have before knocked hulk out, beaten etc, ( namour, glob, thing ) so as hulks character is also highly unpredictable ( we dont know for sure what incarnation even will be used) then yes juggie could well for the sake of the story manage to knock hulk out, beat him, however this would depend on the story of course. the same as has happened b4 to him.
* u failed to see my point, juggie has not been in anywhere near as many comics as hulk to prove himself actually in hulks league when hulk is on TOP form, there no argument to this. also his silly force field highlights his problems as a character as it makes very litle sense for an invulnerable being to need a forcefield. unless he has no super strength to break say chains or spidey webbing etc. as soon as he became nore of a regular character when he joined the x me it was interesting to see how they modified him to be more realistic to the stories. hulk is more regular and still as powerful.

The forcefield is for things physical invulnerablity doesn't cover.

(coughing) Hu (coughing)lk.

Originally posted by Mainstream
(coughing) Hu (coughing)lk.

nah....

yes swanky so marvel just thought hmmmm here is an invulnerable hero, lets go dc and give him a force field so as now not even confeti is able to touch him?????? why. to me it seems an inconsistancy, if a hero is infinitly strong as is hulk u dont see marvel give him i dont know teleprtation powers to lift things with, they rely on the characters strength. why for juggie would they decide nope, invulnerability ( actually a very high level of durability) is not enough, lets go with a force field too?????? its just inconsistant writing on a bit part character thats all. as ive said when juggie became an x man and appeared more repeatedly ( not just being the big bad wolf in the forest that writers could write as they needed too) he was very much less powerful than guys on here associate jggie being. just think about it.

hulk if was a real life character would never lose a fight anyway. infinite strength with a hard ass durability in the real world would be unbeatable in a physical fight

Originally posted by Tough Guy
yes swanky so marvel just thought hmmmm here is an invulnerable hero, lets go dc and give him a force field so as now not even confeti is able to touch him?????? why. to me it seems an inconsistancy, if a hero is infinitly strong as is hulk u dont see marvel give him i dont know teleprtation powers to lift things with, they rely on the characters strength. why for juggie would they decide nope, invulnerability ( actually a very high level of durability) is not enough, lets go with a force field too?????? its just inconsistant writing on a bit part character thats all. as ive said when juggie became an x man and appeared more repeatedly ( not just being the big bad wolf in the forest that writers could write as they needed too) he was very much less powerful than guys on here associate jggie being. just think about it.

Kind of hard to read the middle part.

He's not as strong now that he's appearing more because he's not getting as much, if any, power from cyttorak.

i can't believe a topic that's lasted for 131 pages now only has 20 votes........ they shouldn't have limited the poll

swanky its not overpowering just silly and out of context with most REGULAR marvel characters, hence u dont get hulk with limitless strength, oh and also a telechenetic lifting ability so he doesnt ever get his hands dirty!!!! thats the premise with juggis force field, it stinks of being used to define the character which is supposadly invulnerable anyway. sometimes writers have clean forgotten it anyway, presumably it mystifies them too.
like i said in reality a being as hulkis created to be with limitless strength and healing tied n with his anger is not gonna lose a brawel, no matter what magic you are using , eventually hulk would overpower it, and yes if glactus himself was to refrain from using his magic etc and just fight hulk fisticuffs only he too would be in a position to get his are whipped.