Originally posted by SUPERMANDAMAN
Well thats a whole lot bull sh*t seeing as how Hulk slaped juggy around pretty easily and about killed him when he was dressed as War but whatever ur little sites say.
That fight counts, its just that Apocolypse used the fight as a test of how the Celestial's power accounts itself against the might of Cytorrak. He says so himself. At the end of the fight Hulk ripped the implants out. I don't blame Juggy for losing that. Even the Asgardian's Destroyer armor, which was created to defeat the Celestials, was scrapped by them in short order. Besides, Supermandaman, its even sounds funny saying 'dressed as War'. That's like Barbie 'dressed' as an astronaut, or cheerleader, or stopper of the unstoppable. 😛
The only thing is that Cain may eventually regain his full power, so that Juggy Classic can battle again, while Hulk will probably never allow himself to become subservient to that technology ever again, despite the fact that it granted him such an obvious power advantage. Maybe if there is another war of the Octessence War can take part as an avatar of the Celestials.
And no, we can't let this thread die. Little does he know it but moshtitan's life depends on the continuation of this thread!!!
AC: Are you talking about the Rhino or rhinocerous? Do you think I could get my money back if you mean the second?
"Um, it broke." 😉
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Funny how you knew which one I meant. Quite a revealing parapraxis.
i know all about the hulk vs. juggernaut battles..... i dont think it's funny at all.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I don't think it's more than 5 pages back. It wasn't THAT long ago but given the rate people post it may have been shoved back. Doing it to get under people's skin is a bit childish don't you think? Soiling what is otherwise a great debate with sillyness.
i dont care, i dont recall saying it, and i dont wanna go back and look. enought about that.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
So you're gonna assume Juggernaut can do everything Hulk can just because he hasn't done them.....? Strange that. Very strange.
no......... i'm going to assume that juggernaut can do them, because he has matched hulk physically in every one of thier fights, except when hulk was augmented to abnormal levels of power.....
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
It was in relation to you saying Rhino fought Hulk for a few pages. Hulk beat Rhino, Juggernaut beat Rhino. They both overcome the opponent. As you've said before, how it happens isn't really that big a deal at the end.
well, i was just relating to you that juggernaut had done what hulk has done, in a de-powered state..... even with thing, hulk has never beaten him that easily before..... come on man.....
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Then I can say, because he knows it wont work. We go around again. You would think after the multiple times Thor has thrown it all at Hulk and it had ill effect, he'd step his game up. He isn't NOT doing it because he doesn't need to. It's because realistically they're both good guys and mainly because he can't beat Hulk.
well, i seriously doubt that hulk would be able to withstand the godforce......thor has shown to be able to hold his own with hulk.... several times.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Coming from the person who's main argument against the first Onslaught battle was "What if we just say there was not actual fight", this comment seems a little tainted.
well, you have your opinion, and i have mine. how is it that onslaught has done what nobody else has done?? it's all off-panel, and that should be in-valid.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Why are you just saying actual facts mean nothing? It's quite evident there was a fight. You don't get cuts, bruises and damage all over your body from one punch to the face.
you dont know what happend, because you didnt see it. it was quite evident also that stevie defeated juggernaut too, but without the gem of cyttorak it wouldn't have been possible. you dont know the circumstances of what happened, so how can you actually use it as a reference???
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You think Hulk doesn't have the strength to make him utter such words? Seriously?
i'm sure he does...... but has hulk ever been able to make thor do it??? no he hasnt (i thought i would answer that one for you, so you dont have to reply back to it.)
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
In the fight where Thor gets called in to take out the Hulk (when he thought, incorrectly, that he was wrecking the city) he witnessed the infamous atomic bomb incident. He realised everything he threw at the Hulk was doing nothing and he was doing more damage to everything else than Hulk. He seemed a little frightened then (Sarcasm). Thor never feared Juggernaut enough to keep out of the way of being grabbed. He keeps his distance from Hulk coz he knows what will happen. You wanted fear and it's there. Personally I've never seen fear like the look on his face when he thought he beat Hulk and Hulk just mocked him.
actually thor got in the way of juggernaut to delay him long enough for an officer to pull an innocent person to safety...... which is the only reason he got close enough for juggernaut to grab him in the first place. plus has thor ever refered to hulk as "undefeatable"??? nope (thought i would answer that one for you too)
it seems as though you are just trying to dis-credit me, rather than what i say. so i'll not continue replying to what you say, unless it has actual information in it.
"i know all about the hulk vs. juggernaut battles..... i dont think it's funny at all."
Did you understand what I meant? Apparantly not.
"i dont care, i dont recall saying it, and i dont wanna go back and look. enought about that."
Oh, disregarding stupid claims? I'll go find it later then.
"no......... i'm going to assume that juggernaut can do them, because he has matched hulk physically in every one of thier fights"
In that particular area we were discussing feats though, not fights.
"well, i was just relating to you that juggernaut had done what hulk has done, in a de-powered state..... even with thing, hulk has never beaten him that easily before..... come on man...."
I'm not denying it was impressive but Juggernaut was only de-powered. What's to say he wasn't powered up extra and only came down to normal strength? Either way Juggernaut is by no means a slouch and I think he could take Thing de-powered or not. My point is that Hulk and Juggernaut both beat Rhino in the end.
"well, i seriously doubt that hulk would be able to withstand the godforce......thor has shown to be able to hold his own with hulk.... several times."
Yeah but hardly anyone can withstand the odinforce Thor. Thor can hold his own but he can't beat Hulk.
"you dont know what happend, because you didnt see it. it was quite evident also that stevie defeated juggernaut too, but without the gem of cyttorak it wouldn't have been possible. you dont know the circumstances of what happened, so how can you actually use it as a reference???"
Then why is it ok for you to assume there was no fight?
"i'm sure he does...... but has hulk ever been able to make thor do it??? no he hasnt (i thought i would answer that one for you, so you dont have to reply back to it.)"
Didn't need to go to the trouble. People don't want to see Hulk making Thor fear for his life, that's the point. There's so much more to this than Juggernaut/Hulk. It's about writing. People wanna see a badass villain threatening their favourite hero so then it's all the sweeter when Good triumphs. Which I dare say is the only reason Juggernaut does as well as he does against Hulk, one of anyway.
"actually thor got in the way of juggernaut to delay him long enough for an officer to pull an innocent person to safety...... which is the only reason he got close enough for juggernaut to grab him in the first place. plus has thor ever refered to hulk as "undefeatable"??? nope (thought i would answer that one for you too)"
You're too kind but I'm an able fingered person, I can type.
Thor may not have referred to him as undefeatable. I don't even do that. Others in the Marvel universe have though. But if that's your argument then neither Juggernaut or Hulk are undefeatable. Pointless.
"it seems as though you are just trying to dis-credit me, rather than what i say. so i'll not continue replying to what you say, unless it has actual information in it."
I'm not trying to discredit you, you've done that to yourself multiple times. All I do is give information. I've rarely gone solely on opinion in this thread. If you don't like what I say then don't reply. I'll reply to whatever I wish. Either way this thread is near enough dead. You clearly wont budge, neither will I. So I agree to disagree. I applaud you for holding this debate on your own near enough and I've enjoyed it but after almost 34 pages, it's getting tedious for multiple reasons.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
In that particular area we were discussing feats though, not fights.
but it doesnt change the facts that juggernaut has proven just as capable of physical strength as hulk. they are directly compared by name, all over the place. there is no reason to think that juggernaut -cant- perform feats in question if he can match hulk in nearly every one of thier encounters physically. could you provide me with any information to prove otherwise???
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I'm not denying it was impressive but Juggernaut was only de-powered. What's to say he wasn't powered up extra and only came down to normal strength? Either way Juggernaut is by no means a slouch and I think he could take Thing de-powered or not. My point is that Hulk and Juggernaut both beat Rhino in the end.
its obvious the imposternaut is in a de-powered state. he himself has said many times....not to mention other people stating this. back to beginning, thing at optimal level vs. juggernaut at optimal level = thing getting slaughtered (feat hulk has never accomplished so easily). juggernaut defeated rhino, in a de-powered state. i dunno if you are getting confused about that or not, so i cleared it up again.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yeah but hardly anyone can withstand the odinforce Thor. Thor can hold his own but he can't beat Hulk.
juggernaut has withstood it, and thor gave juggernaut his all in thier most rescent encounter. blows that were making the ground itself crack and quake. was he hitting hulk that hard trying to put him down??? thor has a much tougher time with juggernaut than he has with hulk.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Then why is it ok for you to assume there was no fight?
we all make our own conclusion. i cant offer you anything more than that. onslaught is a psion, juggernaut has every right to be beaten by one. but that by no means, means that it makes hulk any more powerful.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Didn't need to go to the trouble. People don't want to see Hulk making Thor fear for his life, that's the point. There's so much more to this than Juggernaut/Hulk. It's about writing. People wanna see a badass villain threatening their favourite hero so then it's all the sweeter when Good triumphs. Which I dare say is the only reason Juggernaut does as well as he does against Hulk, one of anyway.
so exactly what are you trying to say??? it still happened in continuity, juggernaut is more than capable of defeating hulk. they are in the same league, and they are rivals in strength. i dont see what you dont get about this.....
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You're too kind but I'm an able fingered person, I can type.
i'm glad for you........
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Thor may not have referred to him as undefeatable. I don't even do that. Others in the Marvel universe have though. But if that's your argument then neither Juggernaut or Hulk are undefeatable. Pointless.
but thor has refered to juggernaut that way. surely he must think he is more powerful than hulk then. he questions his own life, and refers to Juggernaut as undefeatable, 2 things that he hasnt done against hulk... hmmm
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I'm not trying to discredit you, you've done that to yourself multiple times. All I do is give information. I've rarely gone solely on opinion in this thread. If you don't like what I say then don't reply. I'll reply to whatever I wish. Either way this thread is near enough dead. You clearly wont budge, neither will I. So I agree to disagree. I applaud you for holding this debate on your own near enough and I've enjoyed it but after almost 34 pages, it's getting tedious for multiple reasons.
well, just because juggernaut is in my name, doesnt mean that the information i present is in-valid, as you have mentioned on occasion. i still dont see any information that you have provided. atleast as of late. i dont care to go back and read this thread from the beginning, that would take up too much time. if you are done, i'm done also..... guess we will just have to wait for another person to revive this thread. nice debating with you, have a nice day.
As long as you keep replying with replyable things aimed at me, I will reply. Coz I can.
"there is no reason to think that juggernaut -cant- perform feats in question if he can match hulk in nearly every one of thier encounters physically. could you provide me with any information to prove otherwise???"
Yeah, the fact that Hulk is actually way stronger than Juggernaut. He may be equal at regular level with regular Juggernaut, but he can become much stronger. Hence him doing things Juggernaut couldn't.
"back to beginning, thing at optimal level vs. juggernaut at optimal level = thing getting slaughtered (feat hulk has never accomplished so easily). juggernaut defeated rhino, in a de-powered state. i dunno if you are getting confused about that or not, so i cleared it up again."
The Juggernaut/Hulk Vs Rhino fight we've been over. Seeing as you can assume things about Juggernaut, I shall assume that on every encounter Hulk is capable of killing Rhino. He is. That's an actual fact. So the victory is sort of here nor there. As for Hulk Vs Thing, it's obvious why they last longer than Hero/Villain fights. Hero/Hero fight is one fo the main ones.
"juggernaut has withstood it, and thor gave juggernaut his all in thier most rescent encounter. blows that were making the ground itself crack and quake. was he hitting hulk that hard trying to put him down??? thor has a much tougher time with juggernaut than he has with hulk. "
Juggernaut withstanding Odinforce Thor is piss poor writing. It would be if it was Hulk, it would be if it was anyone. Stupidness really. Yes he was hitting Hulk that hard when he was trying to put him down.
"we all make our own conclusion. i cant offer you anything more than that. onslaught is a psion, juggernaut has every right to be beaten by one. but that by no means, means that it makes hulk any more powerful."
I'm just saying Hulk beat Onslaught quickly. Juggernaut couldn't. Just like you bring up the Thing debate. This is the same.
"so exactly what are you trying to say??? it still happened in continuity, juggernaut is more than capable of defeating hulk. they are in the same league, and they are rivals in strength. i dont see what you dont get about this....."
I just don't get how you see that in the long run, Juggernaut would push the Hulk over. Which has been your view before. But that is besides the point.
"but thor has refered to juggernaut that way. surely he must think he is more powerful than hulk then. he questions his own life, and refers to Juggernaut as undefeatable, 2 things that he hasnt done against hulk... hmmm"
Hmmm? Hmmm what? Juggernaut has been beaten. So has Hulk. They're both beatable. Juggernaut's gimmick is that he's unstoppable and undefeatable. Hulk's gimmick has never been so, just that he's the strongest there is. They've both been beaten though.
"well, just because juggernaut is in my name, doesnt mean that the information i present is in-valid, as you have mentioned on occasion. i still dont see any information that you have provided. atleast as of late. i dont care to go back and read this thread from the beginning, that would take up too much time. if you are done, i'm done also..... guess we will just have to wait for another person to revive this thread. nice debating with you, have a nice day."
It's just a bit hard to believe you will debate equally when your name is Juggernaut Fan. But yes, I'm done. As long as you reply with stuff to say that's new, good. Thriving debate. If it's just gonna be replies to my words that I've already seen that will result in replies to yours that you've already seen, I shall agree to disagree.
-AC
ugh, i wish they wouyld stop bringing up the Jugs vs Thing fight....first off secret wars II was perhaps the worst title ever, crap story, and crap writing, all around piece of ****....next the Juggernaut had an advantage since the Thing was under the impression that he was fighting him at 100x his normal power, however mephisto removed the increase just as they began to fight...if Thing fought him knowing he was in for a close fight the outcome wouldnt be the same...anyone knows that if they go into a fight overconfidently they r in trouble....and as for anyone knocking out one of the toughest guys in marvel with a couple punches is rediculous..the Thing has gone toe to toe with the Champion of the universe who is far stronger and refused to quit after an extended battle
Originally posted by Wynndar
ugh, i wish they wouyld stop bringing up the Jugs vs Thing fight....first off secret wars II was perhaps the worst title ever, crap story, and crap writing, all around piece of ****....next the Juggernaut had an advantage since the Thing was under the impression that he was fighting him at 100x his normal power, however mephisto removed the increase just as they began to fight...if Thing fought him knowing he was in for a close fight the outcome wouldnt be the same...anyone knows that if they go into a fight overconfidently they r in trouble....and as for anyone knocking out one of the toughest guys in marvel with a couple punches is rediculous..the Thing has gone toe to toe with the Champion of the universe who is far stronger and refused to quit after an extended battle
but the fact still remains that juggernaut overtook thing with those three blows. that must make a pretty big statement for juggernauts strength. also, it was a sporting match with rules that champion was using. champion -could- have wrecked thing in a physical brawl.......
"but the fact still remains that juggernaut overtook thing with those three blows. that must make a pretty big statement for juggernauts strength. also, it was a sporting match with rules that champion was using. champion -could- have wrecked thing in a physical brawl......."
You use Juggernaut's fight in Secret Wars 2 yet if I use the mountain in Secret Wars 1 everyone moans.
No Snakehead, he isn't invincible.
-AC