Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
That is what we call "chance". You're not really working for something if the outcome is completely out of your control and all you can do is sit there and hope to not die.
He chose to go through a life-threatening temporary death in order to gain power. Whether or not it worked involved some chance, but it was something he decided to do.
Originally posted by Q99And was handed to him without any training whatsoever. He had a 50/50 chance to die or get more power by doing nothing at all.
He chose to go through a life-threatening temporary death in order to gain power. Whether or not it worked involved some chance, but it was something he decided to do.
Originally posted by killermoverAnd what would be better? Having to train to get a new move or ability, (albeit Naruto does train in a cheap way) or being able to just suddenly get a new ability every time you are about to loose a fight that makes you win?
Sasuke's sharingan only progresses by dangerous situations and total blooslust. It's unfair to say Naruto is a hard at working than Sasuke when Sasuke has to be in danger constantly and fight for his life just to level up.
It's kinda funny how that's traditionally the 'near death' is the kind of upgrade the hero gets... and how outwardly stoic is the one driven by emotional extremes while Naruto gets more calm and measured.
It is a price that Sasuke pays, mind you. It's not training but he gives up things to gain his power, the full cursed seal and the mangekyo weren't just handed to him, they involved sacrifice.
And he has done a fair amount of training too. The chidori, training up his copy of Lee's speed, the alternate chidoris and Kirin, and he learns to practice to control his special granted abilities, extending their abilities and learning to do stuff like shape amaterasu.
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Bah. This debate's pointless.They both gain powers through cheap methods, and while Sasuke's methods are usually cheaper, Naruto's most recent power-up was the cheapest.
Savvy?
Though while Naruto's latest upgrade is cheapest from his PoV, it was expensive in the sense that his parents paid great cost to make sure Kushina could handle much of the task for him.
Originally posted by Q99It is a price that Sasuke pays, mind you. It's not training but he gives up things to gain his power, the full cursed seal and the mangekyo weren't just handed to him, they involved sacrifice.
And he has done a fair amount of training too. The chidori, training up his copy of Lee's speed, the alternate chidoris and Kirin, and he learns to practice to control his special granted abilities, extending their abilities and learning to do stuff like shape amaterasu.
Pretty much this.
He gained some power-ups and abilities, but he didn't gain mastery. Without proper mastery & training, it's not very useful, and in some cases, is actually detrimental.
It's like Naruto gaining a sword that could one-shot the Juubi, only for us to find out that Naruto does not even know how to wield a sword. 😐
As for his training, that's all he's did with Orochimaru. Kirin, Chidori techs, Taijutsu & Kendo, his extreme speed, & that ossum fire technique.
~ Though to be fair, shaping Amaterasu seemed to come to him naturally
Originally posted by Q99
Though while Naruto's latest upgrade is cheapest from his PoV, it was expensive in the sense that his parents paid great cost to make sure Kushina could handle much of the task for him.
I view that expense as part of the whole 'I got the Fox sealed inside me' bit.
And while it did come at a price, it was one that he played no part in.
Originally posted by NemeBro
So it did not require much effort from Naruto at all then?Good to know.
It did require effort from Naruto- prepping by beating Dark Naruto, and sage-pounding Kyuubi. But the presence of Kushina made it much more successful than it likely would've been.
It's clear that in Naruto, other people can pay the price for someone's power.
Originally posted by Q99He could have gotten to the Kyuubi, sat down, and started masturbating, and mommy would have come to save him.
It did require effort from Naruto- prepping by beating Dark Naruto, and sage-pounding Kyuubi. But the presence of Kushina made it much more successful than it likely would've been.It's clear that in Naruto, other people can pay the price for someone's power.
Without Kushina, he would be dead. Or controlled by the Kyuubi. Whatever.
Originally posted by King KandyWell Naruto did have to fight Kyuubi to try and control it. Course, then Kushina came, and all that but....He did have to fight some for it. Then get random Sage power up that made no sense.
And you don't see this as being somewhat similar to the Kyuubi upgrade Naruto got recently?
Originally posted by Kento
Well Naruto did have to fight Kyuubi to try and control it. Course, then Kushina came, and all that but....He did have to fight some for it. Then get random Sage power up that made no sense.