The Official Naruto series Thread

If it wasn't for Naruto, who Kabuto took pretty impressive measures against (Nagato + Itachi. And with no knowledge that Itachi had put Shisui's jutsu into Naruto, that seemed like a good call), he would've won this battle, so I hardly call that being a moron.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I don't get why Muu didn't just blow up the sealed body, then let it reform.

Maybe Dust is too total and'd kill even a zombie. Maybe his chakra is too low after being split in half, Onoki ran out of chakra for dust techniques and he didn't split into two.

Yeah, Kabuto is dropping the ball.

Muu probably can't use the Nuke attack in this mode.

In regards to the war, I guess Naruto is helping a bit. Though Naruto really isn't changing much. He is doing exactly what Madara planned he'd do.

So it's actually a bad thing.

Originally posted by Q99
Maybe Dust is too total and'd kill even a zombie. Maybe his chakra is too low after being split in half, Onoki ran out of chakra for dust techniques and he didn't split into two.

Onoki's very old though. A 60 year old man was nothing when compared to himself at his prime. Onoki's doing pretty well at 83, back problems aside, but I doubt he's at his Prime.

That said, how would Edo Zombies have chakra limits in the first place? What'll happen if they run out of chakra?

They'd rest I assume.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Onoki's very old though. A 60 year old man was nothing when compared to himself at his prime. Onoki's doing pretty well at 83, back problems aside, but I doubt he's at his Prime.

Yea, but even with decreased chakra from age, they spent equivalent amounts and *then* Muu's got cut in half.

That said, how would Edo Zombies have chakra limits in the first place? What'll happen if they run out of chakra?

I'd assume they'd just have to recover at a normal rate, with the life that was used to animate them doing that.

Nothing about how they're fighting suggest they've got endless chakra; they've been using the odd big technique, but not spamming them. And Mizukage got tired from using his exploding-clone.

So of the Kage, is Mu the strongest or no? We know Mizukage is the most versatile of the group but not the strongest probably. Raikage is the most manly obviously. And Gaara's dad....the most....golden?

Though going from what the manga is implying, Mizukage=Mu.

Originally posted by Q99
You pretty much got it. It's not exactly a clone, just two 'main' half-strength bodies. Since one is sealed, he is significantly reduced.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
That said, how would Edo Zombies have chakra limits in the first place? What'll happen if they run out of chakra?

For me, it doesn't make sense that the body will only be able to recover 50% of its chakra...since it is ET'd.

But I guess the bodies have an absolute limit which was set at or around their death. Meaning, they have the same leves as before they died.

I guess they still recover chakra at the same rates as being alive and they can't recover beyond their "storage limit" from when they were alive??????

It makes sense if you consider that the "natural" recovery rates apply to both clay bodies and organic bodies. But it doesn't make sense to us real life people because we know our "stamina" doesn't come from chakra networks: it comes from glucose/glygogen stores and mitochondria.

Originally posted by Q99
If it wasn't for Naruto, who Kabuto took pretty impressive measures against (Nagato + Itachi. And with no knowledge that Itachi had put Shisui's jutsu into Naruto, that seemed like a good call), he would've won this battle, so I hardly call that being a moron.

See, that makes sense.

Kabuto isn't stupid. Nagato, alone, was enough for uber-Naruto. In most ways, he was BETTER than the original paths version Nagato used (on panel quote from Naruto).

So Nagato really did trump Naruto there. It was just Itachi being such a rediculous friggin' genius that he trumped Kabuto's plan.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
In regards to the war, I guess Naruto is helping a bit. Though Naruto really isn't changing much. He is doing exactly what Madara planned he'd do.

So it's actually a bad thing.

Which kind of irritates me. Right now, it seems "*sspulled" on Kubo's part to have Madara "planning" for Naruto ruining his entire war plan.

It COULD be that he is wearing Naruto down so he is more easily taken out??? That seems plausible because we actually saw that.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Kabuto isn't stupid.

So Nagato really did trump Naruto there. It was just Itachi being such a rediculous friggin' genius that he trumped Kabuto's plan.

Disagree. Mostly in regards to how he completely forgot about Itachi, enabling the latter to pwn his plans. And he will probably be the one to stop Edo Tensei.

Actually it wasn't even Itachi's genius. It was essentially pure dumb luck.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Which kind of irritates me. Right now, it seems "*sspulled" on Kubo's part to have Madara "planning" for Naruto ruining his entire war plan.

It COULD be that he is wearing Naruto down so he is more easily taken out??? That seems plausible because we actually saw that.

Actually that makes perfect sense. Madara is playing a Xanatos Gambit. A pretty decent one at that.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
So of the Kage, is Mu the strongest or no? We know Mizukage is the most versatile of the group but not the strongest probably. Raikage is the most manly obviously. And Gaara's dad....the most....golden?

Though going from what the manga is implying, Mizukage=Mu.

I think he is. Probably the strongest Kage ever, aside from Hashirama of course. 131

Against each other. Otherwise, I'd put Muu above Mizukage.

Originally posted by Q99
Yea, but even with decreased chakra from age, they spent equivalent amounts and *then* Muu's got cut in half.

I'd assume they'd just have to recover at a normal rate, with the life that was used to animate them doing that.

Nothing about how they're fighting suggest they've got endless chakra; they've been using the odd big technique, but not spamming them. And Mizukage got tired from using his exploding-clone.

Old age can be quite detrimental to chakra levels. Hiruzen is testament to this. Also, the lower your chakra is, the lower the impact halving your chakra has on your chakra levels.

So would they have their usual chakra levels, or would something else determine how much chakra they have?

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
I think he is. Probably the strongest Kage ever, aside from Hashirama of course. 131

Against each other. Otherwise, I'd put Muu above Mizukage.

So would they have their usual chakra levels, or would something else determine how much chakra they have?

Well, he had the Bijuu controlling ability. Without that, I could see Minato giving him a run for his money.

Then again, I don't think Naruto is based around power. Mostly match ups. 3rd Raikage for example would probably be a tough opponent for Hashirama based on fighting style.

Usual. Though I do think if they're being controlled as tightly, like the Hokage were, they'd be weaker.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
So of the Kage, is Mu the strongest or no? We know Mizukage is the most versatile of the group but not the strongest probably. Raikage is the most manly obviously. And Gaara's dad....the most....golden?

Though going from what the manga is implying, Mizukage=Mu.

As far as the chakra debate, I was under the impression that edo tensei beings never tire.

Lol just realized something.

Gaara's dad is probably the weakest of the Kage there. He the 4th Kazekage.

3rd Raikage is probably the 3rd Strongest.

Mu and Mizukage are probably tied and both are the 2 Kage of their respective villages.

4
3
2

Clearly Kabuto is planning to bring a new Kage to the field. A 1st Kage.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Disagree. Mostly in regards to how he completely forgot about Itachi, enabling the latter to pwn his plans. And he will probably be the one to stop Edo Tensei.

Actually it wasn't even Itachi's genius. It was essentially pure dumb luck.

I disagree: He didn't forget about Itachi: he didn't know the "timer" would be reduced or something on the eye.

He may not have even known that the genjutsu could override his control.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Actually that makes perfect sense. Madara is playing a Xanatos Gambit. A pretty decent one at that.

It could be...

But, the horrible problem with that is: Naruto frees up the shinobi alliance and instead he is now fighting a massive amount of A and S class ninja all at once. 😐

That's a stupid idea, imo.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Lol just realized something.

Gaara's dad is probably the weakest of the Kage there. He the 4th Kazekage.

3rd Raikage is probably the 3rd Strongest.

Mu and Mizukage are probably tied and both are the 2 Kage of their respective villages.

4
3
2

Clearly Kabuto is planning to bring a new Kage to the field. A 1st Kage.

Interesting point.

I think it's going to be..........THE SAGEEEEEEE!! dun dun dun

Originally posted by dadudemon
I disagree: He didn't forget about Itachi: he didn't know the "timer" would be reduced or something on the eye.

He may not have even known that the genjutsu could override his control.

Timer?

But he did. It just happened and he acknowledged that it happened.

Originally posted by dadudemon
It could be...

But, the horrible problem with that is: Naruto frees up the shinobi alliance and instead he is now fighting a massive amount of A and S class ninja all at once. 😐

That's a stupid idea, imo.

The SA have never actually been a problem. He just needed to stir up conflict so they'd have no choice but to send Naruto into the open. Now Madara simply has to find him and Bee and catch them. Nothing the SA has can stop his statue.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Interesting point.

I think it's going to be..........THE SAGEEEEEEE!! dun dun dun

Well, he was a 1st I guess.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Timer?

But he did. It just happened and he acknowledged that it happened.

10 years is the cool down. I thought we determined that the timer had not yet expired but the "first's" cells sped it up: something he didn't know it would happen until after the fact.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
The SA have never actually been a problem. He just needed to stir up conflict so they'd have no choice but to send Naruto into the open. Now Madara simply has to find him and Bee and catch them. Nothing the SA has can stop his statue.

They have been a problem.

I don't think Madara can handle 4 S-Class ninja at once. Much less some of the upper tier ones.

Especially since they know so much about him, now.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Well, he was a 1st I guess.

We should make a bet on this:

If I'm right (meaning, it's the Great Sage, not a first kage), then you must admit that Konan is S-Class with prep.

If you're right, I'll admit that her non-prep feats are also S-Class.

Deal?

😄

Originally posted by King Kandy

As far as the chakra debate, I was under the impression that edo tensei beings never tire.

I was under this impression too. Wouldn't make sense for undead beings to have stamina levels.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Lol just realized something.

Gaara's dad is probably the weakest of the Kage there. He the 4th Kazekage.

3rd Raikage is probably the 3rd Strongest.

Mu and Mizukage are probably tied and both are the 2 Kage of their respective villages.

4
3
2

Clearly Kabuto is planning to bring a new Kage to the field. A 1st Kage.

There's another pattern.
He had the 4th Kazekage, the 3rd Raikage, the 2nd Tsuchikage & Mizukage, so obviously, the Kage he'll now summon is the 1st Hokage. vin

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Well, he had the Bijuu controlling ability. Without that, I could see Minato giving him a run for his money.

Then again, I don't think Naruto is based around power. Mostly match ups. 3rd Raikage for example would probably be a tough opponent for Hashirama based on fighting style.

Usual. Though I do think if they're being controlled as tightly, like the Hokage were, they'd be weaker.

Well yeah. Hashirama w. Bijuu = Muu.
Prime H.Sarutobi would give him a run for his money too. I think Prime Sarutobi was > Hashirama w/o Bijuu.

I think it's a combination of both in most cases. You'd need at least a decent amount of power & skill to stay alive in a fight with someone, and the rock-paper-scissors effect would equalize the gap, or give you the edge. Mu vs. Mizukage is an obvious example. Mizukage doesn't display the same level of power (but has enough of it that he's easily Kage level), so he needs his advantages to combat Muu.

Agreed on the second point. The Hokage didn't even use a lot of jutsu against Hiruzen.

Originally posted by dadudemon

We should make a bet on this:

If I'm right (meaning, it's the Great Sage, not a first kage), then you must admit that Konan is S-Class with prep.

If you're right, I'll admit that her non-prep feats are also S-Class.

Deal?

😄

If neither are you correct, then you both admit that you are douches for settling feuds over Kishimoto's writing. An angel and a demon making a deal...BS uhuh

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
If neither are you correct, then you both admit that you are douches for settling feuds over Kishimoto's writing. An angel and a demon making a deal...BS uhuh

My name is pronounced "duh dewd mon"

Not "da dew demon".

It's the phonetic spelling of how a Jamiancan would say "TheDudeMan", which was my original internet screen name back in the late 90s.

How dare you.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
There's another pattern.
He had the 4th Kazekage, the 3rd Raikage, the 2nd Tsuchikage & Mizukage, so obviously, the Kage he'll now summon is the 1st Hokage. vin

I thought of that but Kabuto said that it's impossible to summon him. Granted he may have been lying and he figured out a way around the whole Death God thing.

If it is Hashirama, we know that what Mu is summoning is not the same coffin used to scare Madara.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Well yeah. Hashirama w. Bijuu = Muu.
Prime H.Sarutobi would give him a run for his money too. I think Prime Sarutobi was > Hashirama w/o Bijuu.

I think it's a combination of both in most cases. You'd need at least a decent amount of power & skill to stay alive in a fight with someone, and the rock-paper-scissors effect would equalize the gap, or give you the edge. Mu vs. Mizukage is an obvious example. Mizukage doesn't display the same level of power (but has enough of it that he's easily Kage level), so he needs his advantages to combat Muu.

Agreed on the second point. The Hokage didn't even use a lot of jutsu against Hiruzen.

I dunno about equal. I might give Hashirama the edge in that fight.
Well we haven't seen much of him to determine this. Going by his old age though, it's not a bad theory.

Of course. All ninja are supposed to be competent but sometimes a bad match up is just a bad match up. Like Kakashi vs Deidera. One is long distance the other isn't. Sasuke evened it out more by having longer ranged attacks. 😛

I know. Laem. Then again, very doubtful all this Madara stuff was decided at that point. Wasn't until the Sasuke Retrieval arc that Kishi started thinking about Madara probably.

Originally posted by dadudemon
10 years is the cool down. I thought we determined that the timer had not yet expired but the "first's" cells sped it up: something he didn't know it would happen until after the fact.

They have been a problem.

I don't think Madara can handle 4 S-Class ninja at once. Much less some of the upper tier ones.

Especially since they know so much about him, now.

We should make a bet on this:

If I'm right (meaning, it's the Great Sage, not a first kage), then you must admit that Konan is S-Class with prep.

If you're right, I'll admit that her non-prep feats are also S-Class.

Deal?

😄

Well I know that. I just don't think he was really considering it. Bee and Naruto were the main targets.

He has taken on 2 S Class ninja and wiped the floor with them. The Kage probably would not make a difference to that statue. Though I'd imagine Gaara would get annoying. A too.

Not big on gambling.

Current Madara would destroy S-class ninja. Pain beat multiple S class on his own, that + sharingan genjutsu + space/time + izanagi + a main body that isn't sick, he will trounce almost any combination of ninja.