why are you an atheist?

Originally posted by Ytaker
Two points- pedophiles are regarded as outcasts, evil people. It doesn't matter where they come from. They are crazy, and thus their beliefs are off track.

You live in a Christian law based country. In africa, they have a lovely idea that female circumsition is an excellent act for their immortal soul. I prefer our law basis

So remember, you have a christian mind set if you live in America or Europe.

These "crazy predophiles" were quite abundant as priests of Catholosism. Something tells me that they all weren't just wacked out. The fact that there were so many of them within one strucural religion shows me that it wasn't just a few wackos doing it. These priest pedophiles were STILL ALLOWED to be priests, they just moved them. Something is wrong there, very wrong. The poing of all this is that if their religion that they believed so strongly in influenced their moral then they would NOT have had sex with little boys.

A Christian law based country that is also civilized. Your comparison to Africa is unfounded because it is not as civilized our country. A civilized countries beliefs would still have the same morals as we do now, with or without Christian influence. I also think that murder is illegal in Africa, this is a global belief that is not associated with religion, as are all the major moral beliefs of this world.

With or without religion or Christianity, murder, rape, and stealing would still be wrong and immoral.

Originally posted by Cipher
A privilege?! Interesting......

I don't feel that anyone has the right to revoke my "privilege" as you call it.

I just pointed out the hypocrisy of saying killing is wrong and then turning around and killing people.....

1. I agree

2. Nope. Only you can do that.

3. As I said, sometimes you kill to protect. I did a piece on a just war. The recent gulf war was better than most at least. It isn't a hostile take over, and leaves Iraq better than before. Minimalist killings. At the very least, if it is unjust, it is more just than the prior situation.

A person's mindset is Christian if they choose to think that way. But the beauty of free will is that we can think for ourselves, not be stuck with outdate stories....

Originally posted by BackFire
These "crazy predophiles" were quite abundant as priests of Catholosism. Something tells me that they all weren't just wacked out. The fact that there were so many of them within one strucural religion shows me that it wasn't just a few wackos doing it. These priest pedophiles were STILL ALLOWED to be priests, they just moved them. Something is wrong there, very wrong. The poing of all this is that if their religion that they believed so strongly in influenced their moral then they would NOT have had sex with little boys.

A Christian law based country that is also civilized. Your comparison to Africa is unfounded because it is not as civilized our country. A civilized countries beliefs would still have the same morals as we do now, with or without Christian influence. I also think that murder is illegal in Africa, this is a global belief that is not associated with religion, as are all the major moral beliefs of this world.

With or without religion or Christianity, murder, rape, and stealing would still be wrong and immoral.

1. I do not doubt that there are abundant paedophiles outside. Catholic ones get headlines though. Fortunately, I’m protestant though.

2. Not always. Christianity gets immense bad press in the middle ages and all through that time, but they helped a lot as well. There was one amusing situation where mistranslations lead to Jesus being a leper, resulting in it being a position to revere, not scorn. Look up "the dissolution of the monasteries" to see what happens when they stop.

3. Most of the time. Make sure you judge nations by the time they had to reform, not their state of reformation. A cult that for 4000 years believes in human sacrifice is naturally barbaric.

Originally posted by Cipher
A person's mindset is Christian if they choose to think that way. But the beauty of free will is that we can think for ourselves, not be stuck with outdate stories....

Or outdated genetics? It's gonna be there till the kingdom comes; we are affected by our landscape. Chrsistianity often helps to overcome that. But you cannot break a thousand year old tradition.

E.G. you need professional help, if you really want to seperate your morals from christian morals.

"I do not doubt that there are abundant paedophiles outside. Catholic ones get headlines though. Fortunately, I’m protestant though."

The reason they got headlines was because there was such a large number of them all within one religious sect. I never said pedophiles were not outside of the church. The point was that these people supposedly believed in EVERYTHING catholicism preached, morals, ethics, ideas, ect. Had this been the case, their morals would not have been so out of wack that they would have seen that it is simply wrong to have sex with little boys.

"Not always. Christianity gets immense bad press in the middle ages and all through that time, but they helped a lot as well. There was one amusing situation where mistranslations lead to Jesus being a leper, resulting in it being a position to revere them, not scorn. Look up "the dissolution of the monasteries" to see what happens when they stop."

I don't see how this is at all relevent to the discussion at had of whether or not religion is the basis for all morals in the current world. People in the past had different morals and beliefs, as society changes, so does their morals.

"Most of the time. Make sure you judge nations by the time they had to reform, not their state of reformation. A cult that for 4000 years believes in human sacrifice is naturally barbaric."

Of course it would be barbaric.

Originally posted by BackFire
"I do not doubt that there are abundant paedophiles outside. Catholic ones get headlines though. Fortunately, I’m protestant though."

The reason they got headlines was because there was such a large number of them all within one religious sect. I never said pedophiles were not outside of the church. The point was that these people supposedly believed in EVERYTHING catholicism preached, morals, ethics, ideas, ect. Had this been the case, their morals would not have been so out of wack that they would have seen that it is simply wrong to have sex with little boys.

"Not always. Christianity gets immense bad press in the middle ages and all through that time, but they helped a lot as well. There was one amusing situation where mistranslations lead to Jesus being a leper, resulting in it being a position to revere them, not scorn. Look up "the dissolution of the monasteries" to see what happens when they stop."

I don't see how this is at all relevent to the discussion at had of whether or not religion is the basis for all morals in the current world. People in the past had different morals and beliefs, as society changes, so does their morals.

"Most of the time. Make sure you judge nations by the time they had to reform, not their state of reformation. A cult that for 4000 years believes in human sacrifice is naturally barbaric."

Of course it would be barbaric.

1. They're crazy though. Logical thinking is harder when you're crazy. Our morals despise anyone who breaks the faith of a child; you would be better to commit suicide (or to be more exact, tie a rock to your neck and jump off a cliff).

2. I thought you might talk about then. Many people do.

3. That's the point; if the Africans have had just as long to evolve, and haven't, then they are barbaric.

Having similar ethical ideas as an organized religion does not mean a person needs professional help. Genetics? Don't see the connection between genetics and thoughts as far as this discussion is concerned....

Having a Christian mindset, to me, means believing the outlandish stories are true. Since I don't, I can have seperate ethics because I do.

"They're crazy though. Logical thinking is harder when you're crazy. Our morals despise anyone who breaks the faith of a child; you would be better to commit suicide (or to be more exact, tie a rock to your neck and jump off)."

I don't think they really were "crazy". They were logical enough to try and hide their actions, and tell kids not to rat them out. They knew it was wrong, yet they still commenced with it and TRIED to hide it. Had they done it on a wimb every time and not bothered to try to disuade the kids from telling, then I would agree that they were wacked out loons. But the fact that they seemed to premeditate their actions and think them out kinda proves to me that they were sane enough to know it was wrong. I will agree with your last statement, it would be better for everyone if they would just commit suicide, but that of course is "immoral" in their world, since the bible directly says so. Since the bible never really SAID that screwing kids is bad, they think it's okay.

"That's the point; if the Africans have had just as long to evolve, and haven't, then they are barbaric."

Maybe so, but I believe murder is still illegal there, no?

Wow, this is WAAAY off track now. What do you mean, breaking the faith of a child? If your talking pedophiles, why does the Catholic church reassign them rather than excommunicate them?

Originally posted by BackFire
"They're crazy though. Logical thinking is harder when you're crazy. Our morals despise anyone who breaks the faith of a child; you would be better to commit suicide (or to be more exact, tie a rock to your neck and jump off)."

I don't think they really were "crazy". They were logical enough to try and hide their actions, and tell kids not to rat them out. They knew it was wrong, yet they still commenced with it and TRIED to hide it. Had they done it on a wimb every time and not bothered to try to disuade the kids from telling, then I would agree that they were wacked out loons. But the fact that they seemed to premeditate their actions and think them out kinda proves to me that they were sane enough to know it was wrong. I will agree with your last statement, it would be better for everyone if they would just commit suicide, but that of course is "immoral" in their world, since the bible directly says so. Since the bible never really SAID that screwing kids is bad, they think it's okay.

"That's the point; if the Africans have had just as long to evolve, and haven't, then they are barbaric."

Maybe so, but I believe murder is still illegal there, no?

1. If you want to screw woman, or men you are sane. If you want to screw men, and women you are unbalanced. If you cannot control your lust, you are insane. If I have a desire for a child in bed, I suppress it. If you have no superego (e.g. a conscience), you are insane. The bible says that the unforgivable sin is better than screwing kids. Suicide isn't good, but it's better than paedophilia. Understand it all?
2. They still believe in female circumcision, the worst possible breach of privacy.

Originally posted by Cipher
Wow, this is WAAAY off track now. What do you mean, breaking the faith of a child? If your talking pedophiles, why does the Catholic church reassign them rather than excommunicate them?

They do? I didn't know that. They shouldn't, as it would be against the law, and reminisent of Jehovah's Witness'.

That's been known for a while now. The church protects them. Illegal? Maybe, but they're getting away with it.....

Originally posted by Ytaker
They still believe in female circumcision, the worst possible breach of privacy.

I've never seen that it was worse than male circumcision.

It's been known? (looks condencensing at Cipher); And I suppose it's been known for a long time that Elvis lives?

"If you want to screw woman, or men you are sane. If you want to screw men, and women you are unbalanced. If you cannot control your lust, you are insane. If I have a desire for a child in bed, I suppress it. If you have no superego (e.g. a conscience), you are insane. The bible says that the unforgivable sin is better than screwing kids. Suicide isn't good, but it's better than paedophilia. Understand it all?"

So, basically you are saying they are insane because they didn't have the will power to control their urges? I see where you're coming from, but I still don't think an insane person would try to cover their tracks, a truley crazy person would do their act and be so wacky that they wouldn't even think about the consequences.

"They still believe in female circumcision, the worst possible breach of privacy."

Right, and what does this have to do with religion?

Originally posted by Gregory
I've never seen that it was worse than male circumcision.

It's like cutting of a man's sex organ. It stops all pleasure in sex; it is a breach of what woman consider their own.

Originally posted by BackFire
"If you want to screw woman, or men you are sane. If you want to screw men, and women you are unbalanced. If you cannot control your lust, you are insane. If I have a desire for a child in bed, I suppress it. If you have no superego (e.g. a conscience), you are insane. The bible says that the unforgivable sin is better than screwing kids. Suicide isn't good, but it's better than paedophilia. Understand it all?"

So, basically you are saying they are insane because they didn't have the will power to control their urges? I see where you're coming from, but I still don't think an insane person would try to cover their tracks, a truley crazy person would do their act and be so wacky that they wouldn't even think about the consequences.

"They still believe in female circumcision, the worst possible breach of privacy."

Right, and what does this have to do with religion?

1. Think how it would work. The boys aren't going to tell, as the bastard said that would send them to hell. Nobody will see in his privacy. It's not that hard.

2. We were talking about christian morals, and i gave you an example where it didn't happen. It has that to do with religon.

Originally posted by BackFire
So, basically you are saying they are insane because they didn't have the will power to control their urges? I see where you're coming from, but I still don't think an insane person would try to cover their tracks, a truley crazy person would do their act and be so wacky that they wouldn't even think about the consequences.

There are differenct kinds of crazy, aren't there? For example, many serial killers hid their tracks quite well, and they're usually not sanity's poster-children.

I stand corrected on the circumcision thing.