"Spidey is a horrible fighter. He punches like most people do, with just his arm...and with little effectiveness."
I'm just going to pretend that you didn't say Spiderman was a horrible fighter. He might not be an adept martial artist; but he didn't get to be the hero he is by shooting webbing and only taking good pictures of himself.
A punch from a guy with 10 tons of strength is a punch with a guy with 10 tons of strength. Calling it 20,000 pounds will probably be more effective. Seriously, if he connects, it's going to hurt.
he's not a horrible fighter...his techniqes are just not refined...and good technique makes a TON of difference....
"You can't make a statement without having any proof whatsoever."
wolverine vs. spiderman - spidey hits an already dying woman not even at peak human level and it takes some time for her to die....
daredevil annual-possessed spiderman punched DD through a wall with intent to kill...DD fights back.....
spectacular spiderman death of jean dewolf story arc- spidey with intent to kill, punches a guy repeatidly....he's still in one peice....
We have plenty of evidence....you guy are the one who CHOSE to ignore it!
okay now it's your turn.....it was said that bane matching batman means that batman hasn't mastered 127 different styles of combat though the exact oposite has been stated countless times.........where's your actual proof other than assuming bane isn't a very good fighter?...which is exactly what you're doing...he beat killer croc without venom..I mean common....
Originally posted by 8bitChris
"Spiderman has done nothing like this to the street level opponents he's faced even while trying to severely injure or kill."You can't make a statement without having any proof whatsoever.
Go threw this thread, there are many pictures of DD, Wolvie, Sin Eater (i beleive) and a few more taking full on punches from spidey, courtesy of jinzin and his almighty scanning ability. And if there' not here, there in Spidey vs. Batman, or spidey vs. someone else.
By the way jinzin, kudos on the bitching sig.
I wouldn't say terrible fighter.
He uses is Speed,Agility, Arial Ability and Wallcrawling to make a unique fighting style.
Superpowers like healing are passive, meaning its on at its potential, all of the time, and there is no way it can be triggered or forced harder, whatever that max is, is simply that max.
Super Strength is active, meaning it can be applied at different levels, and Spidey is one who is shown not having or using Super Strength many times and only using his head. One day he may use enough strength to simply put a human or their but or intimidate them, then pull it out wih the big boys, breaking buildings, lifting cars, breaking concrete, tearing iron like tissue paper.ETC. Spidey hits MUCH harder than a bullet, if a bullet to the head is usually fatal, especially after some time has passed, a punch from him to the head esp, after time has passed.
I do agree with you on technique though. In basic training, I was faced with guys who were larger and thought they could HIT HARDER. I did more damage however because I knew HOW TO HIT. Using principles of countering, leverage, body displacement , among other things, and you don't even need all of your strength to incapacitate or kill someone. Since spidey uses these principles, plus some more, and counters a lot with strategy, he is definitely a great fighter. He is not a slobber and puncher, or hit trader.
"Spiderman has done nothing like this to the street level opponents he's faced even while trying to severely injure or kill."
I think you misunderstood me jin.
Do you really want to say that after appearing in a thousand plus comics Spiderman has done "nothing" like this? The guy essentially said Spiderman "never" injured anyone. Am I the only one who got that?
And I would hardly compare DD and Wolverine to the "street" level opponents Batman has fought.
I didn't say bats couldn't fight it would be an interesting match indeed, but spidey can do this and is way stronger and faster.etc.etc.etc.
Cmon Merc, if it takes 3pounds of pressure pure square inch to break a bone, ANYONE ON THIS FORUM can break a bone, not just superheroes.
If spidey wasnt capable of breaking a bone when he broke concrete, then the editor simply didn't want him to do so.
When has spidey gone all out against HUMANS frequently anyway. Thats against his character.
"Batman has shown his capabilities, breaking bones at will when he's angry or feels someone needs to be taught a lesson or is just in a bad mood.
On the other hand Spidey has gone all out and he can't even break a simple human."
So you're implying that nomatte how hard Spiderman trys there is no way he could break human bones? Either rephrase what you said or get your Batman tattoo right now. There is an obvious bias here.
"We have plenty of evidence....you guy are the one who CHOSE to ignore it!"
It was funny when everyone "CHOSE" to ignore all the sense I was making earlier in this topic. Of course, it's a lot easier to ignore posts than refute them.
Hypocrisy? Please don't make me dig through the all the threads to prove my point.
Originally posted by jinzin
he's not a horrible fighter...his techniqes are just not refined...and good technique makes a TON of difference....
wolverine vs. spiderman - spidey hits an already dying woman not even at peak human level and it takes some time for her to die....Shed died still. If Spidey had splattered her head it would've looked real nasty and Wolverine wouldn't have had his dramatic last moments with her. Why'd she get Spidey to hit her in the 1st place? She wanted to die and knew getting punched by Spidey would kill her.
daredevil annual-possessed spiderman punched DD through a wall with intent to kill...DD fights back.....1st.It was never shown how he sent him threw the wall. 2nd Possessed Spidey was obviously not using any of his powers to the utmost. 3rd. How does this sound? "I'm tired of writing DD. Let's kill DD off by having Spidey splatter his head while possessed"
spectacular spiderman death of jean dewolf story arc- spidey with intent to kill, punches a guy repeatidly....he's still in one peice....It seems more like intent to hurt and then kill doesn't it?
Originally posted by 8bitChris
Do you really want to say that after appearing in a thousand plus comics Spiderman has done "nothing" like this? The guy essentially said Spiderman "never" injured anyone. Am I the only one who got that?
Don't be silly chap, everything is in context until you take it out of it's place. Comparitively speaking, as in compared to the things batman has done to his opponents such statement is true.
Originally posted by 8bitChris
And I would hardly compare DD and Wolverine to the "street" level opponents Batman has fought.
Why? 'Cause Bats fights tougher opponents?
Originally posted by CorderaMitchell
I didn't say bats couldn't fight it would be an interesting match indeed, but spidey can do this and is way stronger and faster.etc.etc.etc.Cmon Merc, if it takes 3pounds of pressure pure square inch to break a bone, ANYONE ON THIS FORUM can break a bone, not just superheroes.
Sure if you know exactly how, it's not like it just happens, have you ever lifted anything over 3 pounds? And if so, did your bones break when you did?
Originally posted by CorderaMitchell
If spidey wasnt capable of breaking a bone when he broke concrete, then the editor simply didn't want him to do so.
When has spidey gone all out against HUMANS frequently anyway. Thats against his character.
Frequently? Either you take alot of stuff back or I don't answer this question. When has Spidey frequently gone up against Fire Lord? When has he frequently gone up against Hulk? When has he frequently beat Wolverine or Dare Devil (on the other hand Wolvie has frequently taken it to Spidey.) So again, if you really want me to answer that question, just take all that stuff and them some back.
Originally posted by 8bitChris
So you're implying that nomatte how hard Spiderman trys there is no way he could break human bones? Either rephrase what you said or get your Batman tattoo right now. There is an obvious bias here.
Sure he COULD break human bones, he just hasn't. Maybe he doesn't know how, after all he only needs 3 pounds of pressure...
Originally posted by 8bitChris
It was funny when everyone "CHOSE" to ignore all the sense I was making earlier in this topic. Of course, it's a lot easier to ignore posts than refute them.Hypocrisy? Please don't make me dig through the all the threads to prove my point.
Nit picker, like everyone has time to respond to all your post plus the rantings of half a dozen others.
"Why? 'Cause Bats fights tougher opponents?"
I wouldn't say Bats fights tougher opponents all. WHen you say "street" level opponents, i'm assuming you mean all the "gangs" and "hired thugs" that a ton of the villains in Batman's rogue gallery usually emply. They are what I, and what should be, considered street level. Not super powered opponents like Wolverine and Daredevil.
"Sure he COULD break human bones, he just hasn't. Maybe he doesn't know how, after all he only needs 3 pounds of pressure..."
That's still not what you implied. I'm glad you corrected yourself because the previous statement was laughable.
"Frequently? Either you take alot of stuff back or I don't answer this question. When has Spidey frequently gone up against Fire Lord? When has he frequently gone up against Hulk? When has he frequently beat Wolverine or Dare Devil (on the other hand Wolvie has frequently taken it to Spidey.) So again, if you really want me to answer that question, just take all that stuff and them some back."
That poster was implying that Spiderman frequently combats super powered enemies.
"Nit picker, like everyone has time to respond to all your post plus the rantings of half a dozen others"
So are you calling jinzin a nit picker too? Honestly, I was one of the main debaters at the time. I'm trying to imply that everyone should reply to me just because I posted. I'm just saying that I was in the middle of the debate..I made some very valid points, and the people who were responding to me at the time just decided to ignore it and move on.
Originally posted by MERCILOUSOnly if you discount the fact that Sandman would very easliy suffocate almost all of Batman's defeated opponents or that Hydroman would very easily drown them. Even DStroke who I think is his most formidible opponent(Owns Batman for free) would most likely get owned by them or the crazy killing machine known as Carnage. Goblin would take out most of them too. I'm sure Jinzin will come up with some scan of Batman fighting God, but I ignore bad storytelling🙂
Why? 'Cause Bats fights tougher opponents?
Originally posted by StrawNillaYou don't think that a freak in a weird outfit with stuf stuffed into a belt thatr goes around throwing stuff at people has a better chance at existing in the real world that some guy who obtained superpowers from a spider bite?
But Batman DOES NOT EXIST. He doesn't exist technically, figuratively, or even kind of. And neither does Spidey.And real world physics applied to the abilities of both characters should make sense, though I doubt you would find it so seeing as you would either have to admit Spidey being Batman's superior in every physical area many times over, leave the thread, or continue your argument of Bats beating Spidey w/o prep time and risk being mocked and taunted.
Pfft, so much for your real world logic.
Comic book logic=/=real world logic.
Stop strawmaning guys, we're not saying that there is NO logic, we're saying comics have their OWN logic.