Different possessions. Different abilities. Different rules.
The rules of ONE possession can't be applied for all as there has been MANY different kinds of possessions with different kinds of results.
Obviously, with THIS possession, you need to consider the fact that Wolverine has manifested many different kinds of powers and that fights are. And that he was able to perform this feat during a time wherein he was able to manifest powers he would normally not have when he was unamped.
Any kind of amp invalidates this feat as a conclusive showing of Wolverine being able to pierce Colossus' skin. Doesn't matter that it WASN'T stated on-panel that he received some kind of strength amp. I mean, it can be argued that the fact he HAS pierced Colossus' skin suggests that he's had a strength amp. Characters don't have to go: "Oh my lord! This Wolverine is so much stronger while he's possessed!!" (w/c would sound silly and cliched in a comic book, tbh) for a strength amp to be proven, you know.
It does have to be when you're making a case for it on the forums though, because it's not just a comic anymore... it's evidence.
And it needs to be more conclussive.
Wolverine's already cut Collosus and there's plenty of evidence suggesting that he could, so that Wolverine cut Colossus here isn't evidence of a strength amp.
Not saying he doesn't have one, he very could, but unless it's stated or otherwise proven it's not something that can be assumed during a discussion on this particular matter.
Originally posted by jinzin
It does have to be when you're making a case for it on the forums though, because it's not just a comic anymore... it's evidence.And it needs to be more conclussive.
Wolverine's already cut Collosus and there's plenty of evidence suggesting that he could, so that Wolverine cut Colossus here isn't evidence of a strength amp.
Not saying he doesn't have one, he very could, but unless it's stated or otherwise proven it's not something that can be assumed during a discussion on this particular matter.
So what exactly is the case being made here? Pardon my late entry into the debate, but it seems that they're arguing that Wolverine can easily cut Colossus and use this showing as proof. Please correct me if I am wrong.
Also, if you have any instance that SHOWS that Wolverine can conclusively cut Colossus, then perhaps you should post it. I'd love to see it.
Originally posted by jinzin
It does have to be when you're making a case for it on the forums though, because it's not just a comic anymore... it's evidence.And it needs to be more conclussive.
Wolverine's already cut Collosus and there's plenty of evidence suggesting that he could, so that Wolverine cut Colossus here isn't evidence of a strength amp.
Not saying he doesn't have one, he very could, but unless it's stated or otherwise proven it's not something that can be assumed during a discussion on this particular matter.
True he's scoured him before, and it's been stated on panel and by both parties that Wolverine could cut him, but it's not just cutting him that indicates an amp. It was clear that Colossus chucked him pretty far. He wasn't even done talking when Logan flew back through the roof of a multi-story building. That's indicative of some type of amp to get back that fast. And smashing into Colossus hard enough to knock him through several levels from impact alone is also a sign of amp. Cuz a 300lb man falling on you isn't enough to knock you through several floors.
Originally posted by KingD19This sounds dangerously logical.
It was clear that Colossus chucked him pretty far. He wasn't even done talking when Logan flew back through the roof of a multi-story building. That's indicative of some type of amp to get back that fast. And smashing into Colossus hard enough to knock him through several levels from impact alone is also a sign of amp. Cuz a 300lb man falling on you isn't enough to knock you through several floors.
Knock it off.
Originally posted by D_Dude1210
So what exactly is the case being made here? Pardon my late entry into the debate, but it seems that they're arguing that Wolverine can easily cut Colossus and use this showing as proof. Please correct me if I am wrong.Also, if you have any instance that SHOWS that Wolverine can conclusively cut Colossus, then perhaps you should post it. I'd love to see it.
Wolverine cut Colossus with a panel discribing Colossus' metal skin as being no match for pure Adamantium.
I don't have the scan but it's floating around here somewhere.. It doesn't show Collosus get cut, it just describes him being scored.
I think the case being made is simply that Wolverine cut Collosus in that last fight... he did
And, that there's no proof of a strength upgrade as reason enough to dismiss it... there isn't.
Other than that I don't know why it's getting brought up right now although some overly defensive Collosus fans have brought it up head on in an attempt to immediately dismiss it I guess.
Originally posted by KingD19But a 300 pound man flying into you when you're both considerably made outa metal might be.
True he's scoured him before, and it's been stated on panel and by both parties that Wolverine could cut him, but it's not just cutting him that indicates an amp. It was clear that Colossus chucked him pretty far. He wasn't even done talking when Logan flew back through the roof of a multi-story building. That's indicative of some type of amp to get back that fast. And smashing into Colossus hard enough to knock him through several levels from impact alone is also a sign of amp. Cuz a 300lb man falling on you isn't enough to knock you through several floors.
I would concur that Wolverine flew back to the fight or used his TK in some way to jump through the roof... That just isn't an indication of a strength amp...
it's very ambiguous so far.. (what the **** happened with Angel?) which is why I beckon everyone to reserve their opinions on the matter until it's fleshed out further.... or not.
There are too many circumstances surrounding the feat, so anybody that wants to argue that it's valid shouldn't (until it's proven otherwise).
And anybody that wants to argue that it isn't valid should (until it's proven it is valid).
This is not equal footing.
That's the value of "circumstantial" evidence in the context of arguing evidence.
It's not reliable unless, and until, proven otherwise.
That's an opinion you're allowed to have now, at this moment. Shadowland Daredevil was the same exact thing. You don't have to wait.
Originally posted by KingD19
True he's scoured him before, and it's been stated on panel and by both parties that Wolverine could cut him, but it's not just cutting him that indicates an amp. It was clear that Colossus chucked him pretty far. He wasn't even done talking when Logan flew back through the roof of a multi-story building. That's indicative of some type of amp to get back that fast. And smashing into Colossus hard enough to knock him through several levels from impact alone is also a sign of amp. Cuz a 300lb man falling on you isn't enough to knock you through several floors.
He can teleport now, fyi.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Shadowland Daredevil was the same exact thing.
No, it wasn't. It was made crystal clear Matt got a strength upgrade.
Originally posted by jinzin
Wolverine cut Colossus with a panel discribing Colossus' metal skin as being no match for pure Adamantium.I don't have the scan but it's floating around here somewhere.. It doesn't show Collosus get cut, it just describes him being scored.
I think the case being made is simply that Wolverine cut Collosus in that last fight... he did
And, that there's no proof of a strength upgrade as reason enough to dismiss it... there isn't.Other than that I don't know why it's getting brought up right now although some overly defensive Collosus fans have brought it up head on in an attempt to immediately dismiss it I guess.
Scouring is not cutting. Would like to see this scan to determine context.
Wolverine didn't cut Colossus in that last fight. DEMON-POSSESSED Wolverine did. This makes the scan inadmissible as any sort of proof that Wolverine can cut Colossus by himself, because Wolverine WASN'T himself when it occurred.
We don't have to prove that he's had a strength amp. Like I said, the fact that Wolverine HAD an amp makes this whole feat completely ambiguous and invalid.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
There are too many circumstances surrounding the feat, so anybody that wants to argue that it's valid [b]shouldn't (until it's proven otherwise).And anybody that wants to argue that it isn't valid should (until it's proven it is valid).
This is not equal footing.
That's the value of "circumstantial" evidence in the context of arguing evidence.
It's not reliable unless, and until, proven otherwise.
[/B]
QFT.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
It's not that. I simply haven't seen any evidence that he's stronger under this demonic possession. We need to wait till the arc ends.
Whether or not it would ever be mentioned that Wolvie got (or didn't get) a strength upgrade from his possession, I'd just like to mention that the fact that Wolverine WAS possessed and that the possession DID provide him with an amp in powers (demonstrated by the several new powers he manifested) puts this whole feat in question and makes it quite inadmissible.