Spiderman vs. Captain America/Daredevil/Wolverine

Started by brainchild81244 pages

Originally posted by jinzin
I'm saying you don't know too much about spidey since you think his fihgting ability to be uncompared by anyone on earth................even though vulture kicked his ass in a h2h fight..
I've got a book somewhere in here where he kicked Vulture and Kraven's a$$es @ the same time.
you think that spiderman can't be hit by peak humans cause "it's not fact".................when it's happened hundreds upon hundreds of times....
I've seen it before too. Mostly very early in Spideys career. You actually counted hundreds of times?
you think cap can't hit him with his shield...............even though cap hit a guy that moved faster than the eye could see.
I'm not doubting this, but who and how?

"I've got a book somewhere in here where he kicked Vulture and Kraven's a$$es @ the same time."

I'm just saying...his fighting skills are anything but unequaled....

"I've seen it before too. Mostly very early in Spideys career. You actually counted hundreds of times?"

sadly......yes...🙁.......after I got past 360 I just stopped....

"I'm not doubting this, but who and how?"

it was some alien guy I forgot his name....his name and reference number are back a few dozen pages though....and he slung his sheild with the correct trajectory that he strategized the guy would move to it rickocheted (sp?) and nailed him out cold.

another thing is stat wise thinking is ridiculous.....captain america has held his own against a pissed off iron man...dd held his own against a ticked off namor...but statisically these guys don't compare to spidey so they lose?......gimme a break...

lol I just realized something...in that wolverine jumping pic where his nailing that robot 30 feet into the air...he actually sent the robot semi airborne......lol

I've been looking through some stuff that I missed & I noticed what DD was thinking in that Sin-eater scene. Interesting stuff. Also, Wolverine only landed the tackle & punch in the graveyard encounter because Spidey let him tackle him. In the practice session where Spidey got stabbed(Not really a fight) Spidey was able to hurt Wolverine. The scene with Spidey webbing Wolvie up good wasn't a real fight, but it was cool as hell. It shows how fast and capable Spidey is. The hypnotized Spidey thing wasn't really Spidey going all out. DD was up against more of a "Zombie Spidey". Walk forward. Punch. Choke. We still didn't see how Spidey sent him through the wall. Honestly though, Does anybody wanna see Spidey splater DD in his own book? Any book for that matter? DD had to survive. Here, in our hypothetical thread, he doesn't. Don't be crazy.

THE FOLLOWING ISN'T MY POST FOR THIS VS. THREAD ALONE. IT'S FOR ALL OF THEM
In the end, all characters are only as formidible as the writers want them to be. Sometimes writers ignore stats to keep things interesting. There is acceptable writing. Angry Hulk punches Cap or DD and they live. You can't have heroes getting killed all the time can you? Writers can be fanboys too. There is unacceptable(VERY BAD) writing. Bats & Nightwing beating Amazo. Just because something happens in comics doesn't mean it should or makes any sense @ all.

What's that brainchild, Spidey loses because he is more powerful? Ahhh, how sweet, delusion fanboy talk semi-intellegently hidden in circular logic. Would you like a lolly?

Originally posted by brainchild81
In the practice session where Spidey got stabbed(Not really a fight) Spidey was able to hurt Wolverine.
Yeah, wolverine felt the blows, but he wasn't knocked out. He went into a sort of fetal position to just weather the Spideystorm of fury that spidey was unleashing. And Wolverine did weather the storm, when Spidey stop Wolverine got up stretched and then physically it was like nothing happened

Originally posted by brainchild81
Honestly though, Does anybody wanna see Spidey splater DD in his own book? Any book for that matter? DD had to survive. Here, in our hypothetical thread, he doesn't. Don't be crazy.
Survive, he didn't even wind up in the hospital like in his hulk encounter.

And this is marvel we're talking about. Death and resurection happen all the friggen time. So why can't we kill a character for a little while and then bring them back?

We don't even seem to injure them that much.

"Also, Wolverine only landed the tackle & punch in the graveyard encounter because Spidey let him tackle him."

he ran out of options...he admittedly gave everything he had....there was othing else he could do but HOPE to break wolverine's neck....and technicallly...that wouldn't have even worked anyways...

I'm sure Wolverine could get the best of Spiderman on a good day, but every other day Wolverine gets owned.

Why is it when Spiderman fights some of Marvels most ruthless and bad ass enemies he posseses insane strategy and ultimately unmatched ability and intelligence. Yet when he fights some of MArvels sub par hero's he appears to be suffering from a hang over?

It's your classic case of paper scissors rock. How the hell does paper beat rock? It doesn't make anysense! Rocks can break scissors, scissors can cut paper, but what the hell does paper do to rock? Wraps it up? You can still throw it, it's still a rock.

It's not easy to see why spidey gets his ass whipped by "street level" characters until you sit and think about it. Here's leading you in the right direction.

Who's likely to make the best use out of there skills, the guy to whom it comes easily or the guy who has to fight for it every day?

Who's going to get the best out of there talents, the master tactician, or the bookworm?

Who's got the determination, the guy who fights an uphill unrelenting battle everyday, or the guy who doesn't even know if he wants to be a hero at times?

Originally posted by jinzin
"You can debate comic book characters and use comic book examples as long as they're not redicoulously above what said comic book character can actually do....that's what you've been doing,"
ummmmm no I haven't..... 🙄 wolverine consistantly kicks the crap out of spiderman.....apparently it's not outside of the limits of his character to do so.....

"And it's funny how you'll pick and choose what to debate out of one of my arguments without debating the whole thing, you don't even get how to factor in logic to one of your examples "

but it's okay for you to pick and choose what types of "logic" and realism you're using for your debate?....again... 🙄

"Origins don't matter, notice I did say "real world physics applied to the abilities of the characters in this fight" and was not referring to the origin."

of course you weren't talking about the origins because it's in direct contrast with the whole "lets use realism in our comic book debate strategy" and makes you look hipocritical as all ****... 😂 ....but like I said.....even given spidermans abilities in the real world his bone density wouldn't be any more sufficient to land from jumping 2 stories into the air than it would before.....hence he breaks his legs the first time he attempts to jump off something high.....

"You're only disputing the origin to get out of having to argue the physiology of a human and the physiology of Spidey and having to admit Spidey as a human's superior many times over, etc, etc, or continuing with what you've got and risking humiliation, or leaving altogether."

please everytime I've trapped you in one of your crap writing arguments with a hypothetical question you simply don't respond to it....... again....what makes the wolverine vs. spiderman fight IN CONTINUITY? I'm disputing real world logic because it doesn't belong in a comic book debate...these guys have shown through actuall FEATS ...life experiences that they can take anything spidey has to dish out and even beat him into the ground....."but that's crap writiing wha wha wha".....well stick with what you got I guess..... :rolleyes"
"Using your logic, I could also go on to say that mutants don't exist, DD is just blind period and also suffering from cancer or something of the sort, and Cap. A. is still his scrawny self without any special enhancements because: "you can't just take a dip into a pool of chemicals and come out with powers" or I could go to the extreme and say that Cap. A. dies from poisoning or the experiment is shut down by the government because the procedure is unethical."

maybe you've been avoiding the logic of creshock's posts because both he and I have been saying relatively the same thing for ump-teen some pages here..... that's why we're not debating realism...is that to hard for you to understand? 😕 poor kid......

"Then again, you'd have to understand a human's physiology to understand and obviously you don't, so, I don't hold anything against you."

obviously I don't.....despite my courses in human anatomy and biology......😂 oh wait....you don't have proof of that statement either...like you haven't had proof of anything other than your absolute ignorance of all of these characters during theis entire thread... 😱
"Wolvie's stats say different."

his feats don't.......

"even in your precious "graveyard fight" example. Spidey is evading all of Wolvie's attacks depsite his "fear" (please) of Wolvie's own speed."

yeah except a "claws sheathed" punch to the face..... 🙄

"Spidey's just standing there like an idiot to take the stab while Wolvie is pulling from webbing he's never been confirmed to have been strong enough to pull away from and"

😂 you only further PROVE you're complete and total ignorance.....not only is spidey not "standing around" but the guy is in mid air (jumping if that helps you....feet not on ground if that helps more), he's also still spraying webbing out from his wrists....hahahahaha

"when you ocnsider that Spidey was holding back and not even trying to attack Wolvie with anything other than his stronger-than-steel-cable-type webbing,"

whats your point?.....😕 obviously wolverine wasn't going all out either since it was an accident.......oh well you almost had a nice debate..........oh wait....no you didn't! 😱

anyways....I'm with cresh on this one......anyone else wants to debate this thang great....I'm done with straw though......


Wolvie does anything but kick the crap out of Spidey. If anything, there's some stupid technicality for Wolvie getting the upperhand in any of their fights in the first place. Notice the difference in Spidey's personality and manner in Secret Wars, where he fought like he actually had superhuman abilties and had not only backhanded Wolvie a few feet, but also left Colossus, Nightcrawler, and Rogue pulling webbing out of their ears. Wolverine has been confirmed already through comic book stats to have not been on Spidey's level both in the past and currently.

And when have I not debated everything you've had to say on the trio beating Spidey? That's a false accusation. Btw, that was a smart move, you know, owning up to my accusation.

And it's like I said, you want to bring a hero's origin into a discussion about real world physics, then Superman should be everyone's doormat on account of our having no proof of alien lifeforms.

And I'm not ignoring any of yours' or Cresh's points, but I don't see the logic in them. You claim to be a specialist on the human anatomy despite knowing that Cap and DD are both human with human anatomies and physiologies and therefore could not survive having their heads rammed through walls and the force of an unpulled punch from Spidey...you're just refusing to own up to it. Which is really, very sad.

And you've NEVER trapped me in a crap writing argument, I may have given you an answer you don't want to acknowledge or accept, but I have given you an answer to it nonetheless. And I stand by it.

And where in the statement: Cap A and DD are humans, does something scream ignorance? If you're so sure of my ignorance of these characters than maybe you should start reading more comics, the fact that Cap. A and DD are humans has been confirmed, and it's the fact that your precious argument of them being superhumans has not been confirmed that has you resorting to insulting me rather than trying to prove me wrong with an example other than a battle in which Spidey was fighting well below his potential.

More later.

Originally posted by MERCILOUS
What's that brainchild, Spidey loses because he is more powerful? Ahhh, how sweet, delusion fanboy talk semi-intellegently hidden in circular logic. Would you like a lolly?
🙂 Ahh. Everything typed can be interpreted in different ways. The above is obviously a spiteful fanboy demonstrating what we call displacement. Sad 🙁 It'd be cool if Jinzinfan would post something useful every now & then.
Originally posted by jinzin
"Also, Wolverine only landed the tackle & punch in the graveyard encounter because Spidey let him tackle him."

he ran out of options...he admittedly gave everything he had....there was othing else he could do but HOPE to break wolverine's neck....and technicallly...that wouldn't have even worked anyways...

They seemed to think it would. That was a younger, much more immature Spidey. He was scared of Wolvie back then. Did Spidey even use the webs? Still, Wolverine survived only because Spidey's not a killer. Don't argue with Wolvie now! You've read the book. Because of the training incident, Spidey and Wolverine will most likely have a good brawl sometime soon. I can't wait. Even if Spidey loses(he shouldn't IMO 🙂 )there's no shame in losing to Wolvie. Were the organic webs in use in the training incident?

Originally posted by brainchild81
🙂Were the organic webs in use in the training incident?
They might have been. They might be the reason Wolverine could break out of them. . . If this can be confirmed that wuold mean that the organic isn't as strong as the chemical that Petey came up with.

It's nice to see another spidey supporter besides me on all of these pages.

🙂

If we are talking about adult spidey here, or even teen spidey, I keep my verdict on the fact that spidey needs to be out of his element( open spaces, cornered) to lose. An all out spidey would be physically able to keep that advantage in check AND has enough experience and wisdom to know he is at a disadvantage other wise. Even batman wouldn't allow himself to be surrounded and he is way less physically capable of outdistancing them.

Everyone has given some decent and even good points on this matter, but concerning spidey flying, he really doesn't need to. There are so many options of maneuverability for him and the factor that he can adhere to almost any surface gives him an edge so he won't have to necessarily stay on the move.

And yes Wolverine always seems to be in top form because he is written to do so, basically the fans like his attitude and want to see him win against logically incorrect people, Magneto per say, and probably even Charles soon. Would you see Cyke beat a guy immune to ruby quartz? Most likely not.

And again Spidey has the strength to incapacitate these guys in a blow particularly Cap and DD. Hulk has not been written not to one punch these guys and we know he is capable right? Think carefully, this is not a defense, but more of a question asking just because a character is written to struggle more doesn't mean they are not capable of what their stats clearly say or show what is reasonable for them to do when they are going all out.

Props to the spidey supporters for hanging in there even with some good and not so good evidence brought against them. 👆

Originally posted by Creshosk
Yeah, wolverine felt the blows, but he wasn't knocked out. He went into a sort of fetal position to just weather the Spideystorm of fury that spidey was unleashing. And Wolverine did weather the storm, when Spidey stop Wolverine got up stretched and then physically it was like nothing happened.
He was on his knees for a bit though. & Wolvie wasn't smiling this time. You are right about the fetal position.

Survive, he didn't even wind up in the hospital like in his hulk encounter.

And this is marvel we're talking about. Death and resurection happen all the friggen time. So why can't we kill a character for a little while and then bring them back?


A hero killing another hero though? These 2? Spidey and DD are Superfriends. Man, that sounded real corny.

Originally posted by Creshosk
They might have been. They might be the reason Wolverine could break out of them. . . If this can be confirmed that wuold mean that the organic isn't as strong as the chemical that Petey came up with.
Movie Spidey and Comic Spidey must remain separate!

Originally posted by jinzin
and again.... (Wolverine jumping)

Oh boy, now I've seen it all. You disappoint me Jinzin, by showing us this horrible pic (and didn't Colossus use to throw Wolverine to the Sentinels back in the days ? But why ? If Wolverine is such a great jumper...)

It's official : Wolverine has (another) upgrade : jumping ability. Have I seen him jump that high even once in his own series ? Nope.

If the best and most convincing picture you have is taken from some lame crossover, well no thanks lol

Wolverine can not jump that high. Period. Or are you really accepting EVERYTHING you see ? If Spider-Man would jump over the Empire State Building, would you accept it too ?

What about Nightwing and Batman beating Amazo? (I know. Wrong thread. But it had to be said)

Are you talking about the recent comic ? Only a few months old ? If so, I think - hm, no I am 100 % sure - Amazo was downgraded, because under normal conditions, he/it would have killed Batman and Nightwing.

Bad writing. It was not the best Amazo ever, but even a half powered Amazo would have slaughtered them.

But we can't have that, can we ?

Of course not! Batfanboys need ammo for Vs threads. 🙂 Wasn't he only missing the ring & lasso?

Originally posted by who?-kid
Oh boy, now I've seen it all. You disappoint me Jinzin, by showing us this horrible pic (and didn't Colossus use to throw Wolverine to the Sentinels back in the days ? But why ? If Wolverine is such a great jumper...)

It's official : Wolverine has (another) upgrade : jumping ability. Have I seen him jump that high even once in his own series ? Nope.

If the best and most convincing picture you have is taken from some lame crossover, well no thanks lol

Wolverine can not jump that high. Period. Or are you really accepting EVERYTHING you see ? If Spider-Man would jump over the Empire State Building, would you accept it too ?

Not all of those were from the crossover. 😐

Man it's getting easier to identify who's not worth talking to.

WOlverine is shown jumping really high multiple time, suddenly he can't because it tajkes away an advatage Spidey has? 😕