Either way she could still pin him down with winds. Greatly reducing his threat to her person. All she'd have to do is avoid his blasts which she's very capable of doing and then kill with lightning or toss him about with her winds. He's only a major threat to her airborne and he cant match her in the sky she would turn it against him.
k first of all his flame was put out by a fire extinguisher. storm is extremely capable of taking it out. storm has avoided sentinals, gun fire, and spideys webing, the list goes on and on. she has numerous ways of taking her out. torch couldn't take away her oxygen because this has already happened when she was buried and she just brought in her own wind and made her own oxygen sothats not gonna work. can torch create his own oxygen?? prolly not and a small tornado can take away all of his oxygen as well as take out his flame. with his flame out she can pin him to the ground or a wall like she did in C.O.C and he couldn't flame on. form this poitn she could either hit him with lightning or freeze him because she has done both of these on multiple occasions. imo storm wins all 10/10
It doesn't make sense that he can stay flamed on in space. How? You need oxygen to even generate flame. It doesn't make sense, and it's overuled by the countless other times they've been in space and Torch has NOT been able to fly out there.
So it's basically - one instance of Johnny being flamed in space vs. several of him not being able to + being extinguished by a fire extinguisher, fire hose, foam generator, sprinkler system, and lake water.
No contest.
"It doesn't make sense that he can stay flamed on in space. How? You need oxygen to even generate flame. It doesn't make sense, and it's overuled by the countless other times they've been in space and Torch has NOT been able to fly out there."
There you go hugging your science books again. Does it make sense that Hulk can do what he does? That Spider-Man does what he does? No. Marvel Comics aren't pioneers of sense. They're not pioneers of realism.
Considering that it was cosmic rays that gave him his powers, what makes you so viciously sure that his flames are of Earth anyway? It's not like turning on a fireplace.
Using a fire extinguisher on him is pathetic and ignorant. If someone just walked up to Magneto with a reverse pole magnet and force him away, you'd think "Hang on....this is lame".
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
"It doesn't make sense that he can stay flamed on in space. How? You need oxygen to even generate flame. It doesn't make sense, and it's overuled by the countless other times they've been in space and Torch has NOT been able to fly out there."There you go hugging your science books again. Does it make sense that Hulk can do what he does? That Spider-Man does what he does? No. Marvel Comics aren't pioneers of sense. They're not pioneers of realism.
You can't just dismiss science entirely just because YOU don't like talking about it. It's 100% valid. There is scientific theory and scientific fact. Marvel uses both. It's scientific fact that flame doesn't work without oxygen. It's been used to defeat Johnny PLENTY of times. Every time he hits the water, his flame goes out. Every OTHER time he's been in space or in a vacuum, his flame has gone out. In every appearance he's ever had but one, his flame has gone out when faced with simiar circumstances.
In fact, I wanna know more about that storyline where someone said he WAS able to survive in space. How could he even breathe?!? There's something else to that storyline that the poster isn't telling us.
Considering that it was cosmic rays that gave him his powers, what makes you so viciously sure that his flames are of Earth anyway? It's not like turning on a fireplace.
What makes me sure is that, unlike Firelord, whose flames ARE cosmic and who has a HISTORY of flying around in space AND underwater with his flame on, Torch has failed every time he's tried, except this one.
Using a fire extinguisher on him is pathetic and ignorant. If someone just walked up to Magneto with a reverse pole magnet and force him away, you'd think "Hang on....this is lame".
Yes, I would. Unless it kept happening, then I'd have to accept it as it being some bizarre weakness. As in the case of Torch, where MULTIPLE writers put him out the same way.
"You can't just dismiss science entirely just because YOU don't like talking about it. It's 100% valid. There is scientific theory and scientific fact. Marvel uses both. It's scientific fact that flame doesn't work without oxygen. It's been used to defeat Johnny PLENTY of times. Every time he hits the water, his flame goes out. Every OTHER time he's been in space or in a vacuum, his flame has gone out. In every appearance he's ever had but one, his flame has gone out when faced with simiar circumstances."
You can't say Marvel uses both and then write off their freedom to use the other. Which is exactly what you are doing. You can't adhere to one and then switch to the other when you don't like it. Why are you assuming I don't like talking about science? I love science. If I loved science to the point of applying it to Marvel, I wouldn't be a very happy guy.
"Yes, I would. Unless it kept happening, then I'd have to accept it as it being some bizarre weakness. As in the case of Torch, where MULTIPLE writers put him out the same way."
That's your problem. You feel that you are forced to accept. You're of able mind, you're not forced to accept anything. You can challenge whatever you want to.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
"You can't just dismiss science entirely just because YOU don't like talking about it. It's 100% valid. There is scientific theory and scientific fact. Marvel uses both. It's scientific fact that flame doesn't work without oxygen. It's been used to defeat Johnny PLENTY of times. Every time he hits the water, his flame goes out. Every OTHER time he's been in space or in a vacuum, his flame has gone out. In every appearance he's ever had but one, his flame has gone out when faced with simiar circumstances."You can't say Marvel uses both and then write off their freedom to use the other. Which is exactly what you are doing. You can't adhere to one and then switch to the other when you don't like it. Why are you assuming I don't like talking about science? I love science. If I loved science to the point of applying it to Marvel, I wouldn't be a very happy guy.
This coming from the guy who dismissed Storm powering herself from a star saying that's nonsense because "no other writer had her do that"? Hypocracy isn't a Greek philosopher...
It's like this - you're saying that it's silly to think that Storm can blow his flame out, and you cite ONE instance of him being flamed on in space as evidence of that.
I'm saying Storm can blow or rain his flame out, and I cite MULTIPLE instances of him being flamed out by things far less powerful than her winds or rains.
So you could use your evidence to support your claim, but considering that I have multiple times the amount of evidence, you can hardly claim my position to be silly.
"This coming from the guy who dismissed Storm powering herself from a star saying that's nonsense because "no other writer had her do that"? Hypocracy isn't a Greek philosopher..."
I dismissed her doing so because she doesn't have that power. Never has she had that power. While we're technical, it's hypocricy.
This all comes down, I now know, to the fact that you are either afraid to or feel you don't have the right to challenge shit writing. If it's debateable fair enough. Storm powering a Star is so far in the river of stupidity and desperation that it's not funny.
So is using an extinguisher on Torch.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I dismissed her doing so because she doesn't have that power. Never has she had that power.
And that's YOUR problem. You can't seem to get past some paper description of someone's power to look into why it works that way. Storm controls the weather - but what is the weather? What does that mean? Once you find out, it makes perfect sense that she CAN channel the power of a star because a star's atmosphere is simply the star's weather.
This all comes down, I now know, to the fact that you are either afraid to or feel you don't have the right to challenge shit writing.
That's so funny you'd say that. I was actually going to post the same thing about you. I challenge shit writing all the time. For example - Torch being able to flame on in space.
If it's debateable fair enough. Storm powering a Star is so far in the river of stupidity and desperation that it's not funny.So is using an extinguisher on Torch.
Another crazy coincidence! I was going to say the same thing about Torch flaming on in space! There's absolutely no rational reason how or why that could happen, and every other case of writing shows why. If you're going to judge "shit writing" which is subjective, the only way to even begin to objectify it is to compare it to other cases where he's been in that situation. If 98% of the time, he's getting put out by fire extinguishers, and 2% of the time he's flying in space with his flame on...which do you think better qualifies as "shit writing"?
"You can't seem to get past some paper description of someone's power to look into why it works that way. Storm controls the weather - but what is the weather? What does that mean? Once you find out, it makes perfect sense that she CAN channel the power of a star because a star's atmosphere is simply the star's weather."
Once again you make excuses. If every person lived up to some unbelievable farfetched version of their power, then there'd be many more candidates for most powerful in the MU. The X-Men bar Jean with Phoenix force are never ever regarded as anything involving "best" because the levels you assume they are capable of will never be reached.
"If 98% of the time, he's getting put out by fire extinguishers, and 2% of the time he's flying in space with his flame on...which do you think better qualifies as "shit writing"?"
Depends how literal we're being. Wolverine is no match for Torch, him getting the win via fire extinguisher is shit writing. That's my point, not flame outage. The nature of taking the win.
-AC