Apocalypse vs Thor

Originally posted by MF DELPH
Modern Apocalypse always has the armor. The only time he wouldn't have the armor would be prior to finding Ship or fresh out of his Rejuvenation Chamber (in some depictions). It was shown in Messiah War that all he needs to do is interface with his Celestial Tech and he can power up and form the armor (which is why Stryfe and Bishop had to to get the drop on him during one of his hibernation cycles to try and take him out). The Transmode in him is able to create it once he interfaces. It's literally part of him once he gained it. It's not typically depicted as a special suit of armor he sometimes wears like a special Ironman suit. He's always in his Celestial Armor.

Yes, I understand that Apocalypse always has armor on.

What I'm saying is that he's never until recently had cosmic Celestial Armor on. And I'm not talking about some cheap knock-off he whipped up, but armor equivalent to that of Celestials granted to him by the Host (Along with the Death Seed I'm guessing).

Armor that has him walking around as durable as a Celestial. This isn't hard to understand. There's Celestial Armor, then there's Celestial Armor. Apocalypse (Others like Stellaris) had the former in the past, now he has the latter.

Well, assuming that the Celestials granted Apocalypse that armor when they gave him Ship per the current retcon which makes Apocalypse the Celestial's Caretaker, and given that the fight with Thor took place in 1100 AD, I think it's safe to assume that the armor is at this point considered one in the same. Apocalypse does not have multiple suits of armor like Ironman. The origin of the armor he's always worn has simply been retroactively changed. He originally gained it by interfacing with Ship without Celestial intervention at all but that has been changed.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Wolverine fans make no sense.

IIRC he also commented that Thor grew up nicely, that's why I said what I did.

What do you mean? When? Can't remember the exact date but it was the typical early A.D era. Thor actually had a crazy showing where he created that Blood Golem.

It should be noted that was a previous Ragnarok Cycle I believe.

Celestial Ships can just spit out Celestial Armor? I'm not saying it's not possible but when I read that scene, the Death Seed and Armor seemed to be like really important shit that a Celestial directly hands out to a single trusted servant. Again, not saying you're wrong, but it just feels, wrong you know. That it can be mass produced.

Oh okay.

Well, I don't consider him a Herald level being tbh. Not if he's walking around as durable as a Celestial. Even someone like Thanos would be hard pressed to scratch him.

He could have been talking about maturity, or the hammer itself. It's not like he did much since he previously actually took Gorr out... twice.

Yeah, I'm curious as to how far the dates are away from the Apoc scene. Though the Ragnarok cycle is something I hadn't heard before.

What Delph said.
Apoc wouldn't mass produce the armor as it only bends to his will, and it'd be stupid to give a Gambit or Wolverine Celestial armor. Tech, yes.
And we've never actually seen Apoc get the Death seed. When Apoc first seen a Celestial in the latest telling of his background, it was after the ship was already built and Eson was promising him powa via telepathy. So the ship building his armor still stands. Plus it'd be really stupid to give out his actual Celestial armor and just not have it anymore.

I'm talking sheer power. In sheer power he's herald level. In durability he's near abstract level lol. I liked it better when it was just really tough Celestial tech, not actual armor.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
Well, assuming that the Celestials granted Apocalypse that armor when they gave him Ship per the current retcon which makes Apocalypse the Celestial's Caretaker, and given that the fight with Thor took place in 1100 AD, I think it's safe to assume that the armor is at this point considered one in the same. Apocalypse does not have multiple suits of armor like Ironman. The origin of the armor he's always worn has simply been retroactively changed. He originally gained it by interfacing with Ship without Celestial intervention at all but that has been changed.

So you understand my point between the two? Okay.

If his ship can repair and allow him to rock that armor currently then I don't see how Thor has a much of a chance on average.

Even if I think Thor's more powerful, versatile and even stronger, he still would lose 90% of the time to a guy on his level who's as durable as a High End cosmic.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
final nail in the coffin for that... maybe a thread needs bumping...

He could have been talking about maturity, or the hammer itself. It's not like he did much since he previously actually took Gorr out... twice.

Yeah, I'm curious as to how far the dates are away from the Apoc scene. Though the Ragnarok cycle is something I hadn't heard before.

What Delph said.
Apoc wouldn't mass produce the armor as it only bends to his will, and it'd be stupid to give a Gambit or Wolverine Celestial armor. Tech, yes.
And we've never actually seen Apoc get the Death seed. When Apoc first seen a Celestial in the latest telling of his background, it was after the ship was already built and Eson was promising him powa via telepathy. So the ship building his armor still stands. Plus it'd be really stupid to give out.

I'm talking sheer power. In sheer power he's herald level. In durability he's near abstract level lol. I liked it better when it was just really tough Celestial tech, not actual armor.

Lol, go ahead. I'd enjoy it.

Fair enough, that's just what I took from it.

IIRC, yes, it was a previous Ragnarok cycle and you know how much of a mess that shit is.

Okay, so the ship built him the armor? I assumed it was given to him by Arishem. The same ritual we saw, my bad, it just seemed like a process they all expected.

Fair enough.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
Well, assuming that the Celestials granted Apocalypse that armor when they gave him Ship per the current retcon which makes Apocalypse the Celestial's Caretaker, and given that the fight with Thor took place in 1100 AD, I think it's safe to assume that the armor is at this point considered one in the same. Apocalypse does not have multiple suits of armor like Ironman. The origin of the armor he's always worn has simply been retroactively changed. He originally gained it by interfacing with Ship without Celestial intervention at all but that has been changed.

He's not fully covered, but yeah, that adds a lot

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Lol, go ahead. I'd enjoy it.

Fair enough, that's just what I took from it.

IIRC, yes, it was a previous Ragnarok cycle and you know how much of a mess that shit is.

Okay, so the ship built him the armor? I assumed it was given to him by Arishem. The same ritual we saw, my bad, it just seemed like a process they all expected.

Fair enough.

I believe. If Delph has a panel, that'd help.
But I don't think Apoc's ever been shown in the same room as Celestials in canon, so idk.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Interesting. I don't recall reading about previous Ragnarok cycles.

I believe. If Delph has a panel, that'd help.
But I don't think Apoc's ever been shown in the same room as Celestials in canon, so idk.

End of the X-Men V2 Apocalypse is picked up by the Celestials as he's trying to suicide.

Yeah, I see your point. It's the confusion of altered continuity. Apocalypse's connection and relationship to the Celestials is being expanded upon and fleshed out post Blood of Apocalypse and Simonson's stand alones. Originally Apocalypse simply happened upon ship and, over several centuries, learned all of it's secrets and augmented himself via his Transmode infection. That's been retroactively changed twice now. He's now an agent of the Celestials that shepherds the progress of humanity's evolution. I wish they'd kept the original idea of Apocalypse being the mid-point of all Earth's humanoid species (a Human/Eternal/Deviant mutant hybrid).

But anyway, yeah, Cosmic Celestial Armor, plus all his other powers.

Originally posted by curryman
End of the X-Men V2 Apocalypse is picked up by the Celestials as he's trying to suicide.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
They were just flashes of light iirc.
Plus that's like his last appearance (though I still think he was the same Apoc who beat the dick out of Stryfe).

Yeah, I think you're right. Flash of light and some speech bubbles.

What about his origin-story when he first comes across the celestial tech?

i'm confused as hell about the character now

Originally posted by curryman
Yeah, I think you're right. Flash of light and some speech bubbles.

What about his origin-story when he first comes across the celestial tech?

Unless there's another story I'm missing.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
how do his powers work with that suit on?

Originally when Apocalypse found Ship it's defenses infected Apocalypse with the Transmode Virus. Since Apocalypse's innate powers are complete control of his molecular structure he was able to control the virus and utilize it, essentially becoming a techno-organic being like a Technarch. With that virus he was able to directly interface with Ship, gained Technopathy, and used ship to create his original Celestial armor which he merged with (his techno-organic form merged with the Celestial Armor and he's able to manipulate it as he can his own form. He 'assimilated' the armor). In a later story Cable traveled to the past and infected Apocalypse in Ancient Egypt (after Apocalypse had infected Cable as a baby, causing a temporal paradox because Apocalypse was then techno-organic before finding Ship.

Originally posted by curryman
End of the X-Men V2 Apocalypse is picked up by the Celestials as he's trying to suicide.

That's the Blood of Apocalypse Arc. Post Decimation he tries to enact a plan in which he kills 90% of humanity while simultaneously infecting the remaining mutants with his blood (putting the human and mutant populations on equal footing after M Day to correct Scarlet Witch messing up his work as shepherd of mutantkind). When the plan fails he tried to commit suicide but the Celestials came and took him.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
That's the Blood of Apocalypse Arc. Post Decimation he tries to enact a plan in which he kills 90% of humanity while simultaneously infecting the remaining mutants with his blood (putting the human and mutant populations on equal footing after M Day to correct Scarlet Witch messing up his work as shepherd of mutantkind). When the plan fails he tried to commit suicide but the Celestials came and took him.

I remember the setting, was just answering Branlor's question 😛

Originally posted by MF DELPH
That's the Blood of Apocalypse Arc. Post Decimation he tries to enact a plan in which he kills 90% of humanity while simultaneously infecting the remaining mutants with his blood (putting the human and mutant populations on equal footing after M Day to correct Scarlet Witch messing up his work as shepherd of mutantkind). When the plan fails he tried to commit suicide but the Celestials came and took him.

Most of that is based on the Archangel in that arc being his Archangel, and what he entered at the end of Blood of Apocalypse.

So if someone follows this thought, there's room for Apocalypse to just step into the current timeline, and stop with these fauxpocs. Though, I'm hoping he comes back in the next issue with the Celestial ship.

Yeah, Messiah War showed that the Celestials didn't kill Apocalypse, but it wasn't clear when he returned to Earth. Given that he's supposed to ensure that the strongest mutants evolve to their final Omega forms the Celestials probably just put him back to work after water boarding him for a couple centuries.

he was reincarnated in archangel, then reincarnated in a kid or something