Lol, Outgunned... Outclassed... 😆
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Nebula/7634/moondragon.html
http://www.geocities.com/brenni_au/SersiProfile.html
Norrin radd, you should check out the Moondragon profile if you still think Martian Manhunter would beat her. lol, She'd own him, then probably absorb his mind.
Wow, talk about overrating. Sorry again. Flash can strike a single opponent hundreds (not millions, there's a big difference, you know,) of times in a second or multiple opponents two or three times in a second. He has to accelerate to lightspeed, his functional speed is about 150 mph.
"Speed Force Aura: The Flash's body is surrounded by what he calls his "speed force aura". This aura protects him and anyone who is running with him or carried by him, from the effects of using his speed. This includes friction and airborne particulate matter. It may also protect him from injury from high speed impacts such as punches he delivers and receives from his opponents. He does seem to possess some level of superhuman resistance to injury but this does not extend far past normal physical interactions, as received from normal combat."
Says nothing about energy protection (e.g. damage from lightning).
Please, PLEASE, stop exaggerating abilities.
Here's my source:
http://www.starnet-database.com/dbase_deo/profiles/flash/flash.html (Yes, this is Wally West.)
I say the avengers would win they just never give up and there very resourful i dont think that the JLA could beat with out pre time the likes of Galactus, Korvac, Beyonder (didnt beat him but still fought pretty good) Molecular man, Ultron, Thanos with the Infinity gauntlet, i mean how many guys like this have the JLA fought? For one parallax took time to do what he did with the universe, Thanos took seconds, Galactus would have eaten the earth if it wasnt for the brain of Mr. Fantastic, i mean the JLA couldnt stop the sun eating entity on there own or the likes of the monitor in crisis on infinite earths.
Here are the teams:
Superman
Batman
Flash
Wonder Woman
Martian Manhunter
Green Lantern
Coldcast
Aquaman
Firestorm
Major Disaster
Dr. Fate
Zatanna
Triumph
Orion
Big Barda
Manitou Raven
Captain Marvel
Captain Atom
Metamorpho
Hourman III (Tyler)
VS.
Captain America
Captain Mar-vell
Wonder Man
Thor
Vision
Hulk
Iron Man
Dr. Druid
She Hulk
Sersi
Moon Dragon
Spiderman
SpiderWoman
Firestar
Living Lightning
Scarlet Witch
Namor
Mr. Fantastic
Invisible Woman
Gilgamesh
? The only heavyweights?
Sersi (an Eternal, can join the Uni-Mind.)
Living Lightning (initially faster than Flash, with lightning control)
MoonDragon (an Eternal, has the Shiar Mind Gem, Dragon of the Moon, and the Beyonder, and can Join the Uni-Mind.)
Scarlet Witch
Thor (with the Odinforce, lol outclassed... ) 😆
Hulk
Vision
Firestar (read her profile: http://www.avengersforever.org/characters/Characters.asp She can melt an entire a planet, without any harm to herself, and her flightspeed is undetermined.
Invisible Woman
No matter how many GL's there are, JLA is outgunned. Moon Dragon would take out just about everyone you named by herself with a telepathic strike, and Sersi would absorb the GL's ring power. It's no contest.
tell me why MM and firelord are always underrated for guy like you?
and you always forget speed, i don´t know moondragon but if i only count with her telepathy, she will loose, superman, MM, GL can move faster then she can think, and flash can move almost at the speed of light, i´m just basing this on telepathy, she is a eternal and she can have other powers that i don´t know about.
however this is a team battle,, and if some of the avengers protect the telepaths, they could beat the JLA. MM is an excelent telepath, but i really can´t compare him with moondragon, since DC is not very acurate in telepathy, but i do agree that moondragon is probably a better telepath.
To Cosmic Cube:
First off, let’s talk about Thor. I specifically said that Thor was not to possess the Odin Force. “As the Lord of Asgard, Thor possesses the Odin force, which enables him to tap into near-infinite resources of cosmic and mystical power, enhancing all his abilities.” (Handbook 2004) Thor with the Odin force would give Galactus, Thanos, the Phoenix Force, and hell even the Celestials a run for their money. The JLA would be proverbially screwed. That’s why Thor should have his normal abilities just like everyone else on the JLA and Avengers teams. I didn’t bulk up Superman (i.e. Superman Prime) or Green Lantern (i.e. Ion) or Wonder Woman (i.e. Goddess of Truth) to an extent that they would be nearly impossible to beat. Thor should have only have his own normal strengths, powers, and abilities. If you insist on Thor having the Odin Force than I must either add a character with strength to rival his own or supplement a character that is already on the roster with powers to rival the Odin Force that they have previously sustained and/or lost. Thor should only have his normal power levels.
Your entire argument rest on one sole arbitrary fact: Moon Dragon uses her telepathic powers to wipe out any and all that have no protection to telepathic attacks. You’ve stated that Moon Dragon is an Eternal and has superhuman endurance. The Flash’s attacks would be ineffective against her. Right? Wrong. Moon Dragon is NOT an Eternal. Moon Dragon is human. As a young girl she was abducted from Earth and brought to Thano’s home world called Titan. Moon Dragon was never an Eternal. She’s human. According to the site www.avengersassemble.com Moon Dragon was and I quote: “taught to achieve her full human potential by the priests of Titan. She is a superb athlete, surpassing the achievements of any Olympic athlete. She was trained to be as strong as human her size and weight can be: She can lift (press) 400 pounds.” She doesn’t have superhuman endurance. She’s just as durable as Captain America. A few million punches by the Flash means lights out for the telepath. Her telekinetic field would not present a problem. The Flash can simply vibrate through it. If the Flash can vibrate his way into other realities and universes, then he certainly vibrate his way through her TK shield.
The Living Lightening would not present a problem for the Flash. The Flash's body is surrounded by what he calls his "speed force aura". This “speed force aura” protects the Flash from electric attacks. When any speedster uses their power, there’s atmospheric discharge; a side effect of their muscles processing the Speed Force. Ever wonder what those yellow lightening bolts trailing after the Flash are? It’s ambient static electricity. Wally’s connection to the Speed Force enables him to absorb electricity around him. Wally often uses himself as a lightening rod during a dangerous thunderstorm. Electricity is not harmful to the Flash. It’s beneficial. The Flash is like an alkaline battery. His body enables him to absorb static or benevolent electricity around him to boost his speed. He’s done this many times against several opponents such as the Charger, the Weather Wizard, Abra Kadabra, Blacksmith, etc. The Speed Force IS lightening. The Flash is practically invulnerable to it. The Living Lightening would zap the Flash, but his costume (which is made of pure speed force energy) would absorb the charges and implement it into Wally’s velocity. The Flash would say thanks and move on.
Due to the facts above (Moon Dragon has peak human endurance and the Flash would not be harmed by the Living Lightening) the telepathy-knocks-out-all-the-JLA-members theory is nullified. Captain America, the Scarlet Witch, Moon Dragon, Spider-Man, and Spider-Woman are out of the fight. Superman and the others who have no protection against telepathy are alive and kicking. Sue Richards does not have the precognition or reaction time to react to a man traveling at near-lightspeed. Wally does require a few nanoseconds to tap into the Speed Force in order to travel at lightspeed or exceed it. Wally’s normal travel rate is not 150 miles per hour (where the hell did you get that number?) Wally normally travels at a leisurely rate of 800 miles per hour to avoid atmospheric disturbances in the environment. Traveling at near-lightspeed however is not a problem for him during an all-out battle. Sue wouldn’t even know that the Flash is moving to react to him or to trap him for that matter
Once again back to the biological E.M.P. argument. I don’t give a flip if you have a PhD in physics and you work for NASA. It’s a comic book, for God’s sake. Science means nothing in comics! A biological E.M.P may be impossible in our world, but in the DC universe ANYTHING is possible. Why the heck would you argue that a bio E.M.P. is not possible when we’re discussing an Asgardian thunder god with a magic hammer? Science is useless for comic book discussions. Comics are written by people with little to no college education. Once again here it is:
An excerpt from JLA #100 August 2004:
Sister Superior: We're under new management, girl (directed to Faith)... Coldcast
Coldcast unleashes a cloud of energy from his mouth. Several JLAers fall.
Plastic Man : Uh, lemme guess...bad breath ray?
Sister Superior: A biological equivalent of an E.M.P.. Shuts down neurons by rendering electrons inert.
The biological E.M.P. argument has proven and accredited. Coldcast is a Swiss army knife when it comes to energy. In Action Comics #775, Coldcast reduced thousands of Chinese soldiers and a two-mile wide Chinese base in diameter to GRAIN. In Action Comics #779, Coldcast gave Superman a human equivalent of a stroke. Later on he hit him with a "grill-full of red solar radiation". Coldcast juggles different energy types for kid's birthday parties. Coldcast has complete control over the entire electromagnetic spectrum. Gamma waves, microwaves, light waves, etc. are all at his disposal. Do yourself a favor, LOOK for the sources. I’m not your librarian
Iron Man is still vulnerable to E.M.P pulses.
http://www.ironmanarmory.com/armors.html I know of his new armor. Red Skull used an E.M.P. on this supposedly new indestructible armor during the Red Zone and Iron Man fell. Iron Man may have fail-safes to prevent an E.M.P. but certainly not a guarantee. Triumph is a master of magnetism. He can tap into the Earth’s electromagnetic field. A low-level E.M.P. may not work against Iron-Man but a larger scale E.M.P. certainly would work. Iron Man falls in few seconds.
Hourman is 853rd technological being, a “diamond generation intelligent machine colony" whose cells are laced with Miraclo gene biosoftware developed by Tyler Chemorobotics, a company founded by the original Hourman, inventor Rex Tyler. A zap of electricity isn’t going to faze an android with technology that is millions of years into the future. He got thrown into a sun and he survived.
Hourman has complete control of time. He can freeze time over specific areas or overall areas. He can also accelerate a person’s aging process until they grow old and die. He possesses “time-vision” that enables him to know what is going to happen for it happens. It’s perfect. No jumbled images. No mysterious voices. Just the future. Hourman III possesses a biological hard drive that enables him to predict perfectly what is going to happen before it happens. He knew when Hipplotya was going to die. He knew when and how the JLA would defeat Mageddon. He even gave his ancestor (Hourman I) the exact time when he was going to die (6:37 pm) and how he was going to die (cancer). He would know when and how the Avengers would attack before they do. Wonder Man is going to blindside Superman…Hourman warns him and Superman evades the attack and counters. Firestar attempts to blast Green Lantern…Hourman tells GL when, where and how she is going to attack, minutes before Firestar even decides to attack GL. Hourman is a very dangerous threat. Not to mention he can become intangible and invisible. He can also use his time-powers to create portals to various locations.
Sersi is very powerful opponent. But I seriously doubt she would be able to absorb GL’s ring. It’s been tried before and it has failed. Sersi would be one of the last to fall.
Scarlet Witch is not as powerful as I think she is. I’m not underrating her. I fully am aware of what she is capable of. But YOU on the hand of no knowledge of Dr. Fate; you’re underrating him. Dr. Fate is on the same level as Dr. Strange. He’s defeated Neron, Spectre, and even gods themselves. He has eons of experience. He can summon demons, dragons, and otherworldly creatures to do his bidding. He can draw upon vast mystical resources to enhance his powers. He can do pretty much anything. Scarlet Witch is not on his level. The water-barrier spell that Scarlet Witch did during the Red Zone event is parlor trick to Dr. Fate. He once moved the Earth to an entirely different solar system. Scarlet Witch during the Disassembled event created entities out of thin air to attack the Avengers. So what? Dr. Fate can create sentient entities out of thin air too. (JSA #18) Dr. Fate has no limitations. Scarlet Witch has many. According to the Official Handbook Marvel Universe: Avengers: Scarlet Witch’s hex-casting ability has 50% unreliability factor and his limited by her range of sight. Her power’s reliability depends in part upon her physical condition and more so her probability field.” In other words, her powers work half the time! It’s all up to Lady Luck. Scarlet Witch only has reality-altering powers. Dr. Fate possesses all magics including reality-altering magics. Scarlet Witch is out of her league compared to Dr. Fate. It’s like a padawan going up against a Jedi.
Stop overrating Firestar. She’s very low level. Just because she has “undeterminable speeds” doesn’t automatically mean she go at lightspeed. Firestar cannot “melt the planet”. She can melt steel and titanium alloy metals, but certainly not the planet. Such an act would kill her because her power is hazardous to her health. Pushing her power beyond a set limit would harm her. As I said before, the biosuit created by Dr. Pym regulates her power output and prevents her from reaching a set standard. If she chooses to pass that standard she would harm herself internally (i.e. cancer, she won’t be able to have kids) and externally (burnt skin).
Actually the suit meant to regulate her power output for a few months while also developing an imunity in her body to the faucet of her powers which was hurting her. Now she can use her powers to their fullest, and they don't hurt her.
Also, Moondragon isn't an Eternal. She's a human raised by the Eternals.
And here's info, again, on what a Green Lantern can do and has done:
I've seen the site before Tron. (And I was wrong, Hulk is immortal, but certainly not eternal.) Spiderwoman III is an Avenger? Put her in, then. Julia sucks.
Norrin, you're seriously underestimating Moondragon. What do you mean, "a guy like me?" Superman, Firestar, and Martian Manhunter would be braindead before they could think, "Hey, I should attack the bald girl who's hovering," by her telepathy. She has:
The Shiar Mind Gem (Exponentially increases mental ability.)
The Dragon of the Moon (a cosmic entity similar to the phoenix.)
The Essence of the Beyonder (The Beyonder was apparently the most powerful being ever to exist in this universe (although he was not native to this universe), and hence could do virtually anything, The Beyonder could manipulate incalculable amounts of energy and create and rearrange matter on a planetary scale. He proved capable of obliterating an entire galaxy.)
Sounds more powerful than Coldcast to me.
Iron Man is not integral to the Avenger's victory (if a "biological EMP" would even affect him.) His armor does reflect EMP.
Flash's speedforce aura protects ONLY from physical attacks not energy, read the profile. Besides, he wouldn't access it, because Living Lightning starts out faster than him.
The JLA is outgunned, and that is that.
To Cosmic Cube :
Moon Dragon has incredible psychic powers. But she's human. The Flash, Superman, MM, Diana, or GL can utlize their superspeed to take her out. All of them are faster than thought. The Essence of the Beyonder? You never mentioned that. How many cosmic tools are you giving her?! She has the Shiar Mind Gem and The Dragon of Moon. That's it. What's next the Ultimate Nullifier?!
Iron Man has a brain with neurons. The Biological E.M.P. would affect him. His armor is designed to deflect low-level E.M.P. s for machines not living beings. Triumph can overwhelm his armor with a powerful E.M.P.
The Flash does not need to "access" the Speed Force. He's constantly connected to the speed force. His flippin suit is made of pure speed force energy. And yes he can absorb electricity. He's absorbed electrical attacks from Blacksmith, Wizard Wizard, and many other foes. He's often acted as lightening rod during twisters out in Central City. Living Lightening will not affect him.
The Avengers are outgunned and overpowered. They have too many powerful players. No offense, but you disappointed me with such a weak and paltry argument.
There you go again with the augmenting powers bs. Flash can vibrate through a TK shield? TK shield = Forcefield. Flash cannot vibrate through a TK shield. He can vibrate through solid matter. That's it. He can travel through TIME (and only through the speedforce dimension) by running at lightspeed, not vibrating. Flash could hit one person hundreds of times. Not millions. Who is to say he knows who to attack? If he attacked all of the Avengers, he would hit Moondragon (if he could) two or three times per second, max. Then he would fall to the ground, braindead.
Sersi IS an eternal, and is a 5th (highest) level matter/energy manipulator. Others have tried. Others have failed. Very weak arguement. Others aren't Sersi.
Hourman cannot move at Lightspeed. He knows about Living Lightning's attack. He isn't fast enough to evade. He goes down.
He got thrown into a sun and survived? Then Sersi turns him into a harmless alarm clock.
"Dr. Fate has no limitations." Dr. Fate has eons of experience." yadda, yadda... "One superspeed punch..."
Superman, Wonder Woman, The Flash, Martian Manhunter, and Green Lantern say, "Don't go for the big green monster, or the guy in the armor, or the blond haired muscular guy with the hammer: get the bald girl on the yoga mat!"
lol (Green lantern, like Wonder Man is capable of "interstellar flight" not lightspeed, remember? By the way, Shiar Mind Gem greatly enhances cognition speed. Just about to Flash's level. There goes your argument)
Don't dare accuse me of augmenting characters past their limits. You're the one who said that Firestar can travel at lightspeed and can turn into a being of pure microwaves. You're the one who said that Wonder Man can travel at light speed. You're the one who said that Moon Dragon has superhuman endurance and is an Eternal. And what happened? You've been proven WRONG again and again and again.
The Flash can move, think, and act at near-lightspeed at his normal levels. A hundred hits per second is a underestimation. A thousand to a million hits per second is more accurate. Moon Dragon is human. A couple hundred hits can do her in. The Flash can vibrate his way past energy barriers. He vibrated his way through Sinestro's forcefield, he vibrated his way through Grodd's forcefield, he vibrated his way through Darkseid's force field. The Flash can even vibrate his way into another dimension or even other universes. A TK shield isn't going to present a problem. The Flash will use a few nanoseconds at most (if he can go from Italy to Australia in a picosecond (JLA Secret Files #1) then he go through this) to hit every Leaguer he sees. When he gets to Moon Dragon (who hasn't even blinked yet) she's out like a light.
Hourman can turn intangible and invisible. He has a computer-brain that operates faster than light (JLA #17) Living Lightening isn't going to fry him.
Sersi will be one of the last to fall. Against so many powerhouses it's only inevitable.
Dr. Fate can be taken out with one superspeed punch? By who? Who's capable of a superspeed punch? Not to mention he's nearly invulnerable to begin with.
Green Lantern is not capable of lightspeed on Earth. However he can reach incredible speeds up to Mach 10 on Earth. Wonder Man is not capable of interstellar flight (again with the exaggeration) he can only fly at Mach 1 according to the Handbook.
The Shiar Mind Gem sure was useful when a Kree soldier shot her in the back with a lousy pistol during the Maximum Security Event. Faster reflexes than the Flash? Yeah right. Prove it.