Football (Soccer)

Originally posted by Ya Krunk'd Floo
Well, if he is wasteful, then everyone else is lacking in the ability to get into those positions in the first place, so they're bad too.

True, but many teams aren't aimed towards those individual efforts.

Lampard was the same in the WC, and he got criticised for it.

Originally posted by Krone
Better Centre Midfeilder than Essie - Xavi, Gerrard, Deco, Pirlo, Cambiasso and Maxi Rodriguez.

Better central defenders that Toure- Carrager, Cannavaro, Puyol, Nesta.

Deathblow basically answered- below- as I would have, except I wouldn't say the two mentioned are as good as Toure.

The midfielder list is silliness.

Originally posted by Deathblow
Cannavaro and Puyol are as good, not necessarily better than Toure. I think Carragher has always been criminally underrated, but he's really not in the same league as the other three.

Judging by his play this season, Essien is as good a player than all of those you mentioned (and certainly better than Cambiasso and Maxi), and both more versatile and consistent than any of them.

Originally posted by G.P
Well I'm creating a new football thread in order to continue a general discussion about the teams, the referees, all about this sport... without going off-topic in another thread...

Who thinks Beckham goin to fall on his face? I do. Have his wife add some weight. Galaxy should have signed headbutt man, he's way better. Beck up is a hasbeen 🙂

No one addressed Nesta. Do you think he's better than Toure? And what about Ferdinand? Is he out favour or simply not that good in your opinion?

Originally posted by Nellinator
No one addressed Nesta. Do you think he's better than Toure? And what about Ferdinand? Is he out favour or simply not that good in your opinion?

Nesta I have always found to be overrated, like more or less every Italian.

Ferdinand is world class when he feels like being world class.

It's close between him and Toure.

I've always thought that Ferdinand and Nesta are the two best centerbacks in the world with Toure and Cannavaro being in the world class level as well. I think Puyol is close to them too, but not in that same class. However, I don't get much football coverage in Canada so it's hard to comment on their consistency which I think is really important.

I've always thought of both Ronaldo and Gerrard as world class midfielders. As for strikers, it's hard to say whose world class, but Drogba (at least right now), Rooney and Henry are definitely top level in the English league. I haven't seen enough the other leagues to say, but Ibrahimovich impressed me at the World Cup.

Originally posted by Nellinator
However, I don't get much football coverage in Canada so it's hard to comment on their consistency which I think is really important.

Ibrahimovich hasnt been anything special, he had a good world cup but hes so overrated its scarey same with Adriano.

Originally posted by Krone
Ibrahimovich hasnt been anything special, he had a good world cup but hes so overrated its scarey same with Adriano.

Agreed, though I'd add Gerrard and Rooney.

Gerrard of the 'one-man CL final victory- AKA do little and dive for a late penalty.

Rooney is possibly the most overrated player in history.

Oh, and while we're (I'm) on the subject of overrated English players- John Terry. Dooms England to sit back and get pounded due to his lack of pace, and England's lack of Makelele.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Agreed, though I'd add Gerrard and Rooney.

Gerrard of the 'one-man CL final victory- AKA do little and dive for a late penalty.

Rooney is possibly the most overrated player in history.

Oh, and while we're (I'm) on the subject of overrated English players- John Terry. Dooms England to sit back and get pounded due to his lack of pace, and England's lack of Makelele.

Okay agree with you about Terry and Rooney, but Gerrard didnt dive for that penalty. I hate the way people say Gerrard one us that cup, he didnt if anyone did it was Dida Hamman, Jamie Carrager and of course Dudek.

Back on overrate, you cant forget Frank Lampard scores a deflection and the media are so far up his arse they can't see its a deflection and/or against i poor team.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Agreed, though I'd add Gerrard and Rooney.

Gerrard of the 'one-man CL final victory- AKA do little and dive for a late penalty.

Rooney is possibly the most overrated player in history.

Oh, and while we're (I'm) on the subject of overrated English players- John Terry. Dooms England to sit back and get pounded due to his lack of pace, and England's lack of Makelele.

So do actually think Gerrard is not world class or do you just think he is overrated? I like him simply because he is such a complete player and being a hockey player and fan that has a lot of weight with me.

I think Rooney is world class, but when he has a poor game he can be really poor same with Gerrard the only reason i havent called him World Class is because people will end up calling for my head, calling me bias because im a Liverpool Fan.

Okay quick question how can you call a Goal Keeper World Class? I mean personally i'd say Cech is but he also has a World Class defence infront of him same with alot of other apparent 'World Class' Keepers

Originally posted by Krone
Gerrard didnt dive for that penalty.

Oh whatever. Go on YouTube and watch the video, he doesn't get touched in any way that merits such a fall. Ever.

Originally posted by Krone
Back on overrate, you cant forget Frank Lampard scores a deflection and the media are so far up his arse they can't see its a deflection and/or against i poor team.

The fact is, Frank Lampard always does more than Gerrard. People just think they have to say Gerrard because they're told to.

If anything the media are more up Gerrard's ass. Lampard misses a penalty and it's "Fat Frank". Gerrard puts 20 shots wide or over the bar; "He's not playing in the right position, he's got too much to do.".

-AC

Well. That England Spain game was ridiculously dull. Suprised I managed to sit all the way through it. With the exceptions of Woodgate for England and Villa and Iniesta for Spain, there wasn't a single player on that pitch who caught the eye, at all. Wright-Phillips made a bright start but faded after about 10 minutes, Carrick was awful and I was really disappointed with the lack of creative energy from Xavi and co in Spain's midfield. Why Fabregas remains only a bit-player continues to confuse me. Not that he was particularly good when he finally came on, it's just they need to start shaping a midfield with him in it, as he's going to be their best player in three or four years time.

Originally posted by Nellinator

So do actually think Gerrard is not world class or do you just think he is overrated? I like him simply because he is such a complete player and being a hockey player and fan that has a lot of weight with me.

He's good. Best on the right though, despite what people seem to think (they have to say). He's too undisciplined for centre midfield.

Originally posted by Deathblow
Well. That England Spain game was ridiculously dull. Suprised I managed to sit all the way through it. With the exceptions of Woodgate for England and Villa and Iniesta for Spain, there wasn't a single player on that pitch who caught the eye, at all. Wright-Phillips made a bright start but faded after about 10 minutes, Carrick was awful and I was really disappointed with the lack of creative energy from Xavi and co in Spain's midfield. Why Fabregas remains only a bit-player continues to confuse me. Not that he was particularly good when he finally came on, it's just they need to start shaping a midfield with him in it, as he's going to be their best player in three or four years time.

If not now.

Dyer was pretty good.

You have to love what Gary Lineker said post-final whistle:

"We all keep wanting to sit here a glow over a fine England performance...but not yet. Another poor performance?".

When will the penny finally drop? England are a shit team. Alan Shearer sits there saying "We haven't got Rooney.". You had Rooney in the World Cup, you've had Rooney all along. Just accept the team is honestly going to win f*ck all in the forseeable future unless drastic, and I do mean drastic, changes are made.

-AC

you just need a good coach, you ahve good enough players.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
He's good. Best on the right though, despite what people seem to think (they have to say). He's too undisciplined for centre midfield.

If not now.

Dyer was pretty good.

Gerrard---Hargreaves (holding midfielder starting?)----Lampard---Cole?

Where do Lennon, Walcot and Wright Phillips fit in if Gerrard is on the left side? Do you think Dyer deserves a starting job in the English midfield?

I think the World Cup could have been different if Owen hadn't gone down, Rooney is not good as the forward striker, he does better when he's back a bit further in support.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Oh whatever. Go on YouTube and watch the video, he doesn't get touched in any way that merits such a fall. Ever.

The fact is, Frank Lampard always does more than Gerrard. People just think they have to say Gerrard because they're told to.

If anything the media are more up Gerrard's ass. Lampard misses a penalty and it's "Fat Frank". Gerrard puts 20 shots wide or over the bar; "He's not playing in the right position, he's got too much to do.".

-AC

I have watched it again, Gattuso is pulling away and if you look closely He clips his left foot thats what takes him down, in my books if contact is made you can go down, Admitetly theirs a chance he could of kept going but their is clear contact.

Ok Lampard doesnt always dod More than Gerrard, The World Cup is a perfect example of that. When comparing the two (as Hansen said last night) Lampard Scores about 18, or whatever, but he has about 4000 shots off target.

Ideal Midfield would be Gerrard and Lampard in the middle learning to play in the middle together! World Class Players should be able to change their style of play to suit football at anylevel.

Or-

Joe Cole Lampard Gerrard

Hargreaves

Oh, it's all so boring.

Originally posted by Phat J
you just need a good coach, you ahve good enough players.

No I don't.

Originally posted by Krone
I have watched it again, Gattuso is pulling away and if you look closely He clips his left foot thats what takes him down, in my books if contact is made you can go down, Admitetly theirs a chance he could of kept going but their is clear contact.

Oh bullshit.

Gattuso touches his shoulder, he doesn't clip is foot in any way that makes him fall in the way he does and you know it. He goes down like he's just had a baseball bat swung at the back of his legs. He dived, and the video proves it.

Also, you say "In my books if contact is made you can go down.". Yes, you CAN, and the ref may give it, but you shouldn't, and doing so makes you a cheater.

http://www.youtube.com/v/CllT_iZEblE

Never in a million years is that not a dive, never in a million years was there any contact that even warranted such a dive. Gattuso extends the leg, Gerrard steps over it.

Originally posted by Krone
Ok Lampard doesnt always dod More than Gerrard, The World Cup is a perfect example of that. When comparing the two (as Hansen said last night) Lampard Scores about 18, or whatever, but he has about 4000 shots off target.

How many does Gerrard score comparitively?

No, no. Don't reply with "But he has less shots off target.". How many does he score comparitively? More? As many? Less? Less? Yes, less. The man is Less Dennis.

Originally posted by Krone
Ideal Midfield would be Gerrard and Lampard in the middle learning to play in the middle together! World Class Players should be able to change their style of play to suit football at anylevel.

...and yet, they are continually called world class. So there's a problem somewhere isn't there?

I propose a radical idea; Gerrard isn't actually world class, people wish he was, so they say he is, but he doesn't actually prove he is besides the odd game for Liverpool in which he is given credit for scoring a goal or two or for the intangible act of boosting the spirits (Which people just assume he does). Even the goals he does score are either hit and hopes, or opportunities that any player with a hard and powerful shot should score.

His goal against West Ham was nothing more than a "I'll have a crack and hope for the best.". It wasn't like (To prove I'm not being biased) the goal Ryan Giggs scored against Arsenal when he beat about 5 men, including Lee Dixon twice, and scored, or the goal Van Persie scored against Blackburn.

Lampard is more productive, and results and statistics show it. If you're going to be good at coming up from midfield and whacking in a goal now and then, or at least rated for that, then you should be good at it.

He's the midfield Beckham, just more productive and actually better.

-AC