That's true docb77. But you act as if you CARE about the happiness of minorities. You only see things YOUR way, i find it hard to beleive that you care more about the general happiness of people who think unlike you do, then your own traditional values.
I do think you are a GOOD person....but i think you FAIL to see something.....your traditional values seem to matter MORE to you than ruining the happiness of certain people (ie, ur stance on gay marriage)
The most successful people find ways to be happy no matter what their situation. I do disagree with things that I think are wrong. That doesn't mean that I don't hope that people who do things I disagree with can find happiness.
I suppose it's a matter of priorities like you say. I do put right and wrong above happiness. I put Duty, Honesty, Loyalty, in a word integrity above most things. It's like Shakespeare said, "to thine own self be true" I believe that true joy comes from doing good. even when things you want are out of reach, you can still be happy.
Reasonable argument, i cannot totally counter you there.
"To thine own self be true"
Yes, i like this quote very much. IT just proves my point even more though.....everyone is different, therefore every1s goals and dreams are diffrent
I would never ask you to change ur life just because i dont agree with it.
If right and wrong matter to you more, than so be it. Do what you must. However for me its a matter of happiness vs misery
No1 deserves misery
Here's what I find really funny about religion.
Let's say you have a friend, If you suggest he see some movie, he can take your advice or ignore it and still be your friend. Neither person is offended by either the offer or the refusal to accept it.
But if we substitute religion instead of the movie... hell breaks loose. All the sudden its how dare you suggest I change religions. I know it's more personal, but why can't people stay rational about it in the same way as with the movie thing.
I think my church would help anyone who would look into it. If you don't want to look into it, then fine. But you shouldn't take it personal that I made the suggestion.
Honestly, no one gives two cents about someones opinon of a movie or meaningless stuff like that, but religon is a strong personal issue. I've never said <<everyone should be athiest>> People trying to convert me is one of the MOST annoying things about religion. I'm happy who I am, its not your place to tell me your opinoin about what I should be. You stick your opinon out even if its not asked for. It makes people angry.
Its like telling someone that they're the wrong race. <<Yeah, you should really be white>>
Its just not somehting you should try to change about people. its seen as an attack on their being. Saying you have a different opinon about a movie is one thing. Religion is like race, its a VERY sensitve topic. Maybe its you who needs to be more sensitive to it? (I mean that in the nicest of ways)
No really, if someone really believes that everyone who's not in their religion is going to hell. Shouldn't you almost be offended if they don't try to convert you.
Example: I'm mormon. I have a friend who was Southern baptist. If you know anything at all about those 2 religions, you know that on the surface we shouldn't have been able to get along. We've talked religion and while he thinks I'll end up in hell and I think he'll end up in the terrestrial kingdom. We still get along fine. We'll see who was right when we die.
Now if neither of us had broached the subject wouldn't that indicate a lack of friendship rather than just a courtesy to the other guy?
Originally posted by docb77
Shouldn't you almost be offended if they don't try to convert you.
No. its incessantly annoying. Religion is a personal issue. Keep it in your pants where it belongs. It doesn't matter if you think they are going to hell or not. They don't they are entitled to thier opinon. Let them run their own life. If they are so much your friend, you should let them make up their own mind. They will go to their heavan and you to yours. Thats all you can want.
If you do more, I feel you are absolutely disrespecting them.
Docb77 it's okay to tell someone your point of view.
But you also have to consider their point of view is all.
You may beleive that you are totally right, but you have to realize that the person you are arguing with also thinks he's right.
If a person you know already heard you out, and no longer wants you to try and "convert" them, then you should respect thier wishes and leave it be.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Docb77 it's okay to tell someone your point of view.But you also have to consider their point of view is all.
You may beleive that you are totally right, but you have to realize that the person you are arguing with also thinks he's right.
If a person you know already heard you out, and no longer wants you to try and "convert" them, then you should respect thier wishes and leave it be.
I agree with that. It's when people are touchy about hearing other peoples beliefs the first time that I don't get.
I understand your confusion Docb77, and take flattery in the fact that you are one of the FEW Christians here who i thnk is open minded and reasonable.
Look at this way:
A Gay person already struggles with discrimination every day from people at school, work, and possibly his or her own family members.
The Gay person finally has the guts to tell people that he's gay.
He finally has the balls to try and make a relationship work.
He falls in LOVE
He wants to get Married to his lover.
He can't. Because it goes against Biblical and Traditional ideals
You tell them that they are sinners and that they don't have the right to marry each other.
What do you expect ?
Originally posted by docb77
No really, if someone really believes that everyone who's not in their religion is going to hell. Shouldn't you almost be offended if they don't try to convert you.
Originally posted by Storm
Conversion efforts can be accompanied with a lack of respect for other' s beliefs, leading to harassment. It' s not surprising that people may want to share their religious beliefs with others (as religion can be a very important part of many people' s lives), but sharing shouldn' t cross over the line into active proselytization.
Believers are welcome to ask questions which will make one think, they are also welcome to ask questions about what one thinks and the doubts you have. But they are not given the license to be disrespectful to what one believes or to act as if one were some sort of target for evangelization.
That's cool. I completely agree there. Everyone deserves respect, whether we think they're wrong or not.