The Punisher vs Dr.Doom

Originally posted by Beyonder
Okay right. The same garbage as Doom being only Class 2. Yeah, useless mind trick yet save Doom's life from the Beyonder.

Well, he IS only Class 2. And he has no feats to suggest otherwise. And if the Ovid Mind Trick can only be used when Doom is on the bring of dying and his body is useless, then it's pretty damn useless. It just adds to his rep for being the Chief Leech of the Universe.

[quote]
Begging? See now your just b.s.ing things. Doom never begs. Asking or demanding sure but not begging. Doom saved his mothers soul and outwitted Mephisto.

🙄 He knew he couldn't save his mother on his own...he didn't outwit Mephisto, he got Strange to come do it for him. Without Strange, Doom spent year after year with INFINITE prep trying to save his mother, and he got owned by minor demons of Mephisto every time. It took Strange...a REAL magician to do in one try what Doom could not year after year. Doom gets NO credit for that.

[quote]
And the same could be said of Magneto. Except between Doom and Magneto, Doom has beaten these beings. Magneto would rush in spouting homo superior messages and get stomped.

Doom hasn't beaten these beings...he stole their power. They weren't fights. Doom is a cosmic-scale leech, but not a fighter. That's my point. Stealing powers from people who don't acknolwedge your existence and thus won't fight you isn't impressive. Make these characters angry and have them come after Doom, then we'll see how he responds. Something tells me that "running" and "screaming" would be part of his brilliant strategy.

What's wrong with hell?

😱

So he died, what about it?

😱 :laughing:

That takes away from his many other accomplishments?

Look at it this way. He started his Marvel career as ruler of Latveria. He ended it dead with his worst enemies controlling his beloved country. He apparently did himself more harm than good considering he ended up with less than he started out with.

How does that help? Are you refering to when Magneto used the Earth's polarity to give Rachael a stroke?

It was Jean, and no, I'm referring to when Magneto kidnapped the X-men, brought them under a volcano and proceeded to beat the Hell out of them...including Jean/Phoenix.

For the rest of eternity? Please, it ain't for eternity.

Luckily for Doom, he's a comic character.

And no, dying and having demons drag you into hell isn't as bad as becoming drooling vegetable while your citadel gets destroyed and a former X-Men drags you to safety.

I can't possibly see how you'd believe that, especially when Magneto willed himself back to a completely normal state, more powerful than before...and ended up with his own country in the process.

Except you said "when he left his personal powers, he gets crushed by the likes of Luke Cage." So which is it?

What I meant by that was without leeching off anybody's godly powers, with just his suit and all the powers inside the suit, he got owned by Luke Cage.

Sort of like him taking over counter Earth huh.

Wow. Barren self-destroying wasteland. there was nothing to take over...he just came in and said, "I'm in control! Yaaay!". *I* could have made that declaration. Where's the feat there?

Or owning his own country and having a voice in the U.N.

Magneto did it with Genosha - owned his own country, had a voice in the UN. So what?

Having Thanos taking notice of him.

lol...some feat! Someone else noticed him!!!

Um, yeah there's something called prep. Heck this thread has him fighting the Punisher and you come in here flaming about how Doom's overrated and that he has few battle feats.

Which is true. Doom is overrated. You came here and turned it into another Doom vs. Magneto thread.

Then you follow up with this:
🙄That said, he destroys Punisher with extreme prejudice. *shrug*🙄

You "shrugged" at the idea that Doom would beat Punisher with extreme prejudice? And please don't try to say it's because of the "extreme prejuidice" part. Truth is, it sickens you that you can't say Punisher would beat Doom.

Maybe you get emotional about that stuff, but I don't, lol. I just call it like it is...Doom beats Punisher. I think Doom could beat Spider-Man too, or Captain America. Daredevil, even. I wouldn't go much further than that, though without going into power leech mode.

OMG. And that helps every here how? Be more detailed please.

Magneto restructured the entire planet so that he's in control. Doom, Strange, Apocalypse, etc. are all powerless lackeys.

Mr. Mutant terrorist runs about ranting on and on about Homo Superiors. He can't take anybodies powers even if he wanted to.

Magneto could easily destroy the planet if he wants to...that's not his aim. He could easily boost his powers if he wants to, but his goal isn't about becoming a god, it's about mutant rights, so it's not even something he ever considered. So you couldn't possibly say he can't take anybodies powers even if he wanted to.

Wolverine wasn't on the team that was resurrected by Warlock. Wolverine was just the first wave to be sacrificed. Warlock had Strange bring back Doom.

Magneto wasn't in any wave....he just didn't participate. Neither did lots of extremely powerful heroes and villains. Blame the writers, don't try to make it out to be some conscious decision by the characters to exclude Magneto. That's silly.

And again, when has Magneto shown up for a big event? He's mostly a no show. Thanos would laugh at Magneto, not bother with him.

He was there for Secret Wars I and II, he CAUSED Onslaught, he IS House of M. He not only participated in all the big events, he was the instrumental force BEHIND a number of them. What big crossovers has Doom engineered?

is this doom vs magneto ?

Are we forgetting Dr. Doom took over the world like three times and gave it back?

I think a few guns wouldnt make a difference.

Dr. Doom obliterates Punisher with his heat rays and instant death rays.

And if were talking Magneto, Dr. Doom has anti-magnetized metal, thats what his armor is made out of. Im sure he can make some machines like that too that Magneto would run from because he cant do crap to them.

Is this still going on??

Iron Man has anti-magnetized metal too. Fat lot of good that did against Magneto, who just switched up frequencies until IM couldn't keep up. Fat lot of good that did against ceramic sentinels too, who weren't even made out of metal, but couldn't save themselves from Magneto controlling the circuitry inside. Remember, Mags controls electricity too. Unless Doom powers his suit with something other than electricity (he doesn't), he's still vulnerable.

But you guys are right, this is Punisher vs. Doom. So I won't mention any more on the Magneto/Doom subject.

none of us know what Doom's present armor is powered by.

Yes we do. mini-nuke reactor, standard circuitry. That's what his own one shot says.

his own shot? u mean thats what a directory from the eighties says. Doom's armor has changed a lot since then...the true Doom... FF#350

Nah, someone on here posted a long time ago technical information from a Marvel Science Guide that specialized in Doom's tech, and it explained the whole thing. I think it was dated in the 1990s.

no it wasnt. It was from the old directory. And FF#350 disproved just about everything we assumed about Doom before then.

Regardless, why are people only exploring the ways Punisher could potentially harm Doom, why not consider the ways Doom could harm Castle? Isnt Castle clearly, vastly more vulnerable than Doom? And why assume Castle would some how get ahead of Doom in strategy? Punisher out strategizes crooks and thugs on the street...Doom outsmarts the Surfer, Watcher, Galactus, and the Beyonder...anything Castle can throw at him, Im sure Doom has already planned for contingency like he says, ie FF#375.

Originally posted by demigawd
[B]🙄 He knew he couldn't save his mother on his own...he didn't outwit Mephisto, he got Strange to come do it for him. Without Strange, Doom spent year after year with INFINITE prep trying to save his mother, and he got owned by minor demons of Mephisto every time. It took Strange...a REAL magician to do in one try what Doom could not year after year. Doom gets NO credit for that.

😂 His whole plan was to betray Strange in the end. He did so which caused his mother not to love him anymore after the betrayal. After that change of heart by his mother, though Doom lost his mother's love - her soul was set free from Mephisto's grip. Doom and Strange escape. Doom won that one. Strange was dooped the whole time.

Doom hasn't beaten these beings...he stole their power. They weren't fights. Doom is a cosmic-scale leech, but not a fighter. That's my point. Stealing powers from people who don't acknolwedge your existence and thus won't fight you isn't impressive. Make these characters angry and have them come after Doom, then we'll see how he responds. Something tells me that "running" and "screaming" would be part of his brilliant strategy.

He stole Galactus' powers to fight the Beyonder. They fought, he then stole the Beyonder's powers and left Beyonder weakened. Stole Galactus powers and Odin had to show up to stop Doom.

Look at it this way. He started his Marvel career as ruler of Latveria. He ended it dead with his worst enemies controlling his beloved country. He apparently did himself more harm than good considering he ended up with less than he started out with.

But he accomplished all that by himself. He wasn't born into royalty nor with powers. His suit and everything is by him. I'm not talking about what appearance here. Throughout the course of their lives Doom earned everything.

It was Jean, and no, I'm referring to when Magneto kidnapped the X-men, brought them under a volcano and proceeded to beat the Hell out of them...including Jean/Phoenix.

And you said Magneto withstood an attack right? We both know Phoenix is capable of wiping out Magneto. Magneto beating the hell out of the Phoenix ain't the same Phoenix that battled Galactus. If your going to argue that it is to show Magneto beat the Phoenix Galactus didn't, then you've got to be kidding me. Cause than you'd have Magneto > Phoenix > Galactus.

Luckily for Doom, he's a comic character.

And too true of Magneto. Who came back to life as well.

I can't possibly see how you'd believe that, especially when Magneto willed himself back to a completely normal state, more powerful than before...and ended up with his own country in the process.

And when those Sentinels attacked and leveled Genosha, where was his country then?

Wow. Barren self-destroying wasteland. there was nothing to take over...he just came in and said, "I'm in control! Yaaay!". *I* could have made that declaration. Where's the feat there?

Barren wasteland? The Heroes Reborn Universe wasn't barren was it? Hell, it had it's own S.H.I.E.L.D,Inhumans, etc.

Magneto did it with Genosha - owned his own country, had a voice in the UN. So what?

And how long did he get to keep it?

lol...some feat! Someone else noticed him!!!

Someone named Thanos...The Mad Titan...Champion of Mistress Death...Former Wielder of the IG & GOD of the Universe...Former Wielder of HOTU & GOD of the Multiverse.

Magneto's been acknowledge by who...? Apocalypse? The jobber of the X-Men...The Much Hyped Nobody Villain? And no, Apocalypse isn't Thanos lite.

Which is true. Doom is overrated. You came here and turned it into another Doom vs. Magneto thread.

You insulted Doom being overrated when his match is with the Punisher. Later you insulted Doom again and brought up Magneto. Don't blame anybody but yourself.

Maybe you get emotional about that stuff, but I don't, lol. I just call it like it is...Doom beats Punisher. I think Doom could beat Spider-Man too, or Captain America. Daredevil, even. I wouldn't go much further than that, though without going into power leech mode.

Then why *shrug*? You came in here blasting Doom and you say you don't get emotional?

Magneto restructured the entire planet so that he's in control. Doom, Strange, Apocalypse, etc. are all powerless lackeys.

Like Doom hasn't conquered the world. One accomplishment and Magneto's all that? SW I: killed Kang, took control of Ultron & the villains, broke into Galactus' World ship & defenses, stole Galactus' powers, fought Beyonder & stole his power, controlled that world as well, killed the heroes including Magneto. The were only brought back by Beyonder's trickery.

Make's Magneto's feat look like small potatoes.

Magneto could easily destroy the planet if he wants to...that's not his aim. He could easily boost his powers if he wants to, but his goal isn't about becoming a god, it's about mutant rights, so it's not even something he ever considered. So you couldn't possibly say he can't take anybodies powers even if he wanted to.

Now he can destroy the planet. 😂 His goal is for his race to rule. With more power, he can take control of things easier. Don't tell me Magneto is the diplomatic type, he's mostly attain his goals through fighting. He ain't Xavier.

Magneto wasn't in any wave....he just didn't participate. Neither did lots of extremely powerful heroes and villains. Blame the writers, don't try to make it out to be some conscious decision by the characters to exclude Magneto. That's silly.

If any villain would join in, it'd be Magneto. He's a reasonable person for the most part. A mad man like Thanos aiming to kill most of the universe including innocent mutants isn't exactly something he'd ignore.

He was there for Secret Wars I and II, he CAUSED Onslaught, he IS House of M. He not only participated in all the big events, he was the instrumental force BEHIND a number of them. What big crossovers has Doom engineered?

He was there to follow Captain America's orders. He didn't cause Onslaught. You make it sound like he planned the whole thing - as if becoming a vegetable and helping spawn a psycho like Onslaught was all part of his brillant planning. He wasn't even there for the Onslaught Saga, heck Xavier was the host. Doom was involved however. Then he later conquered the Heroes Reborn Universe.

House of M? One event and Magneto's all that? Where was Magneto during IG, IW, The End? Cosmic scaled events that affects Earth and all of existence? Doom 2099 anyone?

Doom isn't overrated.

People just don't like the fact that he's actually as good as intelligent comic fans say he is. That's all there is to it.

Morons on this board overrating people doesn't actually mean that we all are. I've never overrated Doom a single bit, nor has any other established poster on this board from what I've seen (and I've seen quite a bit).

You only went 20 pages with me because you kept weaseling out of things but bringing precise science into the fray.

In closing, Doom is overrated? I think you better take a look at Punisher, Rogue, Storm, Gambit and all the other people who have been viewed as challengers for Dr. Doom.

If anything Doom is getting underrated purposefully because you can't handle the fact that he's the man.

-AC

Wow!!! This thread went 6 pages? What the--

Doctor Doom will win trust me on this.

Doctor Doom is one of the most overrated characters in these boards as a fighter, that is a fact. He is a cool character, but he has never been as good as a fighter as too much people in these boards are trying to post.

Originally posted by bakerboy
Doctor Doom is one of the most overrated characters in these boards as a fighter, that is a fact. He is a cool character, but he has never been as good as a fighter as too much people in these boards are trying to post.

Fighting wise, he's nothing special, and don't give me the "The man fought a freaking lion !" So ? Nothing special in comic land lol.

Now, when we are talking about Power, then Doom is a force to be reckoned with. Punisher can not handle Doom. Easy as pie.

But Doom isn't always as clever or cunning as people seem to think. Just like anybody else, he makes mistakes, mostly the same ones : he overestimates himself and underestimates his opponent.

Originally posted by who?-kid
I kinda agree... a bit lol.

Fighting wise, he's nothing special, and don't give me the "The man fought a freaking lion !" So ? Nothing special in comic land lol.

Now, when we are talking about Power, then Doom is a force to be reckoned with. Punisher can not handle Doom. Easy as pie.

But Doom isn't always as clever or cunning as people seem to think. Just like anybody else, he makes mistakes, mostly the same ones : he overestimates himself and underestimates his opponent.

Well he underestimates his opponents when it's someone like Richards but I don't think he'd be overestimating himself if he thought, "Frank Castle you are an insignificant gnat and DOOM shall destroy you!" 😂

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Well he underestimates his opponents when it's someone like Richards

but I don't think he'd be overestimating himself if he thought, "Frank Castle you are an insignificant gnat and DOOM shall destroy you!" 😂

I don't want to sound like a third rate fortune cookie, but a true warrior and wise man doesn't underestimate a living soul. And not trying to make a God of War of Punisher, but he can be quite dangerous and unpredictable when he wants to be.

If Doom really is stupid enough to mock Punisher and turn his back to him, he could be very well be making himself a new armor the next day. Because the old one will have a few dents in it (thanks to Punishers trusty rocket launcher 🙂 )

Realistically though. It's The Punisher Vs Dr. Doom.

There's one outcome and one outcome only. Love, like, dislike or hate. Doom wins this fight.

I'm a huge fan of The Punisher. He's one of my very top characters story-wise. I just don't see what the point is of coming in and saying "But if Punisher did this....".

No, he's not winning.

-AC

😂 I was just kidding.
Besides:
Fanboy Doom = has contingency plan for everything and wrestles lions for fun
Fanboy Batman = stops all with his mighty martial arts and bottomless utility belt
Fanboy Spidey = dodges everything and anything that gets thrown at him
Fanboy Wolvie = can regenerate from a single molecule of DNA unaided in a matter of minutes
😄

Which of the above is proven to be more true?

Yeah.

-AC