Dr. Manhattan vs Silver Surfer.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Lol, I've provided scans negating your arguments. You've done nothing. He states he has no control of the past as evidenced when every divergent reality earth was destroyed. He's not godlike in any aspect because he needed Voidts help to create a machine that could create clean energy.

If he was MULTIVERSAL, he could have simply created the machine out of thin air. He's not omniscient because he said so himself and couldn't predict Voidt was going to nuke the place PRIOR to the tacyon field being created. He was only shown to produce three dupes not millions. The largest threat he neutralized was a tank.

It was stated he could only stop 60% of the payload lauched if nuclear war started. So out of 10000 missles he could only stop 6000 from reaching the destination so not ftl reaction time. He had to "wait" and see the outcome of the life he created whilst norrin evolved life on a planet sized scale for billions of years in moments....etc etc. Plus u still have yet to provide any proof he's above low herald.

All that is good and well iyo, but you still can't prove Surfer can kill him, after I knocked down your original arguments on how he could possibly kill him, you fled.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
All that is good and well iyo, but you still can't prove Surfer can kill him, after I knocked down your original arguments on how he could possibly kill him, you fled.

Oh that, other posters answered that i didn't want to beat a dead horse. He never showed telepathy so it's a safe assumption its not within his powerset. Easy win there. He never showed transmutation, another easy win. He was dispersed rather easily by voidt, surfer has extreme durability and wouldn't have been destroyed albeit temporarily that easily. When he had precog he could only determine his future. Noone else's whereas the cosmic awareness surfer has trumps that. His time travel was limited to his own creation. Norrin doesn't have such limitations. He has no autoshields, no ftl reaction feats, his superhuman strength feat could be done by Spiderman, no elite herald level durability, no elite herald energy projection, no evidence of teleportation of mass amounts since he couldn't prevent missiles from reaching their destination.

When you make a claim that a character is a MULTIVERSAL abstract there needs to be a basis. You've provided zilch. Would a MULTIVERSAL abstract work at all hours of the night on a machine to create clean energy based on a human albeit a smart humans theories? I say thee nay.

U said he can't be destroyed. Surfer could lock him in his board. He could drain him of his energy, there's a laundry list of things he could do. Astral projection stomp, transmutation stomp, energy manip stomp, deevolve stomp, physically beat his ass etc.

Come on like make this challenging, you debating for a character whose biggest threats was bullets and tanks against a character who manipulated the crunch. Get your life boo

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Oh that, other posters answered that i didn't want to beat a dead horse. He never showed telepathy so it's a safe assumption its not within his powerset. Easy win there. He never showed transmutation, another easy win. He was dispersed rather easily by voidt, surfer has extreme durability and wouldn't have been destroyed albeit temporarily that easily. When he had precog he could only determine his future. Noone else's whereas the cosmic awareness surfer has trumps that. His time travel was limited to his own creation. Norrin doesn't have such limitations. He has no autoshields, no ftl reaction feats, his superhuman strength feat could be done by Spiderman, no elite herald level durability, no elite herald energy projection, no evidence of teleportation of mass amounts since he couldn't prevent missiles from reaching their destination.

When you make a claim that a character is a MULTIVERSAL abstract there needs to be a basis. You've provided zilch. Would a MULTIVERSAL abstract work at all hours of the night on a machine to create clean energy based on a human albeit a smart humans theories? I say thee nay.

U said he can't be destroyed. Surfer could lock him in his board. He could drain him of his energy, there's a laundry list of things he could do. Astral projection stomp, transmutation stomp, energy manip stomp, deevolve stomp, physically beat his ass etc.

Come on like make this challenging, you debating for a character whose biggest threats was bullets and tanks against a character who manipulated the crunch. Get your life boo

He cannot lock him in his board because his body is not contain his conscious, he can exist without his body.

He cannot physically beat his ass, because his body is intangible and there is nothing to hit, and even if he does hit his projection, its just a projection.

Astral projection stomp again wont work on abstract.

Trasmute is avatar into what? He will just reform..

Its a stalemate boo.

IIRC even beyonder created a machine that held some of his power. So whats the big deal that Manhattan did it?

How else was Manhattan supposed to create something for human use that humans could not use? He was making a machine that replicated his power that humans could adapt too and use.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
He cannot lock him in his board because his body is not contain his conscious, he can exist without his body.

He cannot physically beat his ass, because his body is intangible and there is nothing to hit, and even if he does hit his projection, its just a projection.

Astral projection stomp again wont work on abstract.

Trasmute is avatar into what? He will just reform..

Its a stalemate boo.

Prove he's multiversal.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Prove he's multiversal.

Because the quantum field exists in all universes correct? He accessed multi times lines and once and was interacting with multiple timelines as well. I never stated he had mulitversal power such as LT. Just that he was able to access it.

Am i high? I know ive been drinking but U explicitly stated multiversal abstract. Show me.

Bwahahahaijsijsijslmao

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Bwahahahaijsijsijslmao

I really enjoyed the part where you didn't provide anything. Priceless

This may be the most fun DM/SS thread i've ever read, even counting all the fluff posts.
Good reasoning, scans, theories. Dang!

Originally posted by riv6672
This may be the most fun DM/SS thread i've ever read, even counting all the fluff posts.
Good reasoning, scans, theories. Dang!

Meh you're being generous. Manhattan supporters offered nothing

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Meh you're being generous. Manhattan supporters offered nothing

Originally posted by Sin I AM
I really enjoyed the part where you didn't provide anything. Priceless

😆

Originally posted by Time Immemorial

'United timeline'
'I must give up all of my choices so that they can make of this reality what they wish'.

So...no.

Quick question: what is, in your understanding, a soul?

Now thats not an easy one to answer.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Ok,

Telepathy and do what? He does not have a physical brain, its a conscious made up of quantum particles.

Energy absorption, ok he absorbes his energy and he just makes more.

Bfr, well they both can BFR, however DM casually teleports people objects and himself at will, I don't know of to many teleporting feats for surfer.

Soul? IIRC a abstract conscious has no soul.

His board? His avatar is only a projection of his quantum field. He is not bound by his body, that is why when it was destroyed he existed without it.

A consciousness can be affected by telepathy. Have you proof that you need a physical brain to be affected by it? If so, please provide it (and don't just turn around and say nyargh, YOU provide it)

He can just make more energy ad infinitum? Proof?

What if Surfer sends him to a realm outside of his knowledge (Mephisto's realm etc)? Just because I can drive, does not mean that you can drop me anywhere in the world and I can navigate back.

Proof that an abstract consciousness has no soul? Because it sounds suspiciously like a soul.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
A consciousness can be affected by telepathy. Have you proof that you need a physical brain to be affected by it? If so, please provide it (and don't just turn around and say nyargh, YOU provide it)

Time might be off his rocker 😛