Originally posted by Red Nemesis
The copyright date in RotS (novelization) is '05. These comments came from August, and the Novel came out before then. They were either ignorant or stubborn, neither of which is complimentary to their reputation.
Actually, when you take into consideration that Kun can conceivably just spam his energy blasts and we have no way to know if Yoda or Anakin can attempt to block them, this makes more sense. Anakin especially would have to work harder than Yoda to avoid those attacks.
Now if you removed the amulet, the match goes more in Yoda's favor.
Does that help any?
Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Greatest Foe the Darkness had ever known, anyone? [/B]
Limited third person narrator, anybody?
That Yoda, going by his own knowledge, was the greatest foe the darkness had ever known, doesn't mean that he really was. And even if that should be the case, it doesn't automatically put him above a Sith Lord. Even less a Sith Lord equipped with deadly Sith amulets capable of blasting through stone-walls and "more knowledge than he could ever use".
Can Kun take this fight? He will definetly go down in a lightsaber duel. In an all out fight he might simply blast his opponents away and the same in a force fight. Although I doubt that he will survive either, going by the fact that his second opponent could still launch a force attack against him, while he blasts the first - and Yoda might even be able to dodge the beams.
Originally posted by Janus MariusI wish I could disagree, but I've actually argued this exact position before. I can't switch sides now.
Actually, when you take into consideration that Kun can conceivably just spam his energy blasts and we have no way to know if Yoda or Anakin can attempt to block them, this makes more sense. Anakin especially would have to work harder than Yoda to avoid those attacks.
Originally posted by Janus Marius
Now if you removed the amulet, the match goes more in Yoda's favor.Does that help any?
Yes. Yes it does.
Originally posted by Borbarad
Limited third person narrator, anybody?
See how easy that was? What makes you think that the narrator was limited?
Originally posted by BorbaradCan Kun take this fight? He will definetly go down in a lightsaber duel. In an all out fight he might simply blast his opponents away and the same in a force fight. Although I doubt that he will survive either, going by the fact that his second opponent could still launch a force attack against him, while he blasts the first - and Yoda might even be able to dodge the beams.
Agreed about the lightsaber duel, and even the force fight. I just don't see Yoda losing all out.
Originally posted by Janus Marius
He could conceivably kill both with the amulet in one way. He was quite mobile using it the first time, not stationary, and he could easily throw Jedi Knights around like ragdolls using the Force anyways.
By jedi knights, do you mean Crado? Sylvar? Anybody worth a damn or anybody on Yoda or Vader's level? Not even close.
Originally posted by Borbarad
Limited third person narrator, anybody?
Not only that, but the entire novel is filled with horrible hyperbole which, taken at face value, contradicts other things said throughout the novel.
Example: Obi-Wan being called the ultimate Jedi. Then Yoda being the most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known. Because, one would imagine that the ultimate Jedi would hold that title...
Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Omniscient third person narrator, anybody?See how easy that was? What makes you think that the narrator was limited?
I don't like disagreeing with you - but on this one you aren't correct. The entire novel, or at least 75% of it, takes place in the limited third person. Hence why Stover is always saying things like, "This is how it feels to be Anakin Skywalker:" et cetera.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
By jedi knights, do you mean Crado? Sylvar? Anybody worth a damn or anybody on Yoda or Vader's level? Not even close.
He kills Jedi Master Odan-Urr with a gesture, after surviving Urr's Sever Force attack...and, if I'm not mistaken, it was he who invented that attack, and so its potency should have been pretty high.
Originally posted by Enyalus
He kills Jedi Master Odan-Urr with a gesture, after surviving Urr's Sever Force attack...and, if I'm not mistaken, it was he who invented that attack, and so its potency should have been pretty high.
Odan Urr was over 1,000 years old and while he may have been the most knowledgeable force user ever, there's nothing to suggest he was powerful. Granted Exar Kun staved off the wall of light on him which would make him powerful, whether it was him or with the help of the amulet. However, when you make a statement like "throws jedi knights around like rag dolls", you need to substantiate this statement seeing as how the likes of Yoda and Vader are superior to Odan Urr, Crado, Sylvar, etc.
Originally posted by Enyalus
He was on the Jedi Council, responsible for rewriting the Jedi Code, and headmaster of the Jedi Library. There's nothing to suggest that he wasn't powerful.But, I do agree with the second half of your statement, regarding backing up the "throws jedi knights around like rag dolls" thing.
He was also possibly the oldest jedi alive and the most knowledgeable. He hasn't hinted at being powerful in the least bit, just knowledgeable in the force.
Originally posted by Enyalus
Not only that, but the entire novel is filled with horrible hyperbole which, taken at face value, contradicts other things said throughout the novel.Example: Obi-Wan being called the ultimate Jedi. Then Yoda being the most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known. Because, one would imagine that the ultimate Jedi would hold that title...
That particular case isn't really a good example. Not to shut you down- because some of the descriptions bordered on the ridiculous. What do you think about Dooku being borderline autistic?
Originally posted by Enyalus
I don't like disagreeing with you - but on this one you aren't correct. The entire novel, or at least 75% of it, takes place in the limited third person. Hence why Stover is always saying things like, "This is how it feels to be Anakin Skywalker:" et cetera.
DS:
He was also possibly the oldest jedi alive and the most knowledgeable. He hasn't hinted at being powerful in the least bit, just knowledgeable in the force.
I have seen quite a few people on these very forums indicate Sidious and Yoda being extremely knowledgeable in the Force and old, and by virtue of this they are incredible foes.
Yet somehow when Odan-Urr is the same, he's not even "hinted at being ... powerful"?
Here we see him note that he's adept at an extremely difficult Jedi skill, one which is clearly not even shown nor used in the PT era. His access to the Sith holocron and its secrets no doubt should be able to prepare him for the tricks of the Sith, as did his experience in the Hyperspace War and the subsequent mopping up of the Sith planets. His brief training of the technique allowed Nomi to pretty much make Ulic, himself a considerable Force prodigy, into a stooge. By being the foremost expert in this ability, it would stand to reason that it alone would make him dangerous, not counting any other tricks he might have up his sleeve.
Being able to sever someone's Force connection unwillingly and so suddenly is insanely powerful. Granted, he's not out sabering things in the streets, but his level of Force knowledge and capability puts him on a Force level of perhaps Yoda or Mace, perhaps higher at least in verified knowledge. And yet Exar Kun not only resisted the sever Force ability with ease, he then casually killed Odan-Urr without even drawing his blade. That's a nod to his own considerable Force abilities.
Working with that, it's not inconceivable that Exar Kun could manhandle Anakin Skywalker using his powers while spamming blasts at Yoda. It's not like he has to remain stationary while they bum rush him.
Originally posted by Janus Marius
DS:I have seen quite a few people on these very forums indicate Sidious and Yoda being extremely knowledgeable in the Force and old, and by virtue of this they are incredible foes.
Yet somehow when Odan-Urr is the same, he's not even "hinted at being ... powerful"?
Here we see him note that he's adept at an extremely difficult Jedi skill, one which is clearly not even shown nor used in the PT era. His access to the Sith holocron and its secrets no doubt should be able to prepare him for the tricks of the Sith, as did his experience in the Hyperspace War and the subsequent mopping up of the Sith planets. His brief training of the technique allowed Nomi to pretty much make Ulic, himself a considerable Force prodigy, into a stooge. By being the foremost expert in this ability, it would stand to reason that it alone would make him dangerous, not counting any other tricks he might have up his sleeve.
Being able to sever someone's Force connection unwillingly and so suddenly is insanely powerful. Granted, he's not out sabering things in the streets, but his level of Force knowledge and capability puts him on a Force level of perhaps Yoda or Mace, perhaps higher at least in verified knowledge. And yet Exar Kun not only resisted the sever Force ability with ease, he then casually killed Odan-Urr without even drawing his blade. That's a nod to his own considerable Force abilities.
Working with that, it's not inconceivable that Exar Kun could manhandle Anakin Skywalker using his powers while spamming blasts at Yoda. It's not like he has to remain stationary while they bum rush him.
What will prevent the good grand master from reflecting these blasts. Odan Durr was powerful in his prime, during the Great Sith War. Yoda has been show to redirect Sidious' lightning, with his bare hands. I put ROTS Sidous above Exar. Yoda alone is a match for Exar, put in Skywalker and he's toast. After all Anakin manhandles "The temples greatest student" in ROTS.
Don't come in here with that crap. Take it outside.