Originally posted by dadudemonI demand an apology. 🙁
Don't pick on me. weepWait. I feel ya. I just read the definition on the Bleach Wiki on what an Arrancar is.
An arrancar is simply a hallow that no longer has a hallow mask. It has been removed.
Aaroniero Arruruerie does not have a hallow mask, therefore, he is an Arrancar! Hoooray! That makes sense now.
However, this line brings light to the whole hiearchy thing...
"only Vasto Lorde-class menos will definitely assume a humanoid form." That was in reference to when a hallow becomes an Arrancar.
But, no, I don't think Vasto-Lorde are only the quatro. They are simply just exceptionally strong arrancar...which, to me, is any of the Espada.
And Vasto Lordes are the highest form of Menos, which is a type of Hollow. They are a natural, albeit rare, occurrence. Converting a Hollow into an Arrancar is not, it is an artificial process.
Also, the Resurrecion of an Espada actually converts the Arrancar to a form more closely resembling their original, pure Hollow form.
Let's look at it like this.
The Espada generally become more human in appearance in terms of their Resurrecions when they release it as they get lower in number, right? I mean, Yammy is a giant behemoth of Godly size and appearance(although interestingly, he is the strongest, I am waiting for the explaination of this), Aariniero becomes a big fvcking blob, Szazel turns into some weird ass...Thing, Zommari although retaining more human features than any of the above still gets a bunch of friggin eyes all over his body along with having his legs transformed into a pumpkin thingy, Grimmjow is still humanoid in appearance, has several feline qualities and is seen as a mix between his human, Arrancar form and the Hollow form seen before, Nnoitra is still largely human in appearance(although honestly, he never really looked "human" before), but his arms are changed, he grows more, and he has horns and stuffs, Ulquiorra's first release really just adds wings, although his second release changes a bit more, although he still looks fairly humanoid, and Halibel actually appears MORE human than she did before. If Barragan and Stark follow the same trend, it will only support this.
So...Yeah. Resurrecion is really just a mixture of their Hollow and human forms. The closer to Vasto Lorde they were as Hollows, the more human they appear.
EDIT: Also, Barragan is officially the manliest Espada. A Battle-Axe? 1337.
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. My statement full of fail? Check the next page genius.http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/267/08/
"Out of all the Arrancar, I am the only one with infinite evolutionary potential!"
By Aariniero's own admission, he is an Arrancar, being the only one with what he views as having infinite evolutionary potential. Too bad so sad bro.
Covered this already. He's still a Gillian, so you're wrong. 313
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
2. Give it up? But sir, I believe I just provided proof of Aariniero being an Arrancar.
Doesn't change the fact that he's a Gillian, no does it?
And, you had BETTER call me sir, soldier! 😠
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
3. Do you have poor reading comprehension? Is it so difficult to grasp what my intended meaning was? They WERE Adjuchas', not anymore, and once they become Arrancars, they are no longer Vasto Lorde or Adjuchas technically, but can still easily be referred to as such.
Uhhh....No. They are no longer Adjuchas. They used to be, but now they are not.
I didn't read most of what you typed in point 3...I just skimmed over it. 😐
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
4. Vasto Lorde is a type of Hollow, not a mere title of power. You have no evidence to back what you are saying up, while they may be comparable to a Vasto Lorde in power(which, they most likely are not), that does not make them a Vasto Lorde. You will never find Aizen refer to any of his Espada as a Vasto Lorde in present tense, hell, he has yet to refer to any of them as that in past tense. Your evidence is not even shoddy for this claim, it is non-existant. Prove they are Vasto Lorde's.
Can't. And you can't prove that they are not Vasto Lorde, either. However, there is some evidence that points to them all being Vasto Lorde because Aizen said he was trying to gather up the Vasto Lorde...so why can't he be making Vasto Lorde? His Espada certainly command other Arrancar...sounds like Vasto Lorde to me.
So what was he doing all this time? Gathering Adjuchas and making Vasto Lorde?
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
5. And can you point out where I said all Arrancar are Vasto Lorde or vice versa? And actually, NO arrancar is a Vasto Lorde to be completely factual, not anymore, some of them maybe used to be, but not after becoming Arrancar. Now they are Arrancar. Vasto Lorde is not an intelligence and power designation, although the power part is common among Vasto Lorde, simply being a powerfulArrancar does not make you Vasto Lorde, Grimmjow and down factually never were, and Noitora never was either. Vasto Lorde is a HOLLOW title, Arrancar's are not even completely Hollow anymore. That title cannot apply to them.
Wrong. Vasto Lorde IS a power and Intelligence designation. That's the whole point. It is a gradual progression of power and intelligence. Duh.
Yes, being a very powerful Arrancar makes you a Vasto Lorde. If you are at Captain level or higher, and you're a hallow, Vasto Lorde. 😐
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
6. Let me put it this way. Aariniero is factually not a Vasto Lorde, on this we agree. But he is also far stronger than any normal Adjuchas Hollow. By your warped perception, would that not make him a Vasto Lorde? No it would not, he was a Gillian, and is an Arrancar made from a Gillian, nothing more.
How do you know? Aizen said he was gathering the Vasto Lorde...so...it would seem it's more of a title given than actual evolution of a Hallow...if intelligence and power are considered. See, I have evidence to back up what I'm saying, however, you don't have anything that says what you're saying. You can't prove a negative unless someone explicitly states it. I'm using logic to conclude either an unconfirmed fact, or justification for PIS.
Answer me this....why did Aizen try to gather the Vasto Lorde if he was just going to make them? Does that even make sense?
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
7. No, he's an Arrancar.You have no idea how things work on the Hollow side.
Your own interpretation? This explains it all. This is your personal speculation you are trying to pass off as fact. Please stop. Aizen is TRYING(current tense) to gather Vasto Lorde, indicating he is still doing so so that he can make Arrancar from Vasto Lorde's to be in the Espada. That does not mean all the current Espada were ever Vasto Lorde or are Vasto Lorde in power.
Dude, you're wrong. Straight up wrong.
I present to you, Grimmjow.
He was an adjuchas, NOT Vasto Lorde, when Aizen made him into an Arrancar.
And, you're correct, not all current Espada were Vasto Lorde, however, it is possible that some were.
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
8. Vasto Lorde a dominion role? At this point I'm going to ask you to prove up or shut up. Vasto Lorde has never been hinted to be more than the final evolutionary stage of a Hollow.
Soooo....what about Adjuchas being able to control lesser hallows did you not understand?
What about the title "Vasto Lorde" do you not understand?
"Vasto Lorde (ヴァストローデ, 最上大虚, vasuto rōde; Spanish for "vast/enormous king/lord", Japanese for "Great/Grand king of the Hollows"
😐
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Szazel was dominated by Mayuri, and was among the smartest Espada. Apparently he was a "Vasto Lorde" though, which are according to you renowned for incredible power and intelligence...Then why did he lose so easily to a relatively weaker Captain? These "Vasto Lordes" you go on about surely would not be that stupid or weak would they?
"Weaker" captain? So, now it is down to absolutes of Reiryoku and physical fighting prowess?
Dude, Szazel outsmarted Mayuri. Simple as that. What's so absurd about that?
Also, Mayuri is the weakest of the Espada, by his own admission. He was in there for his brains.
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
9. An Arrancar, an Espada was taken out by someone who is on par with a Liutenant.B-but since he IS an Arrancar, and by your logic WOULD be an Espada, how could he lose to a Liutenant?
What are you going on about?
A lieutenant can take out of captain, if they outsmart them, just as Rukia did. Are you being dumb on purpose?
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
10. Kuchiki still took him down, yes, but these Vasto Lordes which are hyped by Toshiro to be able to solo ALL of Soul Society(including the big Yama, who is at least three times stronger than Byakuya) should not lose to anyone even at Byakuya's relatively high level.
Um, sorry, no. Yamamoto is NOT 3 times stronger than Kuchiki. Data book says otherwise, homie.
Again, it isn't power and strength alone. If you're outsmarted, you're outsmarted. Nothing you can do about it. Tactics play a large role in Bleach fights, obviously.
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
11. Only you can't actual prove this "dominion" claim.
What? What are you talking about?
Dude, you've to use quote tags.
No more of this number shit....unless I number.
Originally posted by dadudemon1. He was a Gillian.
Covered this already. He's still a Gillian, so you're wrong. 313Doesn't change the fact that he's a Gillian, no does it?
And, you had BETTER call me sir, soldier! 😠
Uhhh....No. They are no longer Adjuchas. They used to be, but now they are not.
I didn't read most of what you typed in point 3...I just skimmed over it. 😐
Can't. And you can't prove that they are not Vasto Lorde, either. However, there is some evidence that points to them all being Vasto Lorde because Aizen said he was trying to gather up the Vasto Lorde...so why can't he be making Vasto Lorde? His Espada certainly command other Arrancar...sounds like Vasto Lorde to me.
So what was he doing all this time? Gathering Adjuchas and making Vasto Lorde?
Wrong. Vasto Lorde IS a power and Intelligence designation. That's the whole point. It is a gradual progression of power and intelligence. Duh.
Yes, being a very powerful Arrancar makes you a Vasto Lorde. If you are at Captain level or higher, and you're a hallow, Vasto Lorde. 😐
How do you know? Aizen said he was gathering the Vasto Lorde...so...it would seem it's more of a title given than actual evolution of a Hallow...if intelligence and power are considered. See, I have evidence to back up what I'm saying, however, you don't have anything that says what you're saying. You can't prove a negative unless someone explicitly states it. I'm using logic to conclude either an unconfirmed fact, or justification for PIS.
Answer me this....why did Aizen try to gather the Vasto Lorde if he was just going to make them? Does that even make sense?
Dude, you're wrong. Straight up wrong.
I present to you, Grimmjow.
He was an adjuchas, NOT Vasto Lorde, when Aizen made him into an Arrancar.
And, you're correct, not all current Espada were Vasto Lorde, however, it is possible that some were.
Soooo....what about Adjuchas being able to control lesser hallows did you not understand?
What about the title "Vasto Lorde" do you not understand?
"Vasto Lorde (ヴァストローデ, 最上大虚, vasuto rōde; Spanish for "vast/enormous king/lord", Japanese for "Great/Grand king of the Hollows"
😐"Weaker" captain? So, now it is down to absolutes of Reiryoku and physical fighting prowess?
Dude, Szazel outsmarted Mayuri. Simple as that. What's so absurd about that?
Also, Mayuri is the weakest of the Espada, by his own admission. He was in there for his brains.
What are you going on about?
A lieutenant can take out of captain, if they outsmart them, just as Rukia did. Are you being dumb on purpose?
Um, sorry, no. Yamamoto is NOT 3 times stronger than Kuchiki. Data book says otherwise, homie.
Again, it isn't power and strength alone. If you're outsmarted, you're outsmarted. Nothing you can do about it. Tactics play a large role in Bleach fights, obviously.
What? What are you talking about?
Dude, you've to use quote tags.
No more of this number shit....unless I number.
2. Was a Gillian.
3. If you had actually read it, you would of known that is exactly what I just said.
4. I don't have to prove a negative, burden of proof is on you. Aizen said he was TRYING to GATHER the Vasto Lorde...Seriously, for a guy who is in/has finished college, your reading comprehension is rather sub-par, that is present tense, he is trying to gather Vasto Lorde to add to his Espada. As for commanding other Arrancar...Yeah, because they are a higher rank in Aizen's military than the others are.
Gathering strong Hollows and making Arrancar out of them for the Espada. And it has been proven that Espada can be demoted out of that status many times, why would he not just fill the Espada spots with his ten strongest(theoretically 11 if Yammy was not around) Arrancar currently until he can gather stronger Hollows? We actually already know that he actively tries to gather Vasto Lordes, as seen when Nel Tu and Nnoitra were hunting one to turn into an Arrancar.
5. Through the devouring of other Hollows until you reach the Vasto Lorde state.
Only you have no evidence for this claim. This was never stated or even implied to be the case, being a Captain level Arrancar I mean.
6. How do you gather a title? You give something a title, you do not gather it. He is gathering Vasto Lordes, what is so hard to understand about this? If he already had a full set of Vasto Lordes, he would no longer be gathering them. A Menos by definition is an evolution of a Hollow, done by devouring other Hollows. The more you eat, the stronger you get, eventually becoming an Adjuchas and then a Vasto Lorde. Hell, the Bleach wikia you cited even states Vasto Lorde's as "the very most powerful class of Menos, and the final stage in the Menos evolutionary line." It then states Aizen wants to gather ten of them to complete the Espada. If they were already completed with Vasto Lordes, Aizen would not want to gather any. This is so simple dude.
He doesn't make a Vasto Lorde. When he converts a Hollow into an Arrancar, the power of the Hollow is what determines the power of the Arrancar, logically he would want stronger Hollows to become Arrancar. He can't make Vasto Lordes. It is a natural process, unlike creating Arrancars.
7. I assure you I am very much right.
What is your point? He never was, and never will be a Vasto Lorde either.
It is very possible some were, I believe everyone Ulquiorra and up(possibly Yammy as well, but I am kinda iffy on that, am waiting on an explanation) were Vasto Lorde as Hollows.
8. They control Gillian class, which is no surprise, considering they are much stronger and more intelligent. But the Espada control other Hollows in Aizen's army because they are a higher rank in Aizen's army. And like you just stated, an Adjuchas can control other Hollows, well going by that, being Vasto Lorde is not needed to control weaker Hollows, which is true. Hell, if I recall right, one of the normal, plain Jane Hollows early in the series(the one that was a serial killer) had his own little personal army of Hollows he controlled.
And as we just discussed, it does not require a Vasto Lorde to control other Hollows.
9. No, but if you are going to sit here and tell me most fightd in Bleach are clever and full of strategy, you sir are full of it.
Alot, considering Vasto Lordes are supposed to be incredibly powerful and intelligent to the point where ten could solo Soul Society.
He also had a variety of unique and cheap powers.
10. A Liutenant has NEVER taken a Captain. The difference between the power of a Liutenant and Captain is gigantic, and the majority of the time they are more intelligent as well. Aariniero had most advantages in the fight, and if he were Vasto Lorde in power and intelligence, should have destroyed Rukia without effort.
11. Databook? Databook is crap. Kenpachi's total strength level in it is 390. Kaname Tousen's is 460. And Tousen also has the advantage of mastering Shikai and Bankai over Kenpachi. Going by your logic, Tousen should be able to beat Kenny, right? Wrong-o. Because he kinda, you know, didn't. Sajin Komamura has a total of 470, and was also disadvantaged against Kenny. Mayuri has a total of 430...And he is just not as strong as Kenny. 😐 Also, Toshiro has a total of 500, with Ukitake having a total of 490. Ukitake was confirmed to be one of the strongest Captains, along with Shunsui and Yama himself. Databook means shit.
Tactics play a large role in Bleach fights? Are we reading the same manga? Most fights involve who can pull off more new moves faster than the opponent. Tactics rarely mean a thing in Bleach, Bleach is a series that is primarily about out-powering your opponents with your Bankai when it comes to Captains.
12. You stated Vasto Lorde is more a title of dominion. This is not true.
Nah, I'll continue to use numbers.
you can't make Vasto Lorde!! if Aizen could make them, why would he send Noitra and Nel to look for them?(can't remember the chapter it said that but it was in a flash back)
you either becoma a Vasto Lorde or you don't, as proven by Grimmjow and his Fraccion, they could not become Vasto Lorde no matter what they did, and again, if Aizen could make Vasto Lorde why not make all hollow into Vasto Lorde, then shinigamize them, and have an army of Vasto Lorde arancar? there's no way there's THAT much PIS in this series
Originally posted by stickman618
you can't make Vasto Lorde!! if Aizen could make them, why would he send Noitra and Nel to look for them?(can't remember the chapter it said that but it was in a flash back)
How do you know that the process isn't creating them? It's impossible to know. We just know that they are really really powerful, posess dominion over other hallow, are intelligent, and have a humanoid form.
Originally posted by stickman618
you either becoma a Vasto Lorde or you don't, as proven by Grimmjow and his Fraccion, they could not become Vasto Lorde no matter what they did, and again, if Aizen could make Vasto Lorde why not make all hollow into Vasto Lorde, then shinigamize them, and have an army of Vasto Lorde arancar? there's no way there's THAT much PIS in this series
Here's what we are missing in order for you and I to be correct with our respective ideologies:
1. We don't know if some Arrancar are Vasto Lorde or if none are Vasto Lorde.,
2. We don't know if all or some of the Espada are considered Vasto Lorde, but we can assume at least some are because Aizen talked of collecting them...and Nel and skinny pants went out as well.
3. Vasto Lorde are in a Humanoid form and Hallow forms have just as much variance as any other. To assume, like TGE has that Ulq looked just like the image of a Vasto Lorde is retarded. The hallow mask remnants should be just as variable as any other hallow, on a Vasto Lorde.
Until something more is explained of Vasto Lorde, any reference to them should not be used at all. If an Espada is stronger than an average captain, you can call them Vasto Lorde and I won't fault you for it.
Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. He was a Gillian.2. Was a Gillian.
3. If you had actually read it, you would of known that is exactly what I just said.
4. I don't have to prove a negative, burden of proof is on you. Aizen said he was TRYING to GATHER the Vasto Lorde...Seriously, for a guy who is in/has finished college, your reading comprehension is rather sub-par, that is present tense, he is trying to gather Vasto Lorde to add to his Espada. As for commanding other Arrancar...Yeah, because they are a higher rank in Aizen's military than the others are.
Gathering ...Arrancar. [edited for length]
5. Through the devouring of other Hollows until you reach the Vasto Lorde state.
Only you have no evidence for this claim. This was never stated or even implied to be the case, being a Captain level Arrancar I mean.
6. How do you gather a title? You give something a title, you do not gather it. He is gathering Vasto Lordes, what is so hard to understand about this? If he already had a full set of Vasto Lordes, he would no longer be gathering them. A Menos by definition is an evolution of a Hollow, done by devouring other Hollows. The more you eat, the stronger you get, eventually becoming an Adjuchas and then a Vasto Lorde. Hell, the Bleach wikia you cited even states Vasto Lorde's as "the very most powerful class of Menos, and the final stage in the Menos evolutionary line." It then states Aizen wants to gather ten of them to complete the Espada. If they were already completed with Vasto Lordes, Aizen would not want to gather any. This is so simple dude.
He doesn't make a Vasto Lorde. When he converts a Hollow into an Arrancar, the power of the Hollow is what determines the power of the Arrancar, logically he would want stronger Hollows to become Arrancar. He can't make Vasto Lordes. It is a natural process, unlike creating Arrancars.
7. I assure you I am very much right.
What is your point? He never was, and never will be a Vasto Lorde either.
It is very possible some were, I believe everyone Ulquiorra and up(possibly Yammy as well, but I am kinda iffy on that, am waiting on an explanation) were Vasto Lorde as Hollows.
8. They control Gillian class, which is no surprise, considering they are much stronger and more intelligent. But the Espada control other Hollows in Aizen's army because they are a higher rank in Aizen's army. And like you just stated, an Adjuchas can control other Hollows, well going by that, being Vasto Lorde is not needed to control weaker Hollows, which is true. Hell, if I recall right, one of the normal, plain Jane Hollows early in the series(the one that was a serial killer) had his own little personal army of Hollows he controlled.
And as we just discussed, it does not require a Vasto Lorde to control other Hollows.
9. No, but if you are going to sit here and tell me most fightd in Bleach are clever and full of strategy, you sir are full of it.
Alot, considering Vasto Lordes are supposed to be incredibly powerful and intelligent to the point where ten could solo Soul Society.
He also had a variety of unique and cheap powers.
10. A Liutenant has NEVER taken a Captain. The difference between the power of a Liutenant and Captain is gigantic, and the majority of the time they are more intelligent as well. Aariniero had most advantages in the fight, and if he were Vasto Lorde in power and intelligence, should have destroyed Rukia without effort.
11. Databook? Databook is crap. Kenpachi's total strength level in it is 390. Kaname Tousen's is 460. And Tousen also has the advantage of mastering Shikai and Bankai over Kenpachi. Going by your logic, Tousen should be able to beat Kenny, right? Wrong-o. Because he kinda, you know, didn't. Sajin Komamura has a total of 470, and was also disadvantaged against Kenny. Mayuri has a total of 430...And he is just not as strong as Kenny. 😐 Also, Toshiro has a total of 500, with Ukitake having a total of 490. Ukitake was confirmed to be one of the strongest Captains, along with Shunsui and Yama himself. Databook means shit.
Tactics play a large role in Bleach fights? Are we reading the same manga? Most fights involve who can pull off more new moves faster than the opponent. Tactics rarely mean a thing in Bleach, Bleach is a series that is primarily about out-powering your opponents with your Bankai when it comes to Captains.
12. You stated Vasto Lorde is more a title of dominion. This is not true.
Nah, I'll continue to use numbers.
I'll do it your way, if I can keep your numbers matching to my post.
1. Yes, he was...because now he's dead. He WAS a Gillian when Rukia killed him too, or are you going to ignore the manga?
2. See #1.
3. I did read enough of it to see that you cannot refer to them as Adjuchas anymore. They are not adjuchas. You can refer to them as Vasto Lorde...but that has limited backing, as far as logic goes..so even that could end up being wrong. However, unless you refer to them as "formerly an adjuchas", then you're wrong.
4. Funny, I was thinking the same thing about you. You still deny that he was a Gillian, when he clearly declared that he was...which stemmed this whole discussion in the first place. And what does your post have anything to do with what I said?
Also, I already POSTED that it's pretty much impossible for you to prove your negative claim, whereas, my positive claim has slight evidence. Again, unless you can prove that somewhere officially, they've said that some or all of the Espada are NOT Vasto Lorde, evidence points to at least some of them being Vasto Lorde. Now, the burden of proof is on YOU to prove your negative claim...which is pretty much impossible unless explicitly stated. You have nothing to back up your negative claim, whereas I have deductive reasoning and simple logic for mine.
Also, how do you KNOW that they were hunting down Vasto Lorde to turn into Arrancar? It never said that. Where is your proof? 😄
5. You are correct, however, is why can't they be created artificially, which is what Aizen did with at least Grimmjow? Also, if I'm not mistaken, if he DID find a Vasto Lorde, he enhanced their powers, only. I cannot prove speculation. You should know that. I'm simply trying to explain plot holes in hallow designation. Had I written it, we would have a perfect understanding of reference for Arrancars, Espada, and Vasto Lorde....all three of which appear to have overlap.
6. What were you saying about reading comprehension a second ago? 313
of course he is not gathering a title. He's WAS gathering strong Hallow, not just Vasto Lorde, and then making them stronger.
Also, how do you know that he wasn't done gathering Vasto Lorde after creating Wonderweiss. No one else was "modified" with the crystal since Wonderweiss.
Also, how do you KNOW he isn't creating Vasto Lorde? The only thing missing is the natural progression. What if Aizen WAS creating artificial Vasto Lorde? One thing is for sure, he was gathering them and using the crystal on them to make the stronger.
7. See, this is where we disagree. I don't think Vasto Lorde has to be naturally obtained. Since it wasn't explained, I can explain it however I like.
Yes, I agree with you second point there. It is possible the that Quatro are all Vasto Lorde.
8. So, by the title and progressive logic, wouldn't it make sense that Vasto Lorde can control other hallow...which, by the way, was the entire point being argued.
In other words, pwned.
You said this:
"Vasto Lorde a dominion role? At this point I'm going to ask you to prove up or shut up. Vasto Lorde has never been hinted to be more than the final evolutionary stage of a Hollow."
That means I win this particular point and we are done with it.
9. Now, why would I say that? Sure, there are "outsmart to win" fights, but, with Ichigo, it's ALWAYS brawn.
10. Oh really? Aizen certainly "beat" captains as a Lieutenant. You're wroooong. Suck it. 313 Oh, and, you can't pull the "He's a special case", either. Gin wasn't even a Captain but as a lad, I'm sure he could have taken some of the captains...in that flash back. I could be mistaken...he might have and I just forgot.
And, no, the power gap between Captain and Lieutenant is not gigantic for everyone. Renji is a lieutenant but he is certainly quite strong. If they can make a bankai, then they are considered strong. Yoruichi said that a Bankai is almost entirely a captain achievement...so any Bankai Lieutenant is close to captain. Only two fit that. Renji, and Ikkaku. Other than that, I agree fully with you.
11. You can find weaknesses in the databook from any perspective, however, a higher rating does not necessarily mean an easy victory each time. Obviously, Kenpachi has the edge over just about any other captain, except for those that are faster. Still, you said 3 times stronger and that's simply not the case from the OFFICIAL databook...nor is it ever stated in the manga.
Now, if you'd like, you can present some logic to back up your "3 times" claim, and I may agree with you.
And, yes, many of the fights, non Kenpachi and Ichigo are "skill" fights.
Name fights that did not involve tactics other than Ichigo and Kenpachi's...and then think about and name the ones that required skill.
Thank you. 🙂
12. It most certainly is...I even showed you the proper translation which means King/Lord of the hallows. 😐
Vasto Lorde IS a dominion position AND title. Certainly requires the power to back it up and it requires, if done naturally, eating a crap load of hallows.
Originally posted by stickman618
you don't have to shut upbut you are so wrong
So Aaroniero Arruruerie is not a Gillian, Kuchiki is both a weak and stupid captain, none of the Espada are possibly Vasto Lorde, Bleach fights rarely contain tactics, Grimmjow is an Adjuchas, Vasto Lorde is not a Dominion role or title (in addition to being a state of evolution), and the data book is not official?
I'll give you and TGE one thing. I am using Vasto Lorde in a way that may not be correct, however, there is no evidence to the contrary and what little evidence there is supports my argument.
Originally posted by dadudemon
😆I forgot about him. Yup. Pretty much all of his fights are strategy fights. But, isn't he like, really smart n'stuff? His grades are the highest in school.
HOW COULD YOU FORGET ABOUT ISHIDA!?!?
Blasphemy! But yeah his grades are the highest.
mhmm
Thinking back on it, Kenpachi also had a strategic element when he beat Tosen. It was rather blunt, but still not bad. It's not like he was limited to standing still.