Colossus vs. Sabertooth

Started by Wickerman32 pages

Originally posted by Creshosk
Yeah, but I found another excuse to try and set things straight. 😛

*New Definitions Appear*
"[b]Comic Book Logic
": Logic that is processing Comic Book Data.

"Real World Logic": Logic that is processing Real World Data.

Well would you look at that 😐 [/B]

I saw you posted, then i saw jinzin posted, and i said to myself: "Don't go back into the thread.....the headache will just come back.....don't do it...."

But did i listen to myself? Of course not. You're two heartless bastards!!!!!

~wickerman~

Originally posted by Wickerman
I saw you posted, then i saw jinzin posted, and i said to myself: "Don't go back into the thread.....the headache will just come back.....don't do it...."

But did i listen to myself? Of course not. You're two heartless bastards!!!!!

~wickerman~

😂

Originally posted by Creshosk
What doesn't makes sense is that something happens the majority of the time, and then to say he can't do it.

It's like seeing a guy shoot a bullseye 90% of the time and then saying he can't do it again. THAT makes less sense than what you're saying.

That what Wolverine does the majority of the time is simply a plot device? 😬

There's a difference between a personality flaw and an ability flaw. . .

flash getting hit all the time?

Its not that wolverine can't do it, its more of the comic looking good, I don't see your point...

Originally posted by jinzin
this is the argument that srank had with him in the wolverine spiderman thread all over again.

*wolverine is pis

-even though he does this stuff all the time?

*remember that one time a street level hit him (while he wasn't looking) and won the fight?

-as opposed to the 20 odd times wolverine beat that street level before and afterwards? as opposed to the even more numerous times he's taken down tougher opponents?

*you don't get logic

-sure I do but comic book logic differs from real world logic

*you're a fanboy

-cause I share a differing viewpoint?

*.......................

*flash and bommerangs! yadda yadda yadda

-🤨

* you think wolverine can beat blah blah blah...

-those are argument's I've never made 🤨

* I just owned you

*good job

*thank you

-why are you patting yourself on the back?

*you think wolverine can kill the ocean floor!...

every argument ever posted by (insert assumption here) I think you all know who I'm talking about. 😉

The discussion was that wolverine was a plot device based on the fact his healing fluctuates to.

You are pointing out things that go outside of his abilities, srank thinks wolverine can beat godzilla, you think he can beat metallo.

Comments like

"wolverine can jump 50 feet high"

"wolverine can move faster than the speed of sound"

"wolverine is immune to leverage"

"wolverine is immune to inertia"

"wolverine is faster than spiderman"

"batman hits HARDER than spiderman"

"wolverine takes hits from the hulk, so NOONE can hurt him"

Then someone disagrees with their fanboy rantings..

" you guys hate wolverine, and you NEVER read his books"

one of his buddies come in, "you are the best, and cordera is a jew"

srank didn't even beat my last post and jinzin just ignored them

He always uses pis/cis all the time, wolverine captured odin, wolverine gutted silver surfer.

EVERYONE knows it by now, its his reputation, its board knowledge.

Originally posted by jinzin
arguing? I'd have to take his arse off ignore to argue with him... if he's still stuck in the rutt of responding to my post when I can't see him..well....

Actually your cheap posts and insults just make you childish if anything, you are just bitter from getting beat so much, even the mods know... 🙂

Originally posted by Creshosk
so it'd be better to be presumptius if he was new?
more understandable

Originally posted by Creshosk
So your saying that PIS is valid evidence against what happens most of the time?

Stop this, you are taking this out of context because I was correct.

You said: savage hulk hits his hardest, ALWAYS.

I said: why do so many characters survive it.

conclusion: COMICS MUST LOOK GOOD, and popularity comes first.

Originally posted by Creshosk
But that's not quite the same. . .Flash might get hit by the boomerang if he didn't see it. Like flash runs into forcefeilds if he doesn't see them and doesn't know about them. . .

How is it not the same, flash should almost NEVER get hit, its for the comic to look good.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Apples and oranges here. . .

100 vs 10

Sabertooth has adamantium he wins.

Originally posted by Cosmo Kramer
Sabertooth has adamantium he wins.

I liked your posts better when you were banned 😖hifty:

~wickerman~

Originally posted by Wickerman
I liked your posts better when you were banned 😖hifty:

~wickerman~

He got banned acting like jinzin and merc to be exact...

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
He got banned acting like jinzin and merc to be exact...

I don't know about that, but i've seen/read/spoken to jinzin and merc plenty of times, long enough to know they would never, no matter how biased or whatever they are, make a statement like "Sabertooth has adamantium, he wins". They may try to bend the truth, bla bla bla, but at least they do it intricately. 😉

~wickerman~

Originally posted by Wickerman
I don't know about that, but i've seen/read/spoken to jinzin and merc plenty of times, long enough to know they would never, no matter how biased or whatever they are, make a statement like "Sabertooth has adamantium, he wins". They may try to bend the truth, bla bla bla, but at least they do it intricately. 😉

~wickerman~

I'll pm you what I'm talking about...

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
I'll pm you what I'm talking about...

Ooooookay 😕

So back to the discussion at hand. Sabertooth vs. Colossus. I personally think Sabertooth doesn't have the strength or leverage to actually wound Colossus. Colossus would have to put a LOT of effort into hurting Sabertooth himself though, seeing as how his HF is craaaaaaazeh. So......which one wins???

~wickerman~

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Stop this, you are taking this out of context because I was correct.

You said: savage hulk hits his hardest, ALWAYS.

I said: why do so many characters survive it.

conclusion: COMICS MUST LOOK GOOD, and popularity comes first.

Even when the person is an unknown?

Yeah Wolverine took Colossus's 75 ton "full force" hit because he was popular, even though he was an unknown.

Seriously, you can't cry "popularity" when the variable on the other side remains constant when popularity wasn't.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Even when the person is an unknown?

Yeah Wolverine took Colossus's 75 ton "full force" hit because he was popular, even though he was an unknown.

Seriously, you can't cry "popularity" when the variable on the other side remains constant when popularity wasn't.

comics looking good, characters being introduced?

Wolverine taking damage at the same manner a person can

seriously, inconsistant consistancy is all the same, flawed...

Your point is moot...
I've given many reasons so...

That logic doesn't apply here, stop using it...

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
comics looking good, characters being introduced?
A character is introduced, his first appearence he "hangs" with the hulk.

His ability to do this has NOTHING to do with his popularity.

Wolverine is turned into an X-man and takes a full force hit from colossus.

His ability to do this has NOTHING to do with his popularity, because he was still an unknown.

He continues to do this, consistently. Consistancy had NOTHING to do with stats. Inconsistancy is NOT preforming above his abilities. Consistency is preforming the same feat, each time it comes up.

In this sequence:

1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128.

Doubling is consistant. Consistancy is only defined by multiple occurences.

You CANNOT say that this has any consistancy or inconsistancy:

1

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Wolverine taking damage at the same manner a person can
Aside from broken bones. . . But he also heals much faster than a normal person can.

Do you argue that he heals MUCH faster than a normal human?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
seriously, inconsistant consistancy is all the same, flawed...
How DO you define consistancy?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Your point is moot...
I've given many reasons so...
You have not given any valid reasons to say that Wolverine's ability to take massive hits is determined soley by either comic book sales or popularity. As his encounters have been fairly consistant in this regard and has shown to be able to do things BEFORE he was popular, BEFORE anybody would care if he even survived an encounter.

People have been killed for sales. People are killed for storyline.

NOT being killed has little to do with sales. As they can always bring you back.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
That logic doesn't apply here, stop using it...
What logic?

Real world logic NEVER overrides established comic book logic.

That in itself is illogical.

Originally posted by Creshosk
A character is introduced, his first appearence he "hangs" with the hulk.

His ability to do this has NOTHING to do with his popularity.

Wolverine is turned into an X-man and takes a full force hit from colossus.

His ability to do this has NOTHING to do with his popularity, because he was still an unknown.

He continues to do this, consistently. Consistancy had NOTHING to do with stats. Inconsistancy is NOT preforming above his abilities. Consistency is preforming the same feat, each time it comes up.

In this sequence:

1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128.

Doubling is consistant. Consistancy is only defined by multiple occurences.

You CANNOT say that this has any consistancy or inconsistancy:

Was my argument BASED on hanging with hulk, no?

Was my original argument based on him taking hits, not quite.

It was based on him, dislocating joints, etc.

Stop tangeting.

Inconsistancy of consistancy, whether or NOT you'd like to admit it, everyone else sees this.

Namor ko'ed hulk in one hit TWICE, but he hits wolverine twice and wolverine doesn't fall,

nope, thats were logic comes in, this is a theoretical debate its not what HAS happened, its what will most likely happen.

That being said, stop responding to this, its besides my orignial point, AS USUAL.
1

Originally posted by Creshosk
Aside from broken bones. . . But he also heals much faster than a normal person can.

Do you argue that he heals MUCH faster than a normal human?

he does, but you think he regenerates as well, which is another reason wolverine is such a pain in the ass to argue with, because people add shit on.

He takes the hits as a human, if he's ko'ed he's koed, like it or not.

How DO you define consistancy?

Originally posted by Creshosk
You have not given any valid reasons to say that Wolverine's ability to take massive hits is determined soley by either comic book sales or popularity. As his encounters have been fairly consistant in this regard and has shown to be able to do things BEFORE he was popular, BEFORE anybody would care if he even survived an encounter.

what can wolverine survive? REmember that thread, it was done, I got my point across fine, there were no counters, and everyone agreed but the normal.

Stop bringin it up, he can survive massive hits, but they fluctuate, and he wasn't doing as good until he got popular, it is quite obvious.

Originally posted by Creshosk
People have been killed for sales. People are killed for storyline.

NOT being killed has little to do with sales. As they can always bring you back.

Again, who wants to see wolverine not exist? Thats my point death means nothing without existence, its not if he died, but if he ceased to exist.

Originally posted by Creshosk
What logic?

Real world logic NEVER overrides established comic book logic.

That in itself is illogical.

What is this real world logic?

Why are you and jinzin being presumptios and contradicting yourselves, this isn't what has happened, its what most likely will.

Given what each character has been strictly defined to do.

Comic book logic applies in your favor when its a feat, but then when it comes to how wolverine will win, its a "fatal stab".

Surely this doesn't happen in a comic.

Now back on topic, where is your reason for him NOT being able to not dislocate a joint?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Was my argument BASED on hanging with hulk, no?
You were talking about first appearences and making a comic book look good.

Wolverine hung with the hulk, even though The Hulk was infinitly(not an exageration, it has to do with the concept of dividing by zero) more popular than Wolverine . . .

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Was my original argument based on him taking hits, not quite.
Making comics look good and popularity.

I was showing how it was a non-factor to what he was doing. Since he had no popularity, but was still doing the things that you say he can't.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
It was based on him, dislocating joints, etc.
Which was covered by the comic logic vs real world logic debate from earlier.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Stop tangeting.

"comics looking good, characters being introduced?"

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Inconsistancy of consistancy, whether or NOT you'd like to admit it, everyone else sees this.
Like Wickerman?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Namor ko'ed hulk in one hit TWICE, but he hits wolverine twice and wolverine doesn't fall,
And we've already said that there are such things as PIS, I've already said that his was PIS.

Why bring it up?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
nope, thats were logic comes in, this is a theoretical debate its not what HAS happened, its what will most likely happen.
Do you know what the difference between Comic book Logic and Real world logic is?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
That being said, stop responding to this, its besides my orignial point, AS USUAL.
Then stop tangeting, and I will stop as well.

Cause I sure as hell don't see what Namor has to do with this discussion.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
he does, but you think he regenerates as well,
To a degree he's shown consistancy when doing this. He grew back his arm each time the flesh was burned off, even superceeding cauterization.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
which is another reason wolverine is such a pain in the ass to argue with, because people add shit on.
Like stabbing the ocean?

New things are brought up to show points as invalid.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
He takes the hits as a human, if he's ko'ed he's koed, like it or not.
Obviously this is not the case as he has shown a consistancy in this manner, and thinking it is would then be just as much PIS as thinking he doesn't move when hit by namor or Spiderman beating Firelord.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
How DO you define consistancy?
I've already shown before. In the very post you responded to. Your turn, how do you define it?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
what can wolverine survive? REmember that thread, it was done, I got my point across fine, there were no counters, and everyone agreed but the normal.
And what does this have to do with your original point?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Stop bringin it up, he can survive massive hits, but they fluctuate, and he wasn't doing as good until he got popular, it is quite obvious.
Like him taking a full force hit from colossus?

I've already shown why this is a bad argument to make, because he was doing it BEFORE he became popular.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Again, who wants to see wolverine not exist? Thats my point death means nothing without existence, its not if he died, but if he ceased to exist.
He's been killed before, then it was retconned and he was brought back.

Even when he was popular.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
What is this real world logic?
I've stated what is was before, in this thread.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Why are you and jinzin being presumptios and contradicting yourselves, this isn't what has happened, its what most likely will.
The best indicator of the future, is the past.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Given what each character has been strictly defined to do.
What defines a character? The feats that they do consistantly? Or stats which are the equivilent of one writers take on the character?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Comic book logic applies in your favor when its a feat, but then when it comes to how wolverine will win, its a "fatal stab".
Fatal stabs usually result in death. . . death is a win. . . what's your point? That if Wolverine gets a fatal stab, it's not a win?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Surely this doesn't happen in a comic.
So if Wolverine fatally stabs someone, he doesn't beat them?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Now back on topic, where is your reason for him NOT being able to not dislocate a joint?
Double negative.

Funny is all the things you said only prove my point.

Your examples you've given have been contradicted before, so its inconsistant.

Are you telling me you belive that wolverine is consistant? Because everyone sees this even him, he said to use logic.

Comics looking good have to do with sales, which is contingent on people liking to read them, so yes it involves comics.

Why does batman hit flash?

You keep saying when, instead of why, I can make a list a mile long, lets stray away from intangibles.

Its that simple, so now back to the point, why can't wolverine's joint be removed?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Funny is all the things you said only prove my point.

Your examples you've given have been contradicted before, so its inconsistant.

Originally posted by Creshosk
So you're using events of PIS to try and discredit something that happens the majority of the time?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Are you telling me you belive that wolverine is consistant? Because everyone sees this even him, he said to use logic.
Are you saying the minority overrides the majority?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Comics looking good have to do with sales, which is contingent on people liking to read them, so yes it involves comics.
So wolverine HAS to stay concious for it to be a good book?

I'm refering to before he's established here. They decided for him to do what he does the majority of the time, simply because it's good for the book?

They decided to have him knock out wendigo and dance around the hulk, because it was good for the book? I mean they COULD have just had him back handed and gone, and noone would have batted an eye. Just another expendalble character in marvel. But instead they went the other way.

They could have had Wolverine knocked out when Colossus hit him, nobody would have cared either way.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Why does batman hit flash?
Cause Flash isn't expecting his teammate to hit him.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
You keep saying when, instead of why, I can make a list a mile long, lets stray away from intangibles.
Like what?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Its that simple, so now back to the point, why can't wolverine's joint be removed?
Because of the bonding process that we don't understand.

How do you define consistency?

Originally posted by Creshosk
Are you saying the minority overrides the majority?

So wolverine HAS to stay concious for it to be a good book?

I'm refering to before he's established here. They decided for him to do what he does the majority of the time, simply because it's good for the book?

They decided to have him knock out wendigo and dance around the hulk, because it was good for the book? I mean they COULD have just had him back handed and gone, and noone would have batted an eye. Just another expendalble character in marvel. But instead they went the other way.

They could have had Wolverine knocked out when Colossus hit him, nobody would have cared either way.

Cause Flash isn't expecting his teammate to hit him.

Like what?

Because of the bonding process that we don't understand.

Conclusion, you think wolverine is consistant, so I have little else to say to you about him.

Good for the book is what the people want, alas this is a discussion, and peoples wants have changed over the years.
It used to be quality, but now, no.

Looking good, flash goes around and never gets hit, is that interesting?

Expecting his teammate to hit him an a fight between the two, you can do better than that...

"Because of the bonding process that we don't understand."

MY question, which took forever to get out of you, because you wanted to tangent.

Wolverine isn't bonded to be unable to remove his joints, or else he wouldn't be able to move them.

It can be done, but it needs work.