Lol, could it not just be that the forum is now filled with Dooku hating, Vader fanboys.
Reason why is because people are fed up with your fanboyism. So they act meaner toward you because you tend to have touble getting things through your skull that say Dooku isn't as good as you think he is.
I myself voted for Dooku before i read the facts.
Just goes to show..
However Dooku will win this.
Like hell he will.
He is faster (and dont try to pass this off as nothing, no it is not the deciding factor but it sure as hell helps
It can, but nto enough to ensure victory.
has decades more experience (experience is also important, but again not vital)
Also not enough to ensure the victory. Plus, Vader can better harness his potenial now. Properly harnessed potential > Experiance. As shown in Rots.
the significant advantage of force lightning (this in itself proves Vader will lose)
Obi-wan is ATTACK OF THE CLONES was able to block Dooku's lightning like it was NOTHING with just a casual wave of his lightsaber. Vader (Who is by now above Obi-Wan) can easily do the same.
and the fact that he was a top duellist and lightsaber prodigy in the time when jedi were at their peak
Vader was a lightsaver prodigy his ENTIRE LIFE. AND he killed multipel top tier Jedi when they were at there peak, by HIMSELF. 7 Jedi Masters killed in a 7masters vs. Vader match ring a bell?
By themselves these facts mean little but together they prove that Dooku wins.
No..this just helps show your fanboyism and quite frankly doesn't mean sh*t.
The only thing Vader has is physical strength in his form (and arguably force abilities). These alone will not let him win - make the fight extremely difficult yes, but not enough to win.
Well, if Vaders got the better force abilties and strength, what's left for Dooku in the first place? Lightsaber ability? Isn't going to help him much if Vader decides to just choke him or crush him.
Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
Vader would kill Dooku, even Lucas would say so, let's face it,
Would he? Sh*t you are starting to sound like Supershadow. "Lucas would say this, Lucas would say that". If you have no hard evidence why the f*ck post bullsh*t like that.
Dooku was just an above-average Jedi
LMFAO!!!! 😆 😆 😆 😆
Im sorry, that is just the biggest load of crap I have heard on these forums and possibly in my entire life. Someone like Kit Fisto would be an above average jedi. Dooku however is a lightsaber prodigy who has mastered the ultimate duelling form. That is just being biased to the max. Even me, a Dooku fanboy, acknowledges Vaders skill.
obsessed with knowledge, it would not be hard to find another person stronger than both him and Vader if Dooku was the superior one.
Any proof on this? Or is it just more unsupported, biased bullsh*t.
Experience sure as hell helped him in his fight with Anakin.......oh wait, he got his hands chopped off, and then his head with his own Lightsaber.
What did I say. Let me get it for you.
Originally posted by Rampant ox
has decades more experience (experience is also important, but again not vital)
Note the "again not vital". I didnt say experience is going to win him the match but it will certainly help.
Vader in Lightsaber combat > Dooku
Yes, because his form has more physical strength. But it certainly wont guarentee him the win when Dooku has mastered the ultimate refinement in lightsaber to lightsaber combat.
Vader would just outright choke Dooku
Vader would outright lightning Vaders ass. Point moot.
Originally posted by Blax X
Except that sith lightning is easily counter-able, choke isn't 😉 hell, it hasn't even been recorded wither or not crush and choke have EVER been countered. So for all we know, they might be uncounter-abel insta-kills.
In case you forget Dooku knows force choke as well. He will choke the little oxygen Vader has right out of him. Also yes sith lightning is easily countered. As is a saber stroke. But he wouldnt be able to block both a saber and lightning simultaneously. Especially when it has been established Dooku is faster.
And to VadersElement (I liked the name LightElement better btw 😉 ) Vader cant block lightning with his hands. Hans blaster bolt and Dooku's lightning are totally different things. It has even been stated by Advent by a canon source that he cant. Also there is a key difference between Yoda and Vader. Yoda has organic limbs so is therefore able to block it with his hands.
And who says Vader wont just dooku before he can even reach him OR raise his hand to make lightning come out.
As we know, Vader doesn't even need to raise his fingers, he just has to THINK it, and it will happen.
Do you really think Dooku can reach Vader or raise his hand to deliver the lightning BEFORE Vader can even THINK the thought that will have Dooku writhing on the ground from lack of Oxegyn?
What, you think Dooku is going to just ignore the fact that his throat is being broken, and he is losing oxygen at a rapid rate? He won't be doing any jumping around on an oxygen shortage, as that would just kill him fast. Plus, he would reflexively put his hands to his throat even if he knew that the only chance he has to live is to attack. The human instinct will over power reason.
Originally posted by VadersElements
vader would block his lightning, point moot, force deflection, even if the ultimate guide says he cant he can, how?? lmfao, movies are higher canon, he used force deflection against hans bolts, and yoda demonstrated it for us in AOW and did the same to dooku
I don't see the humor in you plainly ignoring facts, and then twisting the movies to fit your absurd logic on this point. The ROTS Visual Dictionary states that Vader can neither conjur nor repel Force lightning as it requires living hands to do so, RODV also concedes to this point.
Now,
1.) A blaster bolt and Force lightning have completely different properties. So, your point ultimately holds no water. Even less of value when you consider - as Rex pointed out in a different thread - that some would dispute it as Vader's armored hand that allowed him to do that. It would not be the same with lightning in the least bit.
2.) Yoda used his hands, which were not artificial. So, again, your point holds no water. The Visual Dictionary explicitly states that it would require living hands to block Force lightning, which is in a completely different group of properties than a simple blaster bolt, and Yoda did indeed have living hands during AOTC, ROTS, and his entire life.
So, while it may be that Vader did use Force deflection to block Han Solo's blaster bolt, it doesn't mean he can do the same with a Force-based attack - basically lightning - because it requires living hands as already stated.
Movies are the highest canon, true, but your logic is not sound - so it doesn't matter.
ok but as if he cant block with his lightsaber, and can dooku defend against crush? i dont think so, dooku knows choke, true, but did he master it? is it as fatal as vaders? no it isnt, and yes there is a defend to choke, force push your opponent, you still can move, so grip isnt going to be effective on either. and again prove that it was vaders glove who "absorbed" the bolt
now heres crush, you cannot move at all, the force around you pushes inwards to its centre of gravity, it gets harder and harder to do anything, you are immobalised, very similar to a boa constricter around you, but force crush keeps going inwards till you die, not an insta kill but its more of a "you will die" situation, like a pitbull on your neck wont let go till you die.
known defences? get out of sight which will not happen here
Originally posted by Blax X
What, you think Dooku is going to just ignore the fact that his throat is being broken, and he is losing oxygen at a rapid rate? He won't be doing any jumping around on an oxygen shortage, as that would just kill him fast. Plus, he would reflexively put his hands to his throat even if he knew that the only chance he has to live is to attack. The human instinct will over power reason.
Hmmm thats a very good point, probably the best ive heard all day. It will probably catch Dooku off guard, but I doubt the Count will just stand there while being choked to death. He will instinctively grab his throat, but after that he will regain his senses and mount some sort of offencive to break the hold.
Well Dooku is old. He wouldnt be able to hold his breath for as long as someone like Obi-Wan. But he is very fit and described as having the strength of jedi half his age. Lets say it takes 3 seconds for him to grab his throat. He will then be able to realise what is going on and think of an attack. 5 seconds max. So that is 8 seconds (give or take). I can easily hold my breath for 8 seconds. I am fairly confident Dooku will be able to break the hold before he passes out (and with the force im sure he can think of an attack quickly and possibly even sense the attack coming).
Originally posted by Rampant ox
Well Dooku is old. He wouldnt be able to hold his breath for as long as someone like Obi-Wan. But he is very fit and described as having the strength of jedi half his age. Lets say it takes 3 seconds for him to grab his throat. He will then be able to realise what is going on and think of an attack. 5 seconds max. So that is 8 seconds (give or take). I can easily hold my breath for 8 seconds. I am fairly confident Dooku will be able to break the hold before he passes out (and with the force im sure he can think of an attack quickly and possibly even sense the attack coming).
ok good one rampant, but why would vader choke him if he survives, as i said, force crush would finish him in a force and saber fight.
in a saber fight, vader would use cho sun and cho mai to disarm dooku pernamently
Originally posted by VadersElements
and since the count is a dangerous enemy why would vader want to use choke? vader always tends to kill his enemies, he would use crush,
Crush is a very advanced technique which would be extremely difficult to pull off during a duel - especially when we have established Dooku is faster. If Vader was so apt at crush why didnt he use it against Obi-Wan in ANH. Obi-Wan is 1/5 the speed of Dooku yet Vader didnt use it.
Originally posted by VadersElements
ok good one rampant, but why would vader choke him if he survives, as i said, force crush would finish him in a force and saber fight.
Read above 😉
in a saber fight, vader would use cho sun and cho mai to disarm dooku pernamently [/B]
Well that would be the ideal thing for Vader to do but it is easier said than done. Heck, why wouldnt Dooku do that to Vader? You have to be a fair amount better than your opponent to do this (eg Vader to Luke, Dooku to Anakin). I think these competitors are to close in skill to be able to use a technique like this.