*["If you mean I haven't quoted the bible, then you're absolutely correct..."]
***You haven't quoted ANYTHING...not even "other sources".
**********************************************
*["...however, I have chosen a lot of other 'christian threads' to speak in...."]
***Why bother?...you have NOTHING of substance to contribute when you "visit" them.
**********************************************
*["None of which you have chosen to participate, or respond."]
***N/A
Marchello
Originally posted by Marchello
*["If you mean I haven't quoted the bible, then you're absolutely correct..."]***You haven't quoted ANYTHING...not even "other sources".
**********************************************
*["...however, I have chosen a lot of other 'christian threads' to speak in...."]
***Why bother?...you have NOTHING of substance to contribute when you "visit" them.
**********************************************
*["None of which you have chosen to participate, or respond."]
***N/A
Marchello
Dude....take my advice....go to regular therapy, and get laid !
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
So, if a person is a true Christian and then commits a crime that makes him/her not a true Christian, can they then repent and become a true Christian again?
* excommunication is not handed down immediately, depends how grave the violation is...
"As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him,"
Titus 3:10
* after the first and second warning, now comes the excommunication...
"For it is impossible to restore again to repentance those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit,
And have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come,
If they then commit apostasy, since they crucify the Son of God on their own account and hold him up to contempt."
Hebrews 6:4-6
* to answer your question, nope... proof is also said by Saint Peter...
"For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them."
II Peter 2:20-21
* that's why Saint John warns the Christians... 😉
"Look to yourselves, that you may not lose what you have worked for, but may win a full reward."
II John 8
Originally posted by peejayd
* excommunication is not handed down immediately, depends how grave the violation is..."As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him,"
Titus 3:10* after the first and second warning, now comes the excommunication...
"For it is impossible to restore again to repentance those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit,
And have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come,
If they then commit apostasy, since they crucify the Son of God on their own account and hold him up to contempt."
Hebrews 6:4-6* to answer your question, nope... proof is also said by Saint Peter...
"For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them."
II Peter 2:20-21* that's why Saint John warns the Christians... 😉
"Look to yourselves, that you may not lose what you have worked for, but may win a full reward."
II John 8
So, once you have been washed in the blood of the lamb, and your sins are forever forgiven, you can loose that forgiveness? Jesus did not state forgiveness as a contract. Please show me were Jesus said you can loose your forgiveness.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
So, once you have been washed in the blood of the lamb, and your sins are forever forgiven, you can loose that forgiveness? Jesus did not state forgiveness as a contract. Please show me were Jesus said you can loose your forgiveness.
*["...give me other Bible verses that MORPHE is used to refer to 'inner essence or reality'..."]
***The word rendered "morphe" occurs only in three places in the NT:
(1)Mark 16:12
(a)The "form" which Jesus assumes AFTER His resurrection and in which He appeared to two of His disciples. This "form" was so UNLIKE His USUAL "form" that they did NOT recognize Him.
(b)The word properly means: form, shape, bodily shape, especially a beautiful form, beautiful bodily appearance (i.e., Passow).
(2)Philippians 2:6
(3)Philippians 2:7
(a)It is applied to the appearance of a servant...or of the LOWEST condition.
The word "form" is often applied to the gods by classical writers...denoting their "aspect or appearance" when they became VISIBLE to men [i.e., Cic. de Nat. Deor. ii, 2; Ovid, Meta. i.73; Xeno, Memora. iv; Aeniad, iv. 556].
(1)The word occurs often in the Septuagint (a)as the translation of the word [ziv]...splendour [Daniel iv:33;v:6,9,10;vii:28] (b)as the translation of the word [tabnith]...structure, model, pattern [i.e., as in building, (Isaiah xliv:13]; and (c)as the translation of [temura]...appearance, form, shape, image, likeness [i.e., Job iv:16 and the Book of Wisdom xviii:13].
The word can have here only ONE of TWO meanings...either:
(1)Splendour, majesty, glory...referring to the honour which the Redeemer had [i.e., His power to work miracles, etc.].
(a)Calvin adopted this FIRST opinion..."the FORM of a king consists of the EXTERNAL marks which indicate a king...as his sceptre, diadem, coat of mail, attendants, throne, and other insignia of royalty"...OR
(2)NATURE or ESSENCE...meaning the "same" as "nature" or "being."
(a)This second opinion is, that the word is EQUIVALENT to "nature" or "being"; that is, that He was "IN THE NATURE [i.e., ESSENCE] of God"...His mode of "existence" was that OF God...or was DIVINE.
In support of the SECOND OPINION [i.e., most orthodox expositors] we may adduce the following considerations: (1)The "form" here referred to must have been something BEFORE He became a MAN...or BEFORE He took upon Him the "form" of a Servant [Isaiah 53]...(2)It was something FROM which He humbled Himself by making "Himself of no reputation"; by taking upon Himself "the FORM of a SERVANT";...and by being made "IN the likeness of man." It was something which existed when He had NOT the LIKENESS of men...that is, BEFORE He became INCARNATE...and in that "previous" state of existence it is PROPER to say that He was "in the FORM of God" for He Himself speaks of "...the glory which I had with thee BEFORE the world WAS" [John 17:5].
************************************************
*["...you adapted an erroneous definition of MORPHE..."]
***Nay...tis you who has the erroneous definition...for your definition only defines the EXTERNAL [i.e., carnal or fleshly] spendour of Jesus Christ...but the Scriptures define the "INNER ESSENCE or BEING" that He [MY God and Saviour] "had with the Father BEFORE the world WAS." [John 17:5]. Selah.
Marchello
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
So, once you have been washed in the blood of the lamb, and your sins are forever forgiven, you can loose that forgiveness? Jesus did not state forgiveness as a contract. Please show me were Jesus said you can loose your forgiveness.
* here's a good example...
"I tell you, on the day of judgment men will render account for every careless word they utter;
For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned."
Matthew 12:36-37
* this clears up the unbiblical doctrine of "Once Saved, Always Saved"... on judgment day, men will render account for every word they say, two things will happen, they will be either justified or condemned...
"For it is impossible to restore again to repentance those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit,
And have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come,
If they then commit apostasy, since they crucify the Son of God on their own account and hold him up to contempt."
Hebrews 6:4-6
* this verse from Saint Paul also tells us that forgiveness and salvation can be lost...
"For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them."
II Peter 2:20-21
* it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than AFTER knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them, says Saint Peter...
"Look to yourselves, that you may not lose what you have worked for, but may win a full reward."
II John 8
* here's a very blatant pronouncement from Saint John... forgiven persons can really lose salvation if they are indulged AGAIN to the defilements of the world... 😉
Originally posted by peejayd
* here's a good example..."I tell you, on the day of judgment men will render account for every careless word they utter;
."
[B]For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned
Matthew 12:36-37* this clears up the unbiblical doctrine of "Once Saved, Always Saved"... on judgment day, men will render account for every word they say, two things will happen, they will be either justified or condemned...
"For it is impossible to restore again to repentance those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit,
And have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come,
If they then commit apostasy, since they crucify the Son of God on their own account and hold him up to contempt."
Hebrews 6:4-6* this verse from Saint Paul also tells us that forgiveness and salvation can be lost...
"For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them."
II Peter 2:20-21* it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than AFTER knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them, says Saint Peter...
"Look to yourselves, that you may not lose what you have worked for, but may win a full reward."
II John 8* here's a very blatant pronouncement from Saint John... forgiven persons can really lose salvation if they are indulged AGAIN to the defilements of the world... 😉 [/B]
Wait... I only wanted what Jesus said. I think that was the first one only, is that correct?
[I]"I tell you, on the day of judgment men will render account for every careless word they utter;
I don't see how this has anything to do with once saved always saved.
Please let us constrain our conversation to only the words of Jesus, and not what the other people in the bible had to say. The only credible part of the bible, in my opinion, is the words of Jesus. I do not count anything claimed to be said by Jesus after his death to be the words of Jesus. The words of Jesus are the only part of the bible I will read. If you wish to continue this conversation you must use only the words of Jesus. Do you agree to meat with my over barring restrictions?
Originally posted by Jackie Malfoy
I don't think god or jesus for that matter is a person I just wanted it to be easy for you guys to understand what I am asking.
I think he is a spirt of some kind.But then again he was a person and then he dead came back and is in heaven so now he is a spirt but before I am pretty sure he was a person!I could be wrong however.JM
***Jackie:
Reading the Bible would be a prudent thing to do for it would answer your questions about the person of Jesus Christ...who He was...what He was like...and why He was sent. Too, the best place to start your reading would be the Gospel of John...and then 1 Thessalonians, Romans, Galatians and Ephesians [in that order].
Regards,
Marchello