Darkseid vs Odin

Started by panthergod41 pages

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
He drained the energy to strengthen himself, since he was at very very low power. Thus, all those feats were accomplished by a WEAKENED DARKSEID. Proof is in the feat of him defeating his older self and easily thrashing the Legion.

Panthergod: Still fail. 👇 Superman should [b]NEVER beat a non-jobbing Darkseid. [/B]

This is rabid Fanboy bias, nothing more.

Superman got powerful enough to beat Darkseid--PERIOD.

Darkeid has NEVER been physically unbeatable. Orion, for one, WILL beat him--of yeah, and HAD beaten him HTH.

Darkseid is beyond the conventional top tiephysically , and Superman has proven that he can reach that level himself.

Originally posted by starking
So guess Superman=Skyfather am I right?

You can think whatever you want to.

And the time Ds lost in Bryne's story was retconned into an avatar.

That's a lie.


Going by your logic Superman should beat guy who gave a star system buster and a skyfather level being they're powers.

Since Superman has withstood star systems exploding around him, and Darkseid has NEVER created a Skyfather level being, I'm wonder why this is relvant.

I never said that Superman was as powerful as Darkseid, anywhere.

I said that he is on the same tier physically when he cuts loose and accesses his normally untapped full power.

That's what the comic books show.


Supermans powerful but he shouldn't be beating Darkseid. If he's that powerful then he should be able to take someone on Thanos's level.

And Superman has proven that he can hang with people on that level when he cuts loose.

Originally posted by panthergod
This is rabid Fanboy bias, nothing more.

Superman got powerful enough to beat Darkseid--PERIOD.

Darkeid has NEVER been physically unbeatable. Orion, for one, WILL beat him--of yeah, and HAD beaten him HTH.

Darkseid is beyond the conventional top tiephysically , and Superman has proven that he can reach that level himself.

finally someone else sees this rabib fanboy analysis like i do. hey have to face reality and quit being darkseid fanatics. its not fun to argue with them becuz they se things as they want to see them and discount things thathave happened. its like talking to a wall though. they will never learn.

Originally posted by quanchi112
finally someone else sees this rabib fanboy analysis like i do. hey have to face reality and quit being darkseid fanatics. its not fun to argue with them becuz they se things as they want to see them and discount things thathave happened. its like talking to a wall though. they will never learn.

Except Superman has said that he didn't even think it possible to ever beat DS physically. And as we know with retcons, it keeps proving over and over to be the case.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Except Superman has said that he didn't even think it possible to ever beat DS physically.

But he did.... like 3 times.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
But he did.... like 3 times.

ORLY? I thought DS hurt himself with the OE and basically hurt himself. Another time I remember the source wall doing all the work. I could be wrong tho.

Nvr, you always claim the source did all the work in one of the DS beatings, but you never produce the scan.

The Source is NEVER mentioned in regards to Superman beating Darkseid.

You created this forum myth, to add some kind of coverage for the L's Darkseid took.

Provide the scan, or at least tell us what the scan says, or stop making the claim.

or a issue number

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
ORLY? I thought DS hurt himself with the OE and basically hurt himself. Another time I remember the source wall doing all the work. I could be wrong tho.
could no try saying u hope u are right. u and this darksied brigade. superman has been beating more powrful being s than himself for ages, what makes darksieds loss more unbelievable. nothing it happened. darksied is more powerful but it is not nor has neevr been out of the realm of possibilty of darksied losing to him.

Superman can and has beaten Darkseid, but that's not as much a testament to Darkseid being weak, as it Superman being rediculously powerful once he stops holding back. Other Superman 'league' characters can't even get past henchmen of Darkseids', let alone the main man. Shit, in that Superman/Batman issue, Wonder Woman and Barda got beat down by the Furies. Think of the power gap there. And both of those two are supposedly as tough as Supes is.

Originally posted by Juntai
Superman can and has beaten Darkseid, but that's not as much a testament to Darkseid being weak, as it Superman being rediculously powerful once he stops holding back. Other Superman 'league' characters can't even get past henchmen of Darkseids', let alone the main man. Shit, in that Superman/Batman issue, Wonder Woman and Barda got beat down by the Furies. Think of the power gap there. And both of those two are supposedly as tough as Supes is.
amen. i love that can and HAS BEATEN DARKSEID. i also neevr said darkseid was weak but that superman can and has beaten darkseid so trhey have to accept it and cant disregard it as they try to do.

Originally posted by quanchi112
then why are u debating u are the biggest delusional tard on these forums. u say supes victories dont count but count some bullcrap that happens in the 30th century. sounds pretty convenient for ur case. 🙄 oh thats right u have no case. its just feat after feat whether it is relevant or not to the thread at hand. STARKING LOGIC:
DARKSEID COULD MINDCONTROL U OR WAVE HIS HAND TO WIN THIS BATTLE AGAINST ODIN, I MEAN HELL HE HURT THE SPECTRE. anyone else: didnt batman hurt the spectre also and his showings arent anywhere near consistent.
STARKINGS RESPNSE: HES THE SPECTRE AND DARKSEID IS A PART OF THE SOURCE SO DARKSEID WINS CUZ THE SOURCE IS GREATER THAN THE SPECTRE.
anyone else: uh it seems like u twist things to make darkseid look awesome, what do u say about his superman losses.
STARKINGS RESPONSE🙁WAITS FOR TRICKTSER TO BAIL HIM OUT, THEN REALIZES HES NOT ONLINE) SO HE REALIZES HE MUST BE BRAVE AND ANSWERS ON HIS OWN:THEY DONT COUNT, CUZ JEPH LEOB IS A FAKE WRITER AND HAD A SUPERMAN SHIRT ON UNDERNEATH THE WHOLE TIME WRITING THE COMIC. IT DOESNT COUNT/ NEXT QUESTION(DAMMIT WHERE IS TRICKSTER, HE KNOWS BETTER THAN TO LEAVE ME ALONE ON HERE I GET SCARED.
anyone else :im leaving ur crazy
STARKING: SEE YOU LATER TROLL I WON.

Quanchi, this is harassment of the highest order. If you disagree with him, fine. But do it respectfully, or next time it'll be a formal warning.

Originally posted by quanchi112
then why are u debating u are the biggest delusional tard on these forums. u say supes victories dont count but count some bullcrap that happens in the 30th century. sounds pretty convenient for ur case. 🙄 oh thats right u have no case. its just feat after feat whether it is relevant or not to the thread at hand. STARKING LOGIC:
DARKSEID COULD MINDCONTROL U OR WAVE HIS HAND TO WIN THIS BATTLE AGAINST ODIN, I MEAN HELL HE HURT THE SPECTRE. anyone else: didnt batman hurt the spectre also and his showings arent anywhere near consistent.
STARKINGS RESPNSE: HES THE SPECTRE AND DARKSEID IS A PART OF THE SOURCE SO DARKSEID WINS CUZ THE SOURCE IS GREATER THAN THE SPECTRE.
anyone else: uh it seems like u twist things to make darkseid look awesome, what do u say about his superman losses.
STARKINGS RESPONSE🙁WAITS FOR TRICKTSER TO BAIL HIM OUT, THEN REALIZES HES NOT ONLINE) SO HE REALIZES HE MUST BE BRAVE AND ANSWERS ON HIS OWN:THEY DONT COUNT, CUZ JEPH LEOB IS A FAKE WRITER AND HAD A SUPERMAN SHIRT ON UNDERNEATH THE WHOLE TIME WRITING THE COMIC. IT DOESNT COUNT/ NEXT QUESTION(DAMMIT WHERE IS TRICKSTER, HE KNOWS BETTER THAN TO LEAVE ME ALONE ON HERE I GET SCARED.
anyone else :im leaving ur crazy
STARKING: SEE YOU LATER TROLL I WON.

nutnut

Originally posted by quanchi112
then why are u debating u are the biggest delusional tard on these forums. u say supes victories dont count but count some bullcrap that happens in the 30th century. sounds pretty convenient for ur case. 🙄 oh thats right u have no case. its just feat after feat whether it is relevant or not to the thread at hand. STARKING LOGIC:
DARKSEID COULD MINDCONTROL U OR WAVE HIS HAND TO WIN THIS BATTLE AGAINST ODIN, I MEAN HELL HE HURT THE SPECTRE. anyone else: didnt batman hurt the spectre also and his showings arent anywhere near consistent.
STARKINGS RESPNSE: HES THE SPECTRE AND DARKSEID IS A PART OF THE SOURCE SO DARKSEID WINS CUZ THE SOURCE IS GREATER THAN THE SPECTRE.
anyone else: uh it seems like u twist things to make darkseid look awesome, what do u say about his superman losses.
STARKINGS RESPONSE🙁WAITS FOR TRICKTSER TO BAIL HIM OUT, THEN REALIZES HES NOT ONLINE) SO HE REALIZES HE MUST BE BRAVE AND ANSWERS ON HIS OWN:THEY DONT COUNT, CUZ JEPH LEOB IS A FAKE WRITER AND HAD A SUPERMAN SHIRT ON UNDERNEATH THE WHOLE TIME WRITING THE COMIC. IT DOESNT COUNT/ NEXT QUESTION(DAMMIT WHERE IS TRICKSTER, HE KNOWS BETTER THAN TO LEAVE ME ALONE ON HERE I GET SCARED.
anyone else :im leaving ur crazy
STARKING: SEE YOU LATER TROLL I WON.

Here's proof to why Darkseid's Gds feats are still canon

No Non-canon Sources
"Non-canon sources are invalid for evidence. With rare exceptions, comics not in continuity such as Elseworlds, What Ifs, or alternate universes are not used for evidence in debates of a particular mainstream character."

"A canon source is one that is regarded as being 'in continuity'. In the example of Star Trek; instances from the series and movies can be used, but books are definitely out. Comic book crossovers are usually unusable as they ignore common sense most of the time (DC vs. Marvel is certainly unusable in some cases in our debates!)."

Now notice how it says alternate universes aren't allowed, and particular characters. Well for Darkseid, a retcon such as Zero hour, would only be temporal. Meaning to him, the pre-crisis Legion storys, are merely a alternate history to the 4th world. The terms are quit different. Here's the difinitions.

Alternate history
"Alternate history or alternative history is a subgenre of speculative fiction (or some would say of science fiction) that is set in a world in which history has diverged from history as it is generally known. Alternate history literature asks the question, "What if history had developed differently?" Most works in this genre are based in real historical events, yet feature social, geopolitical, or industrial circumstances that developed differently than our own. While to some extent all fiction can be described as "alternate history," the subgenre proper comprises fiction in which a change or point of divergence occurs in the past that causes human society to develop in a way that is distinct from our own.
Since the 1950s, this type of fiction has to a large extent merged with science fictional tropes involving (a) cross-time, or paratime, travel between alternate histories/universes (or psychic awareness of the existence of "our" universe by the people in another, as in Nabokov and Dick; see below); or (b) ordinary voyaging uptime or downtime that results in history splitting into two or more timelines. Cross-time, time-splitting and alternate history themes have become so closely interwoven that it is impossible to discuss them fully apart from one another. Thus, cross-time and time-splitting stories will be an important part of this article insofar as they portray one or more alternate histories that diverged from a common past."

Parallel universe (fiction)
"Parallel universe or alternate reality in science fiction and fantasy is a self-contained separate reality coexisting with our own. A specific group of parallel universes is called a multiverse, although this term can also be used to describe all the parallel universes that comprise physical reality. While the terms "parallel universe" and "alternate reality" are generally synonymous and can be used interchangeably in most cases, there is sometimes an additional connotation implied with the term "alternate reality" that implies that the reality is a variant of our own. The term "parallel universe" is more general, without any connotations implying a relationship (or lack thereof) with our own universe.
Introduction
Fantasy has long borrowed the idea of “another world” from myth, legend and religion. Heaven, Hell, Olympus, Valhalla are all “alternate universes” different from the familiar material realm. Modern fantasy often presents the concept as a series of planes of existence where the laws of nature differ, allowing magical phenomena of some sort on some planes. This concept was also found in ancient Hindu mythology, in texts such as the Puranas, which expressed an infinite number of universes, each with its own gods.[1] In other cases, in both fantasy and science fiction, a parallel universe is a single other material reality, and its co-existence with ours is a rationale to bring a protagonist from the author's reality into the fantasy's reality, such as in The Chronicles of Narnia by C.S. Lewis or even the beyond-the-reflection travel in the two main works of Lewis Carroll. Or this single other reality can invade our own, as when Margaret Cavendish's English heroine sends submarines and "birdmen" armed with "fire stones" back through the portal from the Blazing World to Earth and wreaks havoc on England's enemies. In dark fantasy or horror the parallel world is often a hiding place for unpleasant things, and often the protagonist is forced to confront effects of this other world leaking into his own, as in most of the work of H.P. Lovecraft and the Doom computer game series. In such stories, the nature of this other reality is often left mysterious, known only by its effect on our own world." from wikipedia

As you can see both difinitions are quit different. People can argue over it, all they want, but it's just a matter of common sense. A alternate timeline, has nothing to do with a alternate universe. An alternate universe is an actual reality itself. A alternate timeline, can actually be apart of history. And to panthergod, you still fail. Darkseid gave Stayne her powers. She is equal to Takion, whose Highfather's replacement. No need to argue with you any further.

edit

Originally posted by starking
As you can see both difinitions are quit different. People can argue over it, all they want, but it's just a matter of common sense. A alternate timeline, has nothing to do with a alternate universe. An alternate universe is an actual reality itself. A alternate timeline, can actually be apart of history. And to panthergod, you still fail. Darkseid gave Stayne her powers. She is equal to Takion, whose Highfather's replacement. No need to argue with you any further.

What are you talking about none of that proves anything. I don't care how different the definitions are because the fact of the matter is that the GDS NEVER really happened, and the entire freakin series is invalid to current DS's character. If he does it a couple thousand years from now that's fine, but he hasn't done it yet so it's inadmissible under forum rules because the story takes place around someone other than his CURRENT character.

Originally posted by darthgoober
What are you talking about none of that proves anything. I don't care how different the definitions are because the fact of the matter is that the GDS NEVER really happened, and the entire freakin series is invalid to current DS's character. If he does it a couple thousand years from now that's fine, but he hasn't done it yet so it's inadmissible under forum rules because the story takes place around someone other than his CURRENT character.
You are so wrong, that I don't even know where to start. Losh stories were apart of the normal Dc continuity. Do you get it? Current Darkseid has owned himself in the future already. That means Darkseid of this era>Gds Darkseid. See the reason your wrong is because, no where in the rules does it say alternate history is not allowed. He doesn't have to perform the feats in the current Dc, because performed the feats IN A ALTERNATE TIMELINE, which has no effect on a characters feats. If it was a alternate universe, then yes, you would be correct. But were talking about to different things entirely. Like I said no where in the rules, did it say alternate timelines are not allowed.

Originally posted by Juntai
Superman can and has beaten Darkseid, but that's not as much a testament to Darkseid being weak, as it Superman being rediculously powerful once he stops holding back. Other Superman 'league' characters can't even get past henchmen of Darkseids', let alone the main man. Shit, in that Superman/Batman issue, Wonder Woman and Barda got beat down by the Furies. Think of the power gap there. And both of those two are supposedly as tough as Supes is.

It's a double edged sword Jun.

On one hand, you've got Superman, the most lauded superhero in comicdom, with the feats ambigous tho they may be to back it up.

But he's still a superhero, the lowest of the low on the power totem most of the time.

And then you've got Darkseid, cosmic god and feared throughout the galaxy, with a weapon that's supposed to be the darkside of the source, blah blah blah.

I don't care how many big ups Superman gets, at the end of the day, to have him beat the shit out of Darkseid only hurts Darkseid.

The character of Darkseid isn't the type to get physically embarassed, and still retain dignity.

It goes against the air of inherent superiority he possesses, to say i'm feared throughout the universe, but that guy in spandex has beaten my ass three times.

Counterproductive to the character stance.

It can't be the best of both worlds to have Superman beat up Darkseid, AND still have Uxas retain dignity.

Either or.

Darkseid isn't as powerful as he once was, or Superman jobbed him the heck out.

Either way, he doesn't compare to Odin who creates galaxies.

So what is it Jun?

Originally posted by starking
You are so wrong, that I don't even know where to start. Losh stories were apart of the normal Dc continuity. Do you get it? Current Darkseid has owned himself in the future already. That means Darkseid of this era>Gds Darkseid. See the reason your wrong is because, no where in the rules does it say alternate history is not allowed. He doesn't have to perform the feats in the current Dc, because performed the feats IN A ALTERNATE TIMELINE, which has no effect on a characters feats. If it was a alternate universe, then yes, you would be correct. But were talking about to different things entirely. Like I said no where in the rules, did it say alternate timelines are not allowed.

Well we're in luck, because I decided to save the both of us a lot of time and ask Digi whether or not the GDS would fall under the category of invalid under forum rules. And do you know what, IT DOES. It happened in an alternate future and NOT to the CURRENT version of the character, so the feats can't be used. Period.